Why do Atheists Debate Religion?

[LuisDantas]

How so?

You seem to be aware that religion does not imply belief in deities - if for no other reason, because Quintessence and me both reminded you and you sort-of-accepted it - yet you insist on taking a specific dictionary definition over the known fact.

You might as well insist that matches are competitions, even when they are used to light fire at a hearth.

 

[Bunyip]

Because you seem to be saying that atheistic religions are somehow not religions

Correct. Yes atheistic religions are not religions under the same definition of the word used in the context of faith/theism.

merely because some definitions of religion would exclude them. That's silly.

It is not silly, it is just how the English langiage works.

And honestly, the dictionary is a poor resource to use for understanding the depth and breadth of what religion is anyway... or any complex topic, for that matter, from economics to psychology.

Sure, dictionaries reflect usage - I was not appealing to the dictionary as an authority.

Overall, I just don't get what you're going on about. We're not communicating, apparently.

Seems pretty simple to me - religion as it is defined in this context refers specifically to belief in a higher power. Do you want me to explain what 'equivocation' means and why it is relevant in these situations?

 

[LuisDantas]

The question is then why you insist on using a definition that you know to be no good.

 

[Bunyip]

You seem to be aware that religion does not imply belief in deities - if for no other reason, because Quintessence and me both reminded you and you sort-of-accepted it - yet you insist on taking a specific dictionary definition over the known fact.

On the contrary, I have made it very clear thar religion DOES imply belief in deities as the word is commonly used in this context. As demonstrated by examining dictionary definitions.

You might as well insist that matches are competitions, even when they are used to light fire at a hearth.

Sorry, but you have hold of the wrong end of the stick - I was correcting an equivocation fallacy, not commiting one.

 

[Bunyip]

The question is then why you insist on using a definition that you know to be no good.

I don't. I prefer to use the definition appropriate to a given context - a common and advisable practice.

 

[LuisDantas]

Sorry, but you have hold of the wrong end of the stick - I was correcting an equivocation fallacy, not commiting one.

Uh, no. You are indeed commiting one, although I don't really understand why.

 

[Quintessence]

The irony is, at no point did I ever say theistic religions and atheistic religions are necessarily equivalents.

Much ado about nothing.

 

[LuisDantas]

I don't. I prefer to use the definition appropriate to a given context - a common and advisable practice.

Yet you are doing the opposite. Why?

 

[Bunyip]

Yet you are doing the opposite. Why?

In what way am I doing so?

What I am saying is perfectly clear and sound - I honestly don't get what it is you are failing to grasp.

The word 'religion' has a meaning specific to this context, and that meaning refers specifically to belief in a supreme power.

 

[Desert Snake]

In what way am I doing so?

What I am saying is perfectly clear and sound - I honestly don't get what it is you are failing to grasp.

The word 'religion' has a meaning specific to this context, and that meaning refers specifically to belief in a supreme power.

No it doesn't. Sheesh.

 

[LuisDantas]

In what way am I doing so?

What I am saying is perfectly clear and sound - I honestly don't get what it is you are failing to grasp.

The word 'religion' has a meaning specific to this context, and that meaning refers specifically to belief in a supreme power.

And which context would that be? A meaningful one, perhaps? Or a cherry-picked dictionary definition that does not really have any value?

 

[Quintessence]

I must have missed the memo where the OP explicitly stated "for the purposes of this discussion, we will operationally define religion as systems of belief that require a belief in god(s)." Because then what Bunyip is going on about might make some sort of sense to me. Else wise, I'm just really freaking confused. Which doesn't happen very often, so.. congrats, I guess?

 

[Bunyip]

And which context would that be? A meaningful one, perhaps? Or a cherry-picked dictionary definition that does not really have any value?

I have stated that several times.

Religion has a meaning specific to the context of Atheism and religion - that being the topic.

This meaning is generally the first of several alternates listed in the dictionary.

Dictionaries relfect usage, and so it follows that in common usage and in this context the meaning of the word religion specifically refers to a belief in a higher power.

Whatever it is you find so baffling/confronting/offensive or whatever about this I honestly do no see.

Christianity is a religion. For some people sport is a religion - but these are two different meanings of the word 'religion'.

 

[Bunyip]

I must have missed the memo where the OP explicitly stated "for the purposes of this discussion, we will operationally define religion as systems of belief that require a belief in god(s)." Because then what Bunyip is going on about might make some sort of sense to me. Else wise, I'm just really freaking confused. Which doesn't happen very often, so.. congrats, I guess?

This is a simple point, no need to lose your cool.

I would think that it is clearly the case that the OP here is specifically looking at religion in the context of a religious debate. That seems a no brainer.

The OP is asking why atheists debate religion - It is clearly not referring to the secular meaning of the word, nobody is being asked why they feel so strongly about football.

That the OP is specifically referring to 'religion' in the context of atheism and theism is something nobody would have thought you needed a memo in order to understand.

 

[Quintessence]

Christianity is a religion. For some people sport is a religion - but these are two different meanings of the word 'religion'.

Sir, nobody here has been stating otherwise! Again, much ado about nothing. :slap:

 

[LuisDantas]

I have stated that several times.

Either I missed them all, or I did not recognize them as making actual sense, sorry.

Religion has a meaning specific to the context of Atheism and religion - that being the topic.

If it has, you are grossly misrepresenting it, to satirical levels in fact.

 

[Bunyip]

Sir, nobody here has been stating otherwise! Again, much ado about nothing. :slap:

Other than Luis apparently. Who seems to doubt that.

 

[Desert Snake]

Again, much ado about nothing.

It is something. Much of my belief is non-theistic, he is grossly misrepresenting the term 'religious' & 'religion' to suit his own arguments.

 

[Bunyip]

Either I missed them all, or I did not recognize them as making actual sense, sorry.



If it has, you are grossly misrepresenting it, to satirical levels in fact.

So religion has different meanings in different contexts correct?

The context here is why atheists debate religion correct?

In this context the meaning of the word 'religion' does in fact refer specifically to belief in a supreme power.

 

[LuisDantas]

Other than Luis apparently. Who seems to doubt that.

Nope, I agree with Quintessence. There is some sort of grave misunderstanding happening here.