Why do so many need a god ?.

[Thana]

Becoming a non-believer is "giving up on God"?

Not by my understanding of "to give up".

To give up - to desist from : abandon

I'm not sure what definition you're using though....

 

[LuisDantas]

That is the one.

As I said, that is hardly what becoming a non-believer entails.

 

[rusra02]

I myself don't need a god, I am happy with my own life, but I find it hard to realize that many are not happy unless they have a god in their life, what's the big deal about having a god in our life. So I suppose I am asking those who need a god in their life, to share why they do need this god, I am honestly confused to why we need a god.

I believe the true God created us with a spiritual need or hunger. (Matthew 5:3) That is why all of us give devotion to something: a god or gods, money, pleasure, sports, etc. Of course, such misdirected devotion is greatly harmful, IMO. (1 Corinthians 10:20)

 

[Thana]

That is the one.

As I said, that is hardly what becoming a non-believer entails.

So you're saying when a believer becomes a non-believer they don't desist from believing?
I'm not sure what you're trying to prove...?

 

[LuisDantas]

So you're saying when a believer becomes a non-believer they don't desist from believing?
I'm not sure what you're trying to prove...?

I am not trying to prove anything. I am just pointing out that you are using odd, unsuitable words to describe losing belief.

"Giving up on God" implies having a choice and a clear relationship with God.

That just strikes me as odd. I doubt it happens often, if at all, when one decides to describe himself as a non-believer.

 

[Thana]

I am not trying to prove anything. I am just pointing out that you are using odd, unsuitable words to describe losing belief.

"Giving up on God" implies having a choice and a clear relationship with God.

That just strikes me as odd. I doubt it happens often, if at all, when one decides to describe himself as a non-believer.

When you say 'losing belief' it sounds odd to me, Because it's not like you dropped it somewhere. It didn't fall away from you, you fell away from it.

So I think the words I chose were appropriate.

 

[LuisDantas]

When you say 'losing belief' it sounds odd to me, Because it's not like you dropped it somewhere. It didn't fall away from you, you fell away from it.

Maybe I never had belief, that is arguable. But if I did have it, it did indeed fall away from me on its own. Even describing it like that makes it appear more significant than it deserves.

I figure my experience is not all that unusual, either.

So I think the words I chose were appropriate.

If you say so.

 

[Thana]

Maybe I never had belief, that is arguable. But if I did have it, it did indeed fall away from me on its own. Even describing it like that makes it appear more significant than it deserves.

I figure my experience is not all that unusual, either.

How does a concept do anything on it's own? It can't even be conceived of on it's own so I don't see how it can fall away on it's own.

 

[LuisDantas]

You are probably right. I guess it is too much to say I was ever a believer.

 

[Demonslayer]

When you say 'losing belief' it sounds odd to me, Because it's not like you dropped it somewhere. It didn't fall away from you, you fell away from it.

So I think the words I chose were appropriate.

I know people don't like the over used Santa Claus example, but did you "give up on Santa?" Sounds too emotionally charged, doesn't it? I think that's what LD is trying to say here. Isn't it true that one day...or more perhaps more accurately...gradually you came to an understanding that Santa was simply an idea, not an actual being who lived at the North Pole?

When religious people say atheists "Gave up on God" it puts an emotional spin on it. It makes it sound like a rejection, an intentional divorce, something the atheist "did." They "gave up," as if they had any choice, like they could have just stuck with it and believed again if only they didn't throw in the towel.

It's not like that. It's not a rejection. I have no more power or ability to make myself believe in God than an adult does to believe in Santa again in the same robust way we did when we were 6 years old.

 

[Thana]

You are probably right. I guess it is too much to say I was ever a believer.

Well.. I mean I wouldn't say that, And only you can know that for sure.
Honestly I thought we were just debating semantics here, not anything deeper... I hope I haven't said anything to discourage you.

 

[LuisDantas]

Well.. I mean I wouldn't say that, And only you can know that for sure.
Honestly I thought we were just debating semantics here, not anything deeper... I hope I haven't said anything to discourage you.

No, that horse was born dead, so no worries. Nor are my feelings in any danger.

I honestly think you are holding an unrealistic idea of what becoming a non-believer is, that is all.

 

[Thana]

I know people don't like the over used Santa Claus example, but did you "give up on Santa?" Sounds too emotionally charged, doesn't it? I think that's what LD is trying to say here. Isn't it true that one day...or more perhaps more accurately...gradually you came to an understanding that Santa was simply an idea, not an actual being who lived at the North Pole?

When religious people say atheists "Gave up on God" it puts an emotional spin on it. It makes it sound like a rejection, an intentional divorce, something the atheist "did." They "gave up," as if they had any choice, like they could have just stuck with it and believed again if only they didn't throw in the towel.

It's not like that. It's not a rejection. I have no more power or ability to make myself believe in God than an adult does to believe in Santa again in the same robust way we did when we were 6 years old.

It should be emotional, though. The question of whether or not God/s exists is kind of.. well monumentally important, and whether you believe in Him or not is life altering either which way. So yeah, I think the Santa example isn't really adequate.

And faith is exactly that, it's not throwing in the towel. That is what it is. Faith is the continued struggle, and when you struggle with something and then stop struggling, It's because you gave up.

 

[Demonslayer]

It should be emotional, though. The question of whether or not God/s exists is kind of.. well monumentally important, and whether you believe in Him or not is life altering either which way.

But it isn't emotional for a lot of us, and you can't make something emotional if it's not, simply because others say it is.

Consider sports fandom. Some sports fans become incredibly emotional, weeping over losses and rejoicing over wins. Others couldn't care less.

Neither my belief nor my slow fade into disbelief altered my life in any significant way. When I was a child and my parents told me about God, I believed. My experiences over time caused me to look around and think "yeeeeah, probably not." Nothing changed, I didn't change who I am or how I act, and there was nothing emotional about it except perhaps relief that no one was burning in hell for eternity.

And faith is exactly that, it's not throwing in the towel. That is what it is. Faith is the continued struggle, and when you struggle with something and then stop struggling, It's because you gave up.

So why didn't you continue to struggle to believe in Santa Claus? Why did you throw in the towel, and...considering Santa really IS a very nice idea...why don't you pick up the torch again and start believing?

 

[LuisDantas]

@Thana

Do you think I am in pain - secretly or otherwise - due to my disbelief?

I hope I did not encourage such a mistake.

 

[Demonslayer]

It should be emotional, though. The question of whether or not God/s exists is kind of.. well monumentally important, and whether you believe in Him or not is life altering either which way. So yeah, I think the Santa example isn't really adequate.

For believers, the question of God is extremely emotional and life altering. And I find a lot of believers have a hard time understanding how trivial and unimportant it feels to a non-believer.

I was far more upset about Santa, actually. I cried when I told my parents I didn't think Santa was real, and they sat me down and told me I was right. In contrast, by the time I finally allowed my disbelief in God to take hold I felt nothing but relief. Most of the things the adults were telling me about God made no sense, made me sad and uncomfortable. Letting go of all of that was wonderful, easy and natural.

And faith is exactly that, it's not throwing in the towel. That is what it is. Faith is the continued struggle, and when you struggle with something and then stop struggling, It's because you gave up.

Question for you Thana...do you struggle to believe? Is there something natural in you that is trying to tell you there is no such thing as God, and each day it's a struggle to ignore that voice and continue to believe in a heavenly presence?

Because that I can never understand. Many people tell me they look around at the world and they simply can't believe it's all here without something divine having created it. They can no more disbelieve than I can believe...their view of the world makes belief not only easy, but sensible and natural to them. For those folks, I guess I can understand their belief. But to have a natural disbelief and have to actively fight to maintain belief? That doesn't make much sense to me.

Why wouldn't we do that with other things we naturally don't believe in? Why not struggle to believe in Fairy Godmother, or a kindly imaginary friend?

 

[allfoak]

So why didn't you continue to struggle to believe in Santa Claus? Why did you throw in the towel, and...considering Santa really IS a very nice idea...why don't you pick up the torch again and start believing?

That is an interesting idea.
Why is it that people give up on Santa Clause and not their christian God?

I got my start as a christian more than 30yrs ago.
I have no regrets, and i do not judge those who taught me.
I have since moved on to a more mature knowledge of God and am able to better substantiate what was once nothing but belief.

Perhaps we give up on Santa because our culture teaches us to do so.
We do not study the old nursery rhymes and fables either because we see them as childish perhaps.
The truth is, these stories were written as allegory and have a great deal of spiritual insight to offer those who take the time to study them.
A study of Santa Clause will lead to a knowledge of the eternal soul of man.

Seems kind of silly to take the time to study the story of Santa Clause because we have been taught to think of him as make believe like Peter Pan.
Santa Clause was originally created to be a tool of learning for children and adults alike.
Many of the old stories, legends and myths were written as allegory or the language of the soul, for the purpose of passing on knowledge to those able to receive it.

It is easy to hold a belief in the christian god without ever having to mature in one's belief because there are so many that insist that belief is all that is necessary.
If you begin to say anything to the contrary you become an enemy of the christian god.
Since the reward for this belief is put off until one dies, it becomes the perfect tool of control.

Try and hang on to a belief in santa clause and you will be ridiculed.
Unless it is in line with our cultural celebration it is seen as foolishness.

If we take the time to go beyond mere belief and begin acting on what we say we believe, it is then that we begin to experience our beliefs as true or false.
There is no other way to prove our beliefs other than to live them.
If we will live out our beliefs we will begin to know whether what we believe is the truth rather than just believe it to be true.
As we do this we begin to understand that the search for the truth is actually a search for the God within.
So many need God because God is all and in all.
As individuals having our own individual consciousness we get to experience this rather than just having to believe it to be true.

 

[buddhist]

Like I said,, it is in the Sabbath Commandment, that we find God is the Creator, that He his jurisdiction is both heaven and earth. those who honor the Sabbath Commandment receive the Seal of God.

Once you understand what the Seal of God is,, you can then understand what the Mark of the Beast is.

I showed you a comparison between a state seal and God's seal. if you can't make the connection,, not much more I can do to help you.

OK, then I can say that the weekly uposatha as found in Buddhism is the "Seal of Buddha," right? It shows his and the Dhamma's jurisdiction over both nibbana and samsara. Those who honor the uposatha receive the Seal of Buddha.

 

[Mr. Beebe]

OK, then I can say that the weekly uposatha as found in Buddhism is the "Seal of Buddha," right? It shows his and the Dhamma's jurisdiction over both nibbana and samsara. Those who honor the uposatha receive the Seal of Buddha.

Go for it,, does Buddha claim he created the heavens and the earth and all the life there-in?

 

[buddhist]

Go for it,, does Buddha claim he created the heavens and the earth and all the life there-in?

The Buddhist concept of creation and creator is radically different than how those words are defined in Christianity and most other religions.