Why do some atheists have to be so insulting and mean?

[9-10ths_Penguin]

No, as I said in more than one post on this thread, I do not generalize from one atheist to all atheists, not anymore than I generalize from one believer to all believers...

Except you did generalize. No, not to every single atheist, but you generalized to a larger trend.

To be clear, atheists can be as moral as believers. The only difference is atheists have no God to answer to so "some" atheists are immoral. However, some believers are also immoral even though they know there is a God to answer to.... It is a mixed bag.

Atheists also have no gods to forgive them. If we hurt someone and want to make it right, we have to do it ourselves. No god is going to excuse us from fixing our own mistakes.

 

[Audie]

Clearly for some, not all, atheists, they despise people on an intellectual basis while not showing the love of Christ, if you follow me...

Do they do this because they are atheists?

 

[Truly Enlightened]

None of that is about or calls for being "insulting or mean" to believers.

In the event- it is said anyway-, that the whole post
was just about one jerk, who was also a self proclaimed
'atheist" tho he sounds more like a recovering Christian
who is botching the job.

It doesnt have a freakin' thing to do with "science".

In the world I live in, there will always be mean, insulting, and cowardly people. There will be those who love to dish out subtle insults and innuendos, and then run for help whenever they themselves feel denigrated. We are all humans, and no one is perfect no matter what mask we choose to wear on the day. Being rude, and insulting, is an expression of anger(aggressiveness or passive aggressiveness), frustration, and dislike. It is the honest part of the human condition when it is unsuppressed. Understanding why some people become insulting or rude to believers, is the first step towards re-evaluating certain religious methods and practices. I think you implied to a poster that he may be the cause of his own abuse. Maybe Jehovah Witnesses, evangelists, mormons, should ring first, before they drop in? Or maybe proselytizing, preaching in the subway or on a street corner, can be as annoying as dogs barking. I know you may have the patience of a monk, or can control your human emotions, but many others do not share that gift. So to survive in society, all skills and attributes(good or bad) are necessary under certain conditions. And there is always an excuse to be mean and insulting, just ask anyone who is.

Whether the post was about one silly deluded jerk or not is irrelevant. Whether he is a self-proclaimed Atheist, or a recovering Christian is also irrelevant. My understanding of the OP was that it was about behavior, and possibly the character of Atheists. What exactly has nothing to do with science? You mean like Evolution is just a theory? Or, 10,000 yo earth, the Great Flood, or a thousand other freakin' examples?

So was there an issue with anything that I said, or any examples I mentioned? Was there some other agenda, or were you just editorializing in the didactic?

 

[Audie]

In the world I live in, there will always be mean, insulting, and cowardly people. There will be those who love to dish out subtle insults and innuendos, and then run for help whenever they themselves feel denigrated. We are all humans, and no one is perfect no matter what mask we choose to wear on the day. Being rude, and insulting, is an expression of anger(aggressiveness or passive aggressiveness), frustration, and dislike. It is the honest part of the human condition when it is unsuppressed. Understanding why some people become insulting or rude to believers, is the first step towards re-evaluating certain religious methods and practices. I think you implied to a poster that he may be the cause of his own abuse. Maybe Jehovah Witnesses, evangelists, mormons, should ring first, before they drop in? Or maybe proselytizing, preaching in the subway or on a street corner, can be as annoying as dogs barking. I know you may have the patience of a monk, or can control your human emotions, but many others do not share that gift. So to survive in society, all skills and attributes(good or bad) are necessary under certain conditions. And there is always an excuse to be mean and insulting, just ask anyone who is.

Whether the post was about one silly deluded jerk or not is irrelevant. Whether he is a self-proclaimed Atheist, or a recovering Christian is also irrelevant. My understanding of the OP was that it was about behavior, and possibly the character of Atheists. What exactly has nothing to do with science? You mean like Evolution is just a theory? Or, 10,000 yo earth, the Great Flood, or a thousand other freakin' examples?

So was there an issue with anything that I said, or any examples I mentioned? Was there some other agenda, or were you just editorializing in the didactic?

Re first in bold
I did nothing of the sort.

Re second in bold.
The author has been at great pains to clarify that it is only about one person. I pointed that out here, but
still the point is lost.

So two false assertions about others.

Re the rest, whatevs. But try to control the personal remarks.

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

. This is one of the most important things that Jesus was sent to earth for, to teach the way to Salvation.

Yes, Jesus ... not us.

Jesus taught the Golden Rule; do to people as you want them to do to you, Matthew 7:12.

Do you want to be evangelized by other religions?

Now, if you know something that would save the life of your neighbor, would it show love, if you just kept quiet and let him die, while you are saved but what you know, or would that be doing to your neighbor what you would want him to do to you?

Nursing story: Had to run in on a rapid response (person was not dead yet but going that way). The patient couldn't breathe and had a tracheotomy. His loving family had given him a hamburger and the onion bits got lodged in his clearly vulnerable throat. Their love nearly killed the guy and we were mad it was illegal to kill THEM. That is how evangelism seems to some: you are making the situation worse by "helping".

Nurses also get mad when families are "nice" to their diabetic relatives in a hospital and give them cake.

The teaching is not a suggestion, it is an order, 1Timothy 4:10-16, 2Timoth 4:1-5.

Jesus thought his apostles didn't understand him. Why would you let yourself be taught by the students who failed the class?

All Christians are told that we must follow Jesus’ footsteps 1Peter 2:21.

Now, Peter's the one Jesus specifically called "Satan", right?

 

[12jtartar]

And there you have it..... full circle, if you will, why some atheists seem to be so mean...

I mean, it doesn't get any more insulting, than to judge a person after they have died. And to assume that they will be tortured (or simply be judged) by some beast-god, for all of eternity, simply because of a failure to believe in said god, due to a complete lack of rational evidence.

*sigh*

Bob the Unbeliever,
Many Atheists have changed their mind about God when they have come to understand Him more fully. I have read of several Atheists scientists who have become believers in a God because of the enormous amount of information contained in our DNA. When they realized that all this information is actually written in our DNA, and written in a way that man is now beginning to be able to read what is written. They say there has to be a God to do this.
Others have become believers when they have learned that God Does NOT torture people FOREVER, because of sins that they committed during their SHORT life time.
Much of the reason for this misconception is the translations that change the Greek word Hades to Hell, and then teach that in hell you will be tormented forever.
The term Hades, in Greek, is the same meaning of the word Sheol, in Hebrew, Psalms 16:10,Acts 2:27,31, which has no thought of torture, but REST. Another point, do you believe that if Hades was a place of torment, that God would have allowed His Perfect son to go there, as He did, Acts 2:27,31.
Job, when he was suffering from boils from head to foot, asked God to let him go to Sheol to get out of his misery Job 14:13. Much of the reason for misunderstanding is because people do not understand exactly what Death is. At death a person ceases to exist, he knows nothing, feels nothing, Ecclesiastes 9:5:6,10, Psalms 146:3,4. As far as death itself, man is no different than animals, Ecclesiasties 3:18-20. If a person just does not want to live by God’s rules, he will go into everlasting Death, not everlasting torment, because a dead person feels nothing, their punishment is everlasting death, 2Thessalonians 1:6-9. The word Torment, has its roots in being separated, as a person is separated from all he loves when in prison. Because of this the ones who were Jailers were called Tormentors, as recorded in some Bibles, in the first century, Matthew 18:34. The word torment is used several times in Revelation, and here it has to do with being cut off from, or separated from, life and God.
Remember no one can be tormented, when they are dead. The dead feel nothing and know nothing!

 

[Audie]

If you were consistent, you would at least be inconsistent. Try reading your own post #984, "Zero Probability of Evolution. Atheism is wrong". Do sentences like "What you say and how you say it is totally on you, and if you get beat up for misreading your audience you've only yourself to blame." Or, "You act like the so-innocent victim or(?) all this nastiness you say you get", or "It is just cause and effect. You call n word, you will get it, and there is absolutely nobody responsible but yourself." So, unless I have the comprehension skills of a 3yo, the meaning of your post was crystal. Would you like me to list many more examples of your level of arrogance, and condescending insensitivity when responding to other Believers? There is a word that can truly describes this apparent change of attitude. So, NO, my assertion about you was not about others, it was justifiably about you. I am looking forward to reading your new form of verbal gymnastics.

Secondly, the only thing the author stated in his OP remotely supporting your assertion, was "I am not referring to any atheists in this forum", not "I am not referring to any atheists in general". Nothing to indicate that he was only speaking about one Atheist in particular. His opening statement should have given you a clue, "Why do SOME Atheists have to be so insulting and mean?". Maybe you can point out any statement in the opening posts that would indicate that the author was speaking only about "one jerk"? Or, were you just making another false assertion? Let me make this simple for you. The OP contains 10 sentences. Which sentences support your assertion that the, "author has been at great pains to clarify that it is only about one person"? You can even number the sentences starting with the first, and just give me the numbers, since you also assert that I have missed some imaginary point you've made.

Therefore, there are no false assertions about the author's meaning or your hypocrisy(not others). Instead of simply dismissing your actions with "whatevs", you should truly try practice what you preach, and take your own advice. Or should I provide a list of your personal attacks, starting with just the attacks on myself? Although there are many, many differences between us, I will never ask others to fight my battles(unless I lack the expertise, or the backbone), and I will always admit whenever I am rude, insulting, or wrong.

Now to be fair, I only read the opening post. The author may have clarified his views in future posts. I have not seen this so far. Maybe you can also point them out? What do you think?

Ah so desu ka, you were referring to some other thread, some other topic, ie, some complete irrelevancy. Try this sometime: Hold in mind when someone says "It is a nice day." Then when it is raining,pounce! Aha! Then call them a liar.

Same idea, should work terrif!

In this thread, I didnt suggest that it was the authors fault.

In the other, a person who keeps getting attacked for public speaking is making some mistake, and not learning from it. It is nor normal for people to get attacked for
saying normal things.. you know?


I have not seen this so far. Maybe you can also point them out? What do you think?

What do I think? Among other things, I think you demonstrate a complete failure of due diligence, and then want me to do your research for you.

Now to be fair, I only read the opening post.

You only read t he opening post. Didnt bother to read any more. News of the obvious!

To actually be fair though, you should have read more. The author is, just as I said, at pains to clarify! It would have taken less time to get it right than to write that screed amplifying your mistake.

Therefore, there are no false assertions about the author's meaning

"Therefore" being based on a false premise, we find you've made two more false assertions just in this, one about me, one about the author.

In "The Devil's Advocate", Satan says that vanity is his favourite vice.

Of course, to an attorney, laziness in regard to due diligence is a big fav.
It gets people into so much difficulty.

 

[Audie]

Bob the Unbeliever,
Many Atheists have changed their mind about God when they have come to understand Him more fully. I have read of several Atheists scientists who have become believers in a God because of the enormous amount of information contained in our DNA.

Could be. We hear of this. Examples?

Of course, lo and full many a Christian has looked at
the bible-story, and decided it was ridiculous, and so become
a revovering Christian.

What significance should we attach to either of these?

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

Bob the Unbeliever,
Many Atheists have changed their mind about God when they have come to understand Him more fully. I have read of several Atheists scientists who have become believers in a God because of the enormous amount of information contained in our DNA. When they realized that all this information is actually written in our DNA, and written in a way that man is now beginning to be able to read what is written. They say there has to be a God to do this.

They were not actually atheists in the formal sense-- simple True Believers who didn't follow a particular religion.

You have exactly as much evidence for your "many athiests" as you do for your god: none.

Others have become believers when they have learned that God Does NOT torture people FOREVER, because of sins that they committed during their SHORT life time.

Oh, so it's just FINE to be a beast-god who has to use torture to get and keep followers, so long as it isn't INFINITE? Just a really long time?

This helps.... HOW? Your god is still EVIL for using TORTURE. Only terrorists use torture!

Much of the reason for this misconception is the translations that change the Greek word Hades to Hell, and then teach that in hell you will be tormented forever.
The term Hades, in Greek, is the same meaning of the word Sheol, in Hebrew, Psalms 16:10,Acts 2:27,31, which has no thought of torture, but REST. Another point, do you believe that if Hades was a place of torment, that God would have allowed His Perfect son to go there, as He did, Acts 2:27,31.

There are a great many arguments as to which Spiderman is the Real One-- does he shoot webbing from his body? Or does he have to wear a clever gadget that shoots webbing?

Your argument over the use of TORTURE has as much meaning as arguing over which kind of webbing Spiderman uses....!

Seriously?

Job, when he was suffering from boils from head to foot, asked God to let him go to Sheol to get out of his misery Job 14:13. Much of the reason for misunderstanding is because people do not understand exactly what Death is. At death a person ceases to exist, he knows nothing, feels nothing, Ecclesiastes 9:5:6,10, Psalms 146:3,4. As far as death itself, man is no different than animals, Ecclesiasties 3:18-20. If a person just does not want to live by God’s rules, he will go into everlasting Death, not everlasting torment, because a dead person feels nothing, their punishment is everlasting death, 2Thessalonians 1:6-9. The word Torment, has its roots in being separated, as a person is separated from all he loves when in prison. Because of this the ones who were Jailers were called Tormentors, as recorded in some Bibles, in the first century, Matthew 18:34. The word torment is used several times in Revelation, and here it has to do with being cut off from, or separated from, life and God.

Job? He was TORTURED based on a BET! Seriously? Your god was willing to TORTURE poor old Job, and MURDER HIS FAMILY TOO, just to satisfy a BET?

What kind of evil, horrid beast-god do you BELIEVE In?

Remember no one can be tormented, when they are dead. The dead feel nothing and know nothing!

So you do NOT believe the words of your own Jesus? When he kept harping it was better to enter Paradise minus an eye, or hand, than to suffer ENDLESSLY in Eternal Torment?

Wow....! That's..... Interesting. You know more than Jesus did.... that must be a heady experience!

 

[Guy Threepwood]

Why do some atheists have to be so insulting and mean? I am a believer and I do not ever insult atheists; in fact I tell them their lack of belief is just as rational as my beliefs since nobody can prove there is a God. I never threaten them with hell because I do not even believe in hell.

But I constantly have to defend myself from being call brainwashed and stupid and having dumb arguments, just because I believe in God and have a religion that is different from Christianity, a religion they do not know how to refute. Nobody deserves to be treated this way.

If atheists want to say they need no God for morality then some of them are not doing a very good job of demonstrating that with their air of superiority, arrogance, and rude behavior, not to mention dishonesty, lack of self-awareness and unjust treatment of others.

I am not referring to any atheists in this forum. They have been more than civil and respectful and kind.

I am being called stupid but I am not stupid. I went to college for over 15 years and I have several degrees, two advanced. But I am called stupid because my degrees are not in science subjects, because I do not know a lot about history. So what? What is more important, how much one knows or how they treat their fellow man?

Speaking as an ex atheist, I was every bit as patronizing and mean as many atheists here.

And I agree, from the other side, I just don't feel that same disdain.

So it's not that I am an angelic person now who is above being mean, I think there is something inherent in the belief;

That is to say, the denial of belief/faith. The belief that atheism is an 'intellectually superior truth'. Anyone with a different belief is hence 'intellectually inferior'- which justifies having the truth forced on them

Case in point: "Evolution is a fact. Beyond reasonable doubt, beyond serious doubt, beyond sane, informed, intelligent doubt, beyond doubt evolution is a fact." Dawkins

..and hence..

It is absolutely safe to say that if you meet somebody who claims not to believe in evolution, that person is ignorant, stupid or insane or wicked.... Dawkins

 

[Mock Turtle]

Speaking as an ex atheist, I was every bit as patronizing and mean as many atheists here.

And I agree, from the other side, I just don't feel that same disdain.

So it's not that I am an angelic person now who is above being mean, I think there is something inherent in the belief;

That is to say, the denial of belief/faith. The belief that atheism is an 'intellectually superior truth'. Anyone with a different belief is hence 'intellectually inferior'- which justifies having the truth forced on them

Case in point: "Evolution is a fact. Beyond reasonable doubt, beyond serious doubt, beyond sane, informed, intelligent doubt, beyond doubt evolution is a fact." Dawkins

..and hence..

It is absolutely safe to say that if you meet somebody who claims not to believe in evolution, that person is ignorant, stupid or insane or wicked.... Dawkins

Not believe in evolution then?

 

[Guy Threepwood]

Not believe in evolution then?

I don't share his Darwinian beliefs no..

 

[YmirGF]

Atheist don't say they don't need any god(s).

I certainly have said so, on several occasions, here on RF. I have no use for any of the current god concepts floating about. In other words, I don't need any god(s). Clear enough?

 

[stvdv]

I certainly have said so, on several occasions, here on RF. I have no use for any of the current god concepts floating about. In other words, I don't need any god(s). Clear enough?

But if it were a Goddess? Still no use?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Now, if you know something that would save the life of your neighbor, would it show love, if you just kept quiet and let him die, while you are saved but what you know, or would that be doing to your neighbor what you would want him to do to you?

By imposing your beliefs on your neighbour, you take on an ethical duty to make sure they’re demonstrably correct. Can you meet that standard?

Telling people that the bridge is out up ahead is only a good thing if you’ve actually confirmed that the bridge is out. If you don’t have good reason to think that it’s actually out - and merely feeling really sure that it’s out doesn’t qualify as a good reason - then what you’re doing is mischief, not a service to others.

 

[JustWondering]

Why do some atheists have to be so insulting and mean? I am a believer and I do not ever insult atheists; in fact I tell them their lack of belief is just as rational as my beliefs since nobody can prove there is a God. I never threaten them with hell because I do not even believe in hell.

But I constantly have to defend myself from being call brainwashed and stupid and having dumb arguments, just because I believe in God and have a religion that is different from Christianity, a religion they do not know how to refute. Nobody deserves to be treated this way.

If atheists want to say they need no God for morality then some of them are not doing a very good job of demonstrating that with their air of superiority, arrogance, and rude behavior, not to mention dishonesty, lack of self-awareness and unjust treatment of others.

I am not referring to any atheists in this forum. They have been more than civil and respectful and kind.

I am being called stupid but I am not stupid. I went to college for over 15 years and I have several degrees, two advanced. But I am called stupid because my degrees are not in science subjects, because I do not know a lot about history. So what? What is more important, how much one knows or how they treat their fellow man?

I can't speak for anyone but myself but I think that there are times theists take things I say as insults that are not insults. I also think that there are theists that take any criticism of their beliefs as an insult, when someone is just trying to have an honest discussion (not necessarily debate) with them.

 

[Truly Enlightened]

I certainly have said so, on several occasions, here on RF. I have no use for any of the current god concepts floating about. In other words, I don't need any god(s). Clear enough?

Crystal. I also have no need for any God, but this is not the reason for my disbelief. I have no need for truffles, but truffles still exist. Believers try to equate a lack of need, to a lack of belief. This is fallacious and intellectually dishonest.

 

[Trailblazer]

I can't speak for anyone but myself but I think that there are times theists take things I say as insults that are not insults. I also think that there are theists that take any criticism of their beliefs as an insult, when someone is just trying to have an honest discussion (not necessarily debate) with them.

Yes, many people take things I say as insults but they definitely are not. Then if they just stuff that and don't try to clarify it with me, it festers and bad feelings result. The atheist forum owner I was referring to in the OP definitely misconstrued almost everything I said on his forum. That did not happen simply because he is an atheist and I am a believer, it is also because of our personalities. I know that because I get along with most atheists very well.

 

[Truly Enlightened]

Speaking as an ex atheist, I was every bit as patronizing and mean as many atheists here.

And I agree, from the other side, I just don't feel that same disdain.

So it's not that I am an angelic person now who is above being mean, I think there is something inherent in the belief;

That is to say, the denial of belief/faith. The belief that atheism is an 'intellectually superior truth'. Anyone with a different belief is hence 'intellectually inferior'- which justifies having the truth forced on them

Case in point: "Evolution is a fact. Beyond reasonable doubt, beyond serious doubt, beyond sane, informed, intelligent doubt, beyond doubt evolution is a fact." Dawkins

..and hence..

It is absolutely safe to say that if you meet somebody who claims not to believe in evolution, that person is ignorant, stupid or insane or wicked.... Dawkins

Evolution IS a fact beyond any reasonable doubt. It is a scientific certainty, proven by the scientific method of enquiry through inductive and deductive reasoning.. The story of Jesus and the existence of a God IS NOT a fact beyond any reasonable doubt. It is a cultural belief based on faith and tradition, not on certainty. Religion was not designed to produce any tangible benefits, only emotional rewards. It was designed to make adults feel good about themselves and others. Despite this emotive aspect of religious belief, it still persists despite the development of our improved reasoning ability. Religious beliefs and rituals may continue to help adults feel good, but this is more a matter of feelings than of reason. So, why should we elevate the emotional aspects of religious belief over the cognitive or intellectual ones?

Richard's opinions are his own, and the ToE is a certainty. So unless you have another verifiable provable alternative explanation that can explain the facts and data, I can't see the point you are making. Is the converse also true? If people don't believe in God intellectually inferior, and those that do superior?

 

[Trailblazer]

Crystal. I also have no need for any God, but this is not the reason for my disbelief. I have no need for truffles, but truffles still exist. Believers try to equate a lack of need, to a lack of belief. This is fallacious and intellectually dishonest.

So what is the reason for your disbelief, lack of evidence that God exists? So you have no need for any God because God does not exist?

What do you mean by: Believers try to equate a lack of need, to a lack of belief.