Why do you believe the way you do?

[PureX]

"Reality" is also subjective. Truth is contextual. It resides in the constructed world of relationships that constitute the things of my "reality." It's illusion within illusion.

There was actual existence before you, and there will be actual existence after you, that existed and exists regardless of your perception of it. That actuality is a truth unto itself.

 

[YmirGF]

Why do you believe what you do? This includes why you believe in the Holy Bible and or God

Why do I believe? LOL. Can you handle my answer?

I believe in "God" because I have experienced directly what "god" is. I was born into an atheistic family and come from a long line of atheists. I too was a "devout" atheist" but my acceptance grew in stages. My first realizations indicated that Tibetan Buddhism held the brass ring, again due to my rather profound inner experiences that began at approximately 8:15 pm, 4 days after my 18th birthday.
If you go to the thread "Ask MysticSang'ha anything" she talks about the "Clear Light". That is precisely what I experienced well over 33 years ago... and I might add... more importantly, I still do experience it almost without interruption.

As my experience deepened and my ability to assimiate non-tokenized (devoid of symbols) reality, I began to sense something beyond the periphery of my sphere of awareness. As the years went by I was able to resolve the formless and fleeting "non-images" through the lens of my consciousness, much like the Hubble telescope peered into a deep space are of darkness and after prolonged exposure resolved this formerly blank area was teeming with thousands and thousands of galaxies. However, I didn't discern thousands of things on my periphery, I detected only one.

This image that is well beyond the concept of an "image" was a singularity of sorts. It is hard to define, really. Slowly as the months passed it began to "respond" to my "thought probs" and eventually is quite literally condensed in front of me in a manner that is quite difficult to describe. It was like meeting a massive globular cluster, will billions of parts but seen as a whole. To my pathetic senses it certainly seemed to be "god". You ask why I believe? Well, seeing is believing, ain't it. More than this though, it was the overwhelming feeling of belonging, longing and being beloved. It was quite unearthly and the bliss at the union is beyond all description. I know I could simply be deluded, but at least I will die with a rather large grin on my face.

It is because of these deep mystical experiences that I no longer care terribly much what the religions of the world have to say on ... well, pretty much anything. I see them as children's stories designed for immature audiences who are unable to directly approach something far greater than the stories imply.

Personally, I accept four avatars (or divinity in the flesh) to have graced our small planet. They are Krsna, Buddha, Jesus the Christ and the One who is yet to be. There is also a distinct possibility of a female Christlike figure who may well have appeared at the dawn of modern civilization which grew into the "Earth goddess" belief structures of the time. I simply recognize no other beings as being worthy listening to.

Honorable mention, however, does go to Paramahansa Yogananda and his guru lineage. Mahavatar Babaji (as mentioned by Yogananda) and Meher Baba. Likewise I am also quite taken with the writings of Jane Roberts/the Seth entity. A tip of the hat also goes to Carl Jung, who is arguably the father of modern psychiatry.

Sadly I could not vote in the poll as the options were far too limited.

 

[doppelganger]

There was actual existence before you, and there will be actual existence after you, that existed and exists regardless of your perception of it. That actuality is a truth unto itself.

No it isn't. It's a probability. You're confusing the two.

 

[Willamena]

The problem is that we can't ratify an absolute. To say that; "the truth is what is", is an absolute statement. But we don't have any way of verifying that statement's truthfulness, because we don't have access to all that is. So for us, it becomes a kind of logical tautology. We hold to it because it's logical, but we can never be sure it's correct.

Sorry, I don't know what "ratify an absolute" means. Can you explain that? We can verify that "the truth is true" what "what is is what is" because we have access to the truth and what is. It doesn't have to be all that is to be what is.

 

[Willamena]

And if truth is defined as absolute (as it commonly is), then we cannot know it.

Why not? "Absolute" is one of *our* things, part of the "illusion".

I agree in that the only truth we can experience is the idea of truth that we create in our own minds.

That's the truth that's absolute.

"There can be only one."

 

[doppelganger]

Why not? "Absolute" is one of *our* things, part of the "illusion".

Yeppers. :bow:

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Allthough my exact answer isn't there, I picked it's logical. I constantly search for what is truth, and believe what I have found to be truth, allthough I still search.

 

[Reverend Chris]

Why do I believe? LOL. Can you handle my answer?

I believe in "God" because I have experienced directly what "god" is. I was born into an atheistic family and come from a long line of atheists. I too was a "devout" atheist" but my acceptance grew in stages. My first realizations indicated that Tibetan Buddhism held the brass ring, again due to my rather profound inner experiences that began at approximately 8:15 pm, 4 days after my 18th birthday.
If you go to the thread "Ask MysticSang'ha anything" she talks about the "Clear Light". That is precisely what I experienced well over 33 years ago... and I might add... more importantly, I still do experience it almost without interruption.

As my experience deepened and my ability to assimiate non-tokenized (devoid of symbols) reality, I began to sense something beyond the periphery of my sphere of awareness. As the years went by I was able to resolve the formless and fleeting "non-images" through the lens of my consciousness, much like the Hubble telescope peered into a deep space are of darkness and after prolonged exposure resolved this formerly blank area was teeming with thousands and thousands of galaxies. However, I didn't discern thousands of things on my periphery, I detected only one.

This image that is well beyond the concept of an "image" was a singularity of sorts. It is hard to define, really. Slowly as the months passed it began to "respond" to my "thought probs" and eventually is quite literally condensed in front of me in a manner that is quite difficult to describe. It was like meeting a massive globular cluster, will billions of parts but seen as a whole. To my pathetic senses it certainly seemed to be "god". You ask why I believe? Well, seeing is believing, ain't it. More than this though, it was the overwhelming feeling of belonging, longing and being beloved. It was quite unearthly and the bliss at the union is beyond all description. I know I could simply be deluded, but at least I will die with a rather large grin on my face.

It is because of these deep mystical experiences that I no longer care terribly much what the religions of the world have to say on ... well, pretty much anything. I see them as children's stories designed for immature audiences who are unable to directly approach something far greater than the stories imply.

Personally, I accept four avatars (or divinity in the flesh) to have graced our small planet. They are Krsna, Buddha, Jesus the Christ and the One who is yet to be. There is also a distinct possibility of a female Christlike figure who may well have appeared at the dawn of modern civilization which grew into the "Earth goddess" belief structures of the time. I simply recognize no other beings as being worthy listening to.

Honorable mention, however, does go to Paramahansa Yogananda and his guru lineage. Mahavatar Babaji (as mentioned by Yogananda) and Meher Baba. Likewise I am also quite taken with the writings of Jane Roberts/the Seth entity. A tip of the hat also goes to Carl Jung, who is arguably the father of modern psychiatry.

Sadly I could not vote in the poll as the options were far too limited.

Would this be a out of body experience (OBE)that you are speaking of? It sure sounds like one.

 

[Guitar's Cry]

I need an "Other" for this poll.

 

[Reverend Chris]

I need an "Other" for this poll.

Lay it on me what is your other?

 

[PureX]

Sorry, I don't know what "ratify an absolute" means. Can you explain that? We can verify that "the truth is true" what "what is is what is" because we have access to the truth and what is. It doesn't have to be all that is to be what is.

To say that the truth is what is, is basically a meaningless tautology if we can't know what is, is. But all we can know of what is, is limited and relative, whereas the statement is absolute; infinite. So we don't have any way of knowing if the statement is true or not.

 

[PureX]

Why not? "Absolute" is one of *our* things, part of the "illusion".

"Rain" is not just "one of our things". It's an actual phenomenon. The experience we have of it, and the label we put on that experience is ours, but the rain itself is not an illusion of our making. It exists regardless of our experiencing it, or labeling it.

That's the truth that's absolute.

"There can be only one."

If a state of absolute truth exists, it must do so regardless of our perception of it. Because if it depended upon our perception of it to exist, it could not then be absolute, as the definition of the term "absolute" means not dependant upon external conditions or criteria.

 

[Comprehend]

How did the Holy Ghost tell you this, was it a thought? Was it in speech? Was it in writing?

None of the above. The Holy Ghost, being a spirit communicates directly to my spirit.

 

[Willamena]

To say that the truth is what is, is basically a meaningless tautology if we can't know what is, is. But all we can know of what is, is limited and relative, whereas the statement is absolute; infinite. So we don't have any way of knowing if the statement is true or not.

What is is what is. The truth is, too, it's one of those things that is. "Is" (to be) is existence, not truth (although existence is true). We can know what is; we (conscious beings) are the only ones who can.

"Rain" is not just "one of our things". It's an actual phenomenon. The experience we have of it, and the label we put on that experience is ours, but the rain itself is not an illusion of our making. It exists regardless of our experiencing it, or labeling it.

I look at it a slightly different way. "Rain" (the form given to water as it falls from the clouds) is a phenomenon, yes, which means a circumstance perceptable to the senses. "Form" is the interpretation we assign to that perception --we give the phenomenon of rain its form, and we also give the concept "phenomenon" its form, and we give the act of "interpretating" and "labelling" a phenonmenon its form, and the idea that it's an "illusion"... forms ad infinium --so ultimately we are what makes the phenomenon of rain "actual". The "forms" are "our things." This is part of a paradigm such as the mystic adopts.

Truth, existence and absolute are more of our forms.

If a state of absolute truth exists, it must do so regardless of our perception of it. Because if it depended upon our perception of it to exist, it could not then be absolute, as the definition of the term "absolute" means not dependant upon external conditions or criteria.

If a state of absolute truth exists, it exists as one of our forms. What lies beyond the forms is what Buddhism refers to as "emptiness." It also tells us that "emptiness does not differ from form; form does not differ from emptiness..." Unity is the recognition that this split of "our" world of forms and a world of emptiness is one and the same. One reality.

Everything exists in context, even absoluteness. I percieve you applying the concept of "absolute" to what is in fact formless. There is no "absolute" beyond our interpretation of absoluteness.

 

[Kungfuzed]

Why do you believe what you do?

My beliefs help me make the most sense out of the world around me. It affects how I see myself, others, and the whole of existence. Basically, it works for me, better than anything else I've tried so far.

 

[YmirGF]

Would this be a out of body experience (OBE)that you are speaking of? It sure sounds like one.

Yes, indeed it was. It was somewhere around my 100th such inner adventure... give or take.

 

[Reverend Chris]

Yes, indeed it was. It was somewhere around my 100th such inner adventure... give or take.

Tell me more > I am working on OBE's now, but I cannot seem to relax long enough. I base most all my beliefs on 100's of NDE's from others. The only title I can seem to associate it with is metaphysics.

 

[YmirGF]

Tell me more > I am working on OBE's now, but I cannot seem to relax long enough. I base most all my beliefs on 100's of NDE's from others. The only title I can seem to associate it with is metaphysics.

Your wish is my command. PS: Sorry for all the errors in my original post. I was preoccupied while writing it, lol. Dang deer were at the fence again and I was running back and forth to say hello to them. *Sighs about living in the country*

I wrote a piece while on sabbatical from RF a wee while ago, you might find it somewhat entertaining. A mystical view of out of body endeavors :flirt:


PS: To the thinkers in this thread, nothing is "absolute" and so-called "truth" is relative. Any other questions?

 

[Comprehend]

PS: To the thinkers in this thread, nothing is "absolute" and so-called "truth" is relative. Any other questions?

Everything is absolute and truth is just that despite our subjective perception or lack thereof.

 

[eudaimonia]

I voted for "it's logical". IOW, I was persuaded to a certain position through the strength of its philosophical arguments.


eudaimonia,

Mark