Trailblazer
Veteran Member
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Why does god need to test us?
- Thread starter SigurdReginson
- Start date
God. I don't believe God can be bound by a particular gender.
See my above post.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Yes, I believe that is true, because if we don't love God, God's love cannot reach us.
5: O SON OF BEING! Love Me, that I may love thee. If thou lovest Me not, My love can in no wise reach thee. Know this, O servant.
The Hidden Words of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 4
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
I just have to hope that is true, given the tests I am invariably going through.
Bahá’u’lláh urges the people of the Bayán to do likewise, counselling them to adorn their beings with the mantle of resignation, to be steadfast in the Cause of God, and never to be dismayed or disheartened by adversity. And He reminds them that, whereas God rewards every good deed in accordance with its merit, in the case of patience and long-suffering, as attested in the Qur’án, the recompense is limitless.[^1] [1]: 'Those who patiently persevere will truly receive a reward without measure.' (Qur’án xxxix. 10.Translated by ‘Abdu’lláh Yusuf ‘Alí.)
—————
Adib Taherzadeh, "The Revelation of Bahá’u’lláh vol. 1"
Bird123
Well-Known Member
Why would God make anything that wasn't a Masterpiece?? Seems your idea of God comes up lacking. Maybe there is something you missed, something you have not Discovered yet.
Figure out how it is a Masterpiece and you will be well on your way to Understanding.
Here is a clue. God's Goal and your goal are two different things. On the other hand, I have learned early in life to study Intelligence. I copy God. Our Goals align.
If I had the great ability to create a world, it would be just like we have here. It is the most Intelligent thing to do. Can you SEE? Do you Understand?? What knowledge are you missing that exists beyond your surface view of things? Widen that View.
The first thing God pointed out to me is that mankind carries such a narrow view. I cry that. I see that everyday.
Where has your strive to your idea of Justice gotten you? What have you really gained??
That's what I see. It's very clear!!
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
God created a Masterpiece...
Genesis 1:31
New International Version
31 God saw all that he had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the sixth day.
And after that humans messed up the Masterpiece, and that was not caused by Adam and Eve eating an apple.
That's what I see. It's very clear!!
But how do we know that, and how can we be sure that's true as opposed to, say, saying that we should love Ahura Mazda because Ahura Mazda loves us, and they will reward our love in turn with greater love for us?
Sorry for all the childish questions, but ultimately it's elemental questions like these that help me understand people's perspectives more.
But how do we know that, and how can we be sure that's true as opposed to, say, saying that we should love Ahura Mazda because Ahura Mazda loves us, and they will reward our love in turn with greater love for us?
Sorry for all the childish questions, but ultimately it's elemental questions like these that help me understand people's perspectives more.
I don't, ultimately, know beyond a shadow of a doubt that it's true. I just strongly believe it to be true. I should add that insofar as I believe that God sent Prophets and Messengers to every corner of the Earth with Their Message (of believing in One Creator God, Their Messengers, and Their Message), though that Message has been corrupted with the passage of time, there are still remnants of that original Message in the other religions of the world. The belief in Ahura Mazda as the Creator and Highest Deity is part of what remains of that original Message in Mazdayasna ('Zoroastrianism'). Ahura Mazda for me is the same as God. So I don't have a fundamental problem with swapping the word 'God' for 'Ahura Mazda' in my above statement (about loving God because God loves us).
I see... That's a very positive and open view of deity, I feel. Thank you for sharing.
Bird123
Well-Known Member
God created a Masterpiece...
Genesis 1:31
New International Version
31 God saw all that he had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the sixth day.
And after that humans messed up the Masterpiece, and that was not caused by Adam and Eve eating an apple.
That's what I see. It's very clear!!
Are not humans part of the Masterpiece? Would God really create someone to mess up the masterpiece? Does God have so little foresight that God can't see exactly what is going to happen?
Petty things such as Blaming, Condemning, Hating, wanting Payback, Punishing, Controlling have all corrupted your view.
Mankind is not messing up the Masterpiece. They are a part of it. Purge yourself of these petty things then work at seeing things as they really are. Figure out what God is really doing with this world and all the people. Why are things the way they are? Mechanics!! How does it all fit together and why?
All the secrets of the universe stare us all in the face. God is not hiding anything. When you really Understand, it's so much easier than fighting your way down the journey. Can you see where I point? You won't find this in holy books written by mankind.
Your journey is yours. No one can take it for you. Brains will win over accepting in the end. On the other hand, you can choose the bumpy road if you want.
You will never be able to create a Heavenly state Blaming, Condemning, Hating, wanting Payback, Punishing, and Controlling, however you can try. When these things return, Happiness is not what they will bring you. Haven't you yet realized this when others serve them up to you??
I guess you have a long way to go.
That's what I see. It's very clear!!
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
God knew it would happen but there was no way to prevent it from happening because humans have free will to choose between good and evil. It does not matter to God because God is unaffected by what humans do.
“Regard thou the one true God as One Who is apart from, and immeasurably exalted above, all created things. The whole universe reflecteth His glory, while He is Himself independent of, and transcendeth His creatures.” Gleanings, p. 166
It only hurts the humans who wreck the Masterpiece since they have to live in it.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Who is doing any of that stuff, not me. You are creating a straw man so you can argue against religion.
I guess you have a long way to go before you will ever understand that what I believe is not the straw man you have created.
Bird123
Well-Known Member
Once again your idea of God comes up lacking. Do you really think God is so cold that God is not concerned with His children?? That's not God. See what actually exists around you.
Do you really think God is helpless under the realm of free will? Do you really think God is helpless to prevent anything?
You are Big on Blame. It's one of those petty things I mentioned. It's seems easy for you to blame any and all around you yet you can't blame God. Why not?
Try blaming God then work at Discovering why God does things as He does. Everything about God will add up.
You got to give me more than God is helpless and unfeeling. This is not and has never been God. The answers stare you in the face. The answers span beyond any holy book because they are just like you. They have no clue either.
That's what I see. It's very clear!!
Bird123
Well-Known Member
You are not Blaming others? You are not condemning others as Evil? You are not desiring punishment or payback? WE against they??? You hate and you do not even realize you are doing it. You have accepted these petty things as right because the writers of holy books practice them.
Our actions WILL return to teach us all what our choices really mean. Actions return regardless of any Beliefs or excuses one might have. What actually Is will return until there is Understanding.
When one Understands all sides, Intelligence will make the Best choices. Do you think you are making the Best choices now?? What if you were the one being condemned by those around you. Would the view look different?
Look back. Who have you hurt in the past?
Religions and arguments are not my concern. On the other hand, I am pointing to what is whether anyone sees or understands it at all. I place it out there so it is there when someone is ready to Discover it.
Ready?? It stares you in the face.
That's what I see. It's very clear!!
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
I do not believe that God is cold nor do I believe that God is all-loving. An all-loving God would never have created a material world with so much suffering where people are forced to live until they die.
No, I do not believe that God is helpless to prevent anything, but He sure is not preventing all the suffering that exists in the world. God is leaving that job to humans to accomplish with their free will.
I am not forming my opinions about God based upon any holy book, I form them from what I observe i the world. No, God is not helpless so He must be unfeeling to allow the suffering to continue.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
No, I am not "doing" and of those things and I don't hate anyone. That is just a straw man you have created in your mind.
Moreover, I do not accept the things in the holy books when I see the incongruity with what I actually see in the world.
Bird123
Well-Known Member
Knowledge exists beyond the surface. It's going to take work on your part.
Put the pieces of the puzzle together. How does it all fit together? Actions of a Highly intelligent Being takes work, a stretch, wide thinking and lots of analyzing to understand and uncover the answers to that Masterpiece we live in.
God is hiding nothing. It stares us all in the face.
Remember, God does not value all those petty things you and your religion value. Think outside your box beyond the Blaming, Judging, Condemning, Punishing etc.
God is Unconditional Love. Think in those terms and you will arrive much quicker. Don't and you might be stay in that quicksand for a long time.
It has never ever been about Good verses Evil.
That's what I see. It's very clear!!
Bird123
Well-Known Member
Seems like you took a step forward. Very Good!! Work hard! Everything about God Does Add Up Completely. When you open one door, it leads to more doors that you can learn and open. The journey continues.
When you have Discovered enough, you will see. There was never any straw at all. When you can see and understand those petty things I mentioned for what they really are, It will all change. You will take a giant step forward. You will see much of what so many are blind to see.
That's what I see. It's very clear!!
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
And you assume I don't do any work? Wake up and smell the coffee, work is all that I do.
I suggest you get busy then, but you will be busy for a long time, because you will never know the 'actions' of God.
Who decides what is petty, you or God? I do not value any petty things and neither does my religion. Judging and punishing when it is called for is in accordance with Justice, and Justice is not petty.
Who made you an expert about God? I am in no quicksand, God loves us regardless if what we do, but love does not mean letting the little kiddies get away with murder and expecting no consequences for their actions.
You live in a complete fantasy world of your own making. You imagine that there needs to be no Divine Justice but that is ludicrous, because everything in this life is based upon Justice, and there are rewards and punishments for everything do.
It has always been about god vs. evil.
That's what I see. It's very clear!!