Why I think atheism/theism doesn't matter.

[ImmortalFlame]

No, no. You miss my point. The experience is the focus.

But theism is the belief in an intelligent agency responsible for the creation of the universe. If you relabel God to just mean "nature", then you're no longer dealing with theism in the broad sense, so you've not really said anything about theism or atheism.

My point is that the two are the same

Again, this only depends on you relabelling things. Of course they're the same thing if you define them to mean the same thing, but in their own actual meanings the word "God" and the Buddhist technique of the "big mind" are entirely different things.

I think it is that the boundary between my self and the world is imagined.

Could you please elaborate on this, as well? Again, I can't see any actual meaning in these words or the concept you're trying to create with them.

I'm not arguing that the paths are the same I am arguing that the destination is.
I stated it as plainly as I know how -

But how can you assert that destination is the same without knowing (or at least defining) yourself what that destination is?

That each of us is a carrier of "Big Mind" perhaps - I do not myself understand - I am merely working on it

Well, fair enough. If you're submitting the concept for review, I would have to say it's pretty weak, vague and generalized at best.

 

[PolyHedral]

Isn't that the million dollar question?

I don't think it's do-able but I feel I have to try.

I think going with the 'gut' is as good as I can do

Why? Why try to do the impossible?

 

[LuisDantas]

I generally agree with the OP (although I must note that the concept of Alaya-Vijnana is not universal in Buddhism AFAIK).

Belief in God is ultimately just a tool for a certain kind of mental state and understanding.

 

[sandandfoam]

But theism is the belief in an intelligent agency responsible for the creation of the universe. If you relabel God to just mean "nature", then you're no longer dealing with theism in the broad sense, so you've not really said anything about theism or atheism..

You've missed my point again.

I've said clearly above that's not what I'm doing. I've said I think God is a label for an experience.

Well, fair enough. If you're submitting the concept for review, I would have to say it's pretty weak, vague and generalized at best.

But you haven't grasped it yet

 

[sandandfoam]

Why? Why try to do the impossible?

I don't have an answer. I honestly don't know.

 

[Midnight Pete]

I think that God and the Buddhists "big mind" are the same thing. Following Jesus and following the eightfold path lead to the same place. Joining with God or waking up. Both describe a way of being. The same way of being in my view.

One road needs no God, the other does. The destination is the same.
To focus on theism or atheism is to look at the road and see destination rather than journey.

It seems to me that it's the waking up that matters - not the road there.

I like that. It gives me hope.

 

[Midnight Pete]

Why? Why try to do the impossible?

Something in our nature compels us to attempt the impossible. The human spirit wants to break free of all limitations.

 

[sandandfoam]

Yup, I agree When one gets through the first stages of awakening, one realizes that all the diff labels are just there as anchor points, to keep one from straying too far from the path.. Some people need the rigid walls of dogma (whatever it may be) to support them, which is fine, but extremely limiting in my opinion. As soon we proclaim ourselves to be one thing or another, we ultimately build our own box as we lose fluidity.

Thank you Katia, that ties in nicely with what I'm trying to express

 

[Willamena]

Why? Why try to do the impossible?

Because it's permissible.

 

[dust1n]

I think that God and the Buddhists "big mind" are the same thing. Following Jesus and following the eightfold path lead to the same place. Joining with God or waking up. Both describe a way of being. The same way of being in my view.

One road needs no God, the other does. The destination is the same.
To focus on theism or atheism is to look at the road and see destination rather than journey.

It seems to me that it's the waking up that matters - not the road there.

Why does waking up matter? And what does that even mean?

 

[Willamena]

Why does waking up matter? And what does that even mean?

To me, it just means being here, doing this. TurkeyOnRye once described it very well:
Enlightenment is experiencing the completeness and perfection of this moment all the time. It never leaves because he/she understands that this moment is all there is.

 

[drsatish]

Well said!
All of You
...on Page 1.

Satish

 

[ImmortalFlame]

You've missed my point again.

I've said clearly above that's not what I'm doing. I've said I think God is a label for an experience.

Now you're just getting more vague. A "label for an experience" could mean anything.

But you haven't grasped it yet

Because you're being vague and nonsensical.

 

[blackout]

The destination is whatever it is.

And no one really knows what that is.

So better to focus on Living Life Alive,
wherever you may find yourSelf living.
Carpe Diem.
The Kingdom Now.

Drinking deeply of life.

Some Theists do this well,
many don't.
Some Non-theists do this well,
many don't.

The dividing lines on a Life deeply lived
have really nothing at all intrinsically
to do with
"theism" or "non-theism" .

Perhaps this is what Stephen was getting at.

 

[Willamena]

A "label for an experience" could mean anything.

Generally, it just means "a label for an experience," though.

 

[sandandfoam]

Because you're being vague and nonsensical.

Dad?

I'm only joking. That's fine. Thanks for taking the time to share your view.

 

[sandandfoam]

The dividing lines on a Life deeply lived
have really nothing at all intrinsically
to do with
"theism" or "non-theism" .

Perhaps this is what Stephen was getting at.

Thank you Violet.
Very nicely stated.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

Generally, it just means "a label for an experience," though.

What, like "drinking a glass of water", or "walking", or "speaking", or "thinking", or literally "doing anything".

You might as well just say "God is a thing (or not)".

Dad?

I'm only joking. That's fine. Thanks for taking the time to share your view.

Meh, I can only guess we're each trying to pull the concepts you're exploring in entirely different directions. Between us, we'll probably get nowhere.

 

[Quiddity]

If atheist are right about religion and all of it's failings and all it can infinitely continue to do, then it does matter.

If theist are right about non-belief and all of it's failings and all it can infinitely continue to do, then it does matter.

 

[blackout]

How you Live in the Now moment,
makes none of what happens later matter.

If you are unable to LIVE ALIVE in the current NOW moment,
you will not be able to do so in some future NOW moment.
All there EVER IS, is the NOW moment.
Eternity is now.
Not later.
(later being only a projection)

Thus, the journey.