Why is the AR-15 Legal?

[BSM1]

And that's the enormous problem the NRA and its toady congressmen have left us with.

Problems, like beauty, tend to lie in the eye of the beholder.

 

[BSM1]

You are correct. Most non-gun enthusiast can't tell the difference though. As a gun enthusiast I consider the ar-15 as a child's toy or joke even. It's not much different than a Ruger 10/22 - Wikipedia which is a common entry level/small game semi-automatic rifle that has been under many Christmas trees as presents for 10 year olds. The ar-15 is just made to look like a real assault rifle for aesthetic purposes as you stated.

Now as to how this kid was legally able to legally purchase one is another matter.

He was 19, adult enough for the military. I'm assuming I could purchase one. Have it within 3-4 days according to the website.

Florida's legal age for gun purchases is 18.

 

[Enoch07]

That's unfair to the AR15, which uses a military caliber (5.56 NATO).
Sure, it's been called a "mouse gun" by shooters favoring 30-06 & 308,
but the AR15 can successfully compete at 1000 yards. Can't do anything
like that with a 10/22.

You called it. I am a .30 Cal+ man. But if you look at the bullets for both the .22 caliber and the .223 caliber (or 5.56 Nato same thing, just different names) there is not that much difference. The projectile for the .223 is slightly larger and heavier, and it has more powder behind it. The great thing about the .223 is it's accuracy, you don't have to account for bullet drop/spin or weather conditions for most shots within it's normal operating range. But it's "stopping" power is woefully inept at longer ranges.

 

[Enoch07]

Florida's legal age for gun purchases is 18.

Yes, but you still have to go through the legal process I described in post #32 to order a gun online.

 

[Revoltingest]

Problems, like beauty, tend to lie in the eye of the beholder.

I hear many complaints about the problem of....
- Gays controlling everything
- Blacks controlling everything
- Women being so difficult
One person's "problem" is another's progress.

 

[Skwim]

And if they ignore the problem, in a few years, people will be saying "what about the 600 million guns out there?"

Exactly!

.

 

[Enoch07]

Another option that's occured to me: increase manufacturers' liability for the impacts of gun violence. Make it easier for shooting victims or their estates - or the surviving family of gun suicide victims - to sue gun manufacturers... similar to the liability of tobacco manufacturers for their products.

That will not work from a legal standpoint. Cigarettes were not advertised as unhealthy for the longest time. Which is why the lawsuit worked, and we now have warnings on cigarette boxes.

The only way a gun manufacturer is liable for a gun death is if the gun malfunctioned during normal operations, killing the gun's owner, or someone in the vicinity. The weapon has to be not modified, or under any unusual circumstances, such as shooting with barrel obstructed etc.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

What do we do about the 300 million =/- guns now in the hands of law abiding citizens?

Same thing we do with the roughly 268 million vehicles registered in the U.S.

 

[YmirGF]

I'm an ignorant Canadian who is not a gun owner. That said, don't people have to pass any kind of psych test prior to obtaining a gun legally?

Same thing we do with the roughly 268 million vehicles registered in the U.S.

Good point, how many of you happy legal gun owners would be willing to submit to a test, like a road test, every 3 to 5 years? Don't show up for the test and they come and seize your toys.

 

[Enoch07]

I'm an ignorant Canadian who is not a gun owner. That said, don't people have to pass any kind of psych test prior to obtaining a gun legally?

National Instant Criminal Background Check System - Wikipedia

Now there is 3 ways to loop hole this law.

1. Black market firearms/Silk Road (marketplace) - Wikipedia which has moved to the deep web. No background checks. If you willing to pay the price you can own any firearm you want, no restrictions. It is completely illegal though.

2. Straw purchase - Wikipedia this is also highly illegal if you are caught doing.

3. Transfer between private citizens. No background check. You only need a vaild address for the purchaser to legally sell a firearm between citizens. This is legal but ill advised. If you sold a firearm to someone used in a crime the firearm will trace back to you the original owner to which the firearm has been registered to.

 

[BSM1]

Same thing we do with the roughly 268 million vehicles registered in the U.S.

I have no problem with gun registration. Right now it's left up to the states and, TBH, I don't know why Congress has never passed a universal registration. However, this still would not have stopped the tragedy in Parkland. Guns aren't the problem, mental health, violence desensitization, and the lack of discipline and guidance in a family setting is more to blame for these actions, IMHO.

 

[BSM1]

I'm an ignorant Canadian who is not a gun owner. That said, don't people have to pass any kind of psych test prior to obtaining a gun legally?

Good point, how many of you happy legal gun owners would be willing to submit to a test, like a road test, every 3 to 5 years? Don't show up for the test and they come and seize your toys.

When's the last time you had to take a road test?

 

[BSM1]

Yes, but you still have to go through the legal process I described in post #32 to order a gun online.

According to all reports he bought the gun legally, so he must have gone through the process.

 

[Revoltingest]

I'm an ignorant Canadian who is not a gun owner. That said, don't people have to pass any kind of psych test prior to obtaining a gun legally?

There's a short quiz on Bible passages, but that's about it.

Good point, how many of you happy legal gun owners would be willing to submit to a test, like a road test, every 3 to 5 years? Don't show up for the test and they come and seize your toys.

I think yearly training refreshers could work.

 

[YmirGF]

When's the last time you had to take a road test?

It varies. After 80 you have to get a note from your doctor and it is their decision to have you tested. When a license is cancelled (in British Columbia, at least, for whatever reason, you automatically have to do the road test.)

What I was actually thinking of was license renewal, where here it is every 5 years. Forgive me!

But what if one had to go through a testing process to get a firearms license renewed every 3-5 years?

 

[BSM1]

I'm an ignorant Canadian who is not a gun owner. That said, don't people have to pass any kind of psych test prior to obtaining a gun legally?

Good point, how many of you happy legal gun owners would be willing to submit to a test, like a road test, every 3 to 5 years? Don't show up for the test and they come and seize your toys.

BTW, I think most gun owners would welcome any opportunity to go somewhere and shoot.

 

[YmirGF]

BTW, I think most gun owners would welcome any opportunity to go somewhere and shoot.

But hopefully not in schools.

That reminds me, back in the olden days when we were kids weren't there shooting clubs for teens in school?

 

[Twilight Hue]

Details about Nikolas Cruz, the 19-year-old who was expelled from Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in Parkland, Fla., emerged Wednesday after he returned with an AR-15 assault rifle and opened fire while stalking the halls.

Florida shooter with history of problems bought his AR-15 legally

The civilian version AR-15 is not an assault rifle. It's a small caliber semi-automatic hunting/sport rifle with cosmetics designed to make it look like a military style rifle. However it is constantly being referred to as an assault rifle in the media.

Is this media ignorance? Is it justified to support the cause? Is my information about it wrong?

View attachment 20401

Depends on the caliber. 5.56 is a military weapon if that's the caliber of the weapon.

I think what makes it an assault or not is semi-automatic versus bolt action and the size of the magazines. Also there is bump stocks and such.

Of course you know the media is going to play into it as assault weapons. Their whole purpose is hype and sensationalism.

 

[Enoch07]

According to all reports he bought the gun legally, so he must have gone through the process.

If legally purchased then yes. Although I question the legality of it for a few reasons. I need more info before I can clarify though.

 

[Shad]

I'm an ignorant Canadian who is not a gun owner. That said, don't people have to pass any kind of psych test prior to obtaining a gun legally?

There's a short quiz on Bible passages, but that's about it.

Do you know if any of the systems involved in background check have access to an individual's medical records? If so, does access require submitting request, paperwork, etc, etc.

I ask as Canada has a national healthcare system (Fed). Gun ownership is handled by the RCMP (Fed). This makes it easier for the RCMP to access an individuals medical records. We also have psychiatric checks.

Section 2. Registration Firearms-Control Legislation and Policy: Canada | Law Library of Congress
Safety Course http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/safe_sur/cour-eng.htm


Criminal and Psychiatric Checks

According to section 5(1) of the Firearms Act, “[a] person is not eligible to hold a licence if it is desirable, in the interests of the safety of that or any other person, that the person not possess a firearm.”38] Therefore, “[a]n applicant for a firearm licence in Canada must pass background checks which consider criminal, mental, addiction and domestic violence records.”39] Besides criminal checks, in order to determine eligibility under the Act, authorities must consider whether within the previous five years the applicant has been treated for a mental illness, whether in a hospital, mental institute, psychiatric clinic or otherwise and whether or not the person was confined to such a hospital, institute or clinic, that was associated with violence or threatened or attempted violence on the part of the person against any person; or has a history of behavior that includes violence or threatened or attempted violence on the part of the person against any person.40] In addition to background checks, “third party character references for each gun licence applicant are required.”41]

Applicants are screened using a two-tiered process. According to a 2010 evaluation report on Canada’s Firearms Program, “[t]his process entails submitting an application requesting that the applicant provide detailed personal information; when this application is assessed by the CFP, special attention is given to those applying for a Prohibited and Restricted Firearm License.”42] Moreover, all applicants are also “screened on an on-going basis through the provisions of ‘continuous eligibility’, a monitoring function that has a licensee ‘flagged’ for a review of their license should a matter of public safety arise after they have obtained their license.”43]

Do you think a similar system could be implemented in the US?