Why Quran was revealed After Bible?

[sojourner]

Which do you disagree with?

Reprinting the post here for reference:

Even though the Injil was corrupted there was still a small amount of Jews who believed in the true teachings of Jesus(pbuh). They still retained their copies of the true Injil. However throughout the years the groups of people who had strayed from the right path grew while the true Christians lessened.
When Constatine came into power he ordered that those copies of the bible that went against his preferences (trinity and so on) were to be burned and the followers killed. Yet there was still a minority of true Christians that lived on.
When prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was then sent down the Quran these small groups of Christians recognised his teachings and accepted Islam.

So in reply to your question, there was still true guidance on the Earth for those who seeked it. But when corruption on the land rose God sent down the final prophet and revelation.

There is no such thing in Xy as you describe here. There were various factions that were found to be heretical, but I'm not aware of any of them being larger than orthodoxy (which is "right belief").

You'll have to show concise proof where Constantine ordered bibles to be burned. The canon wasn't even settled until after the year 425, so the texts were still quite in flux until after Constantine died.

I'm just not aware of any orthodox Christians that "accepted Islam." The church is the church is the church. We have a fair amount of evidence to show consistency of belief from before Constantine to the present. The post reeks of fairy-tale.

 

[FearGod]

If you open a new thread I will. I promise
But I suggest you also do some research on your own. I am not a Moslem, but I have researched Islamic theology.

i opened a new thread.

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/religious-debates/141389-bahai-islam.html#post3146997

 

[Humza]

Reprinting the post here for reference:

There is no such thing in Xy as you describe here. There were various factions that were found to be heretical, but I'm not aware of any of them being larger than orthodoxy (which is "right belief").

You'll have to show concise proof where Constantine ordered bibles to be burned. The canon wasn't even settled until after the year 425, so the texts were still quite in flux until after Constantine died.

I'm just not aware of any orthodox Christians that "accepted Islam." The church is the church is the church. We have a fair amount of evidence to show consistency of belief from before Constantine to the present. The post reeks of fairy-tale.

Your post has just shown your ignorance on this issue. Why don't you open the Quran and actually look into the Hadith about orthodox Christians who have accepted Islam. If your still struggling then feel free to ask.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

Thanks for your reply,

I understand were you are coming from. However if we look into the New Testament we'll find that most of the teachings are from Paul. The problem here is that these preachings aren't coming from Jesus himself. Also Paul never himself met Jesus during his mortal life.

-Salam

I agree that there is a fair amount of writings of Paul in the New Testament, and appearantly He did not meet Jesus.

However, I don't think that proves or indicates the Bible Scriptures are corrupted.
Reason is, there are both Islamic and Christian historical Sources (Which I can post as reference) that shows Paul was an inspired and righteous follower of Christ.
Secondly, I believe it is also part of Islam theology that, in addition to Messengers, God also inspires saints. In fact, there is an explicit verse in Quran, that say such words:" God guides whom so ever He Wileth", There is another verse that says such words: "Whoso makes an effort for us, we shall guide Him". In Christian History and also according some Islamic history, Paul is know as a Martyr. He accepted to be killed for His belief.
Moreover, His writings in the New Testament shows He was following the principles of Religion and I don't see any contradictions between what He wrote, and what Quran teaches.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

i opened a new thread.

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/religious-debates/141389-bahai-islam.html#post3146997

Thank you. I will make a clear reply to that as soon as I get some time. Hopefully tonite or tomorrow.

 

[sojourner]

Your post has just shown your ignorance on this issue. Why don't you open the Quran and actually look into the Hadith about orthodox Christians who have accepted Islam. If your still struggling then feel free to ask.

My "ignorance" extends as far as the graduate courses in church history I've taken. Why would I turn to the Quran to research church history, any more than you would turn to the Book of Kells to research Islam?

If there were, in fact, splinter groups that converted to Islam, fine. But I don't think we can pretend that these groups were the "true Christians" holding to the "real scriptures." There's simply too much corroborative history to the contrary.

 

[Rexor]

What was the name of the god who revealed Himself to the first ignorant peoples?
I believe it may have been the god A pronounced Arrr. A very ancient mesopotamian god whos symbol was A or a triangle or a pyrimid. As civilizations became more sophisticated so did the names of the gods. If there is only one true God then He would not need a name or number.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

What do you think the Prophet Muhammad(صلى الله عليه وآله وسل&#1605 was before he became a Prophet? He certainly wasn't a Christian or a Pagan.

He was someone who simply believed in God, as the Prophet Abraham(عليه الصلاة والسلا&#1605 did. Anyone in that time, that believed in God, and didn't attribute partners to God etc. would've been completely fine.

That is what this verse is referring to;

Surah Baqara 2:62:

"Those who believe, and those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Christians and the Sabians,- any who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord; on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve."

note: The "Jewish Scripture" is referring to the Torah of Moses(عليه الصلاة والسلا&#1605 and the Injeel of Jesus(عليه الصلاة والسلام)

Hi Perseveranze,

Sorry for getting back to this late.

You asked me: "What do you think the Prophet Muhammad(صلى الله عليه وآله وسل&#1605 was before he became a Prophet? "

I believe, the Messengers of God are perfect submitters to God.
When we talk about submitting to God, I believe that means, submitting and following the "Laws" of God that is revealed. For how else one can submitte to God, without knowing His Laws? Or, what kind of submission is that, if one, does not act according to the Laws of God?
For every Age God, revealed His Laws, by sending a Messenger.
At the time of Muhammad, and just before Muhammad reveals Quran, the Most Recent Law, was Injil.
Thus, For Muhammad to be a Perfect Submitter to God, I believe He was following the Laws of Injil. I know that, He was not called by name "A Christian".
But His actions was according to the laws of Injil.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

Anyone in that time, that believed in God, and didn't attribute partners to God etc. would've been completely fine.

I think, it is True, that if anyone who believed in one God, and did not take a partner with God, was completely fine.
But for every True belief, there must be a True action.

"Do men think that they will be left alone on saying, "We believe", and that they will not be tested?" Quran 29:2


So, in my view, True belief is always dependent on passing the Tests of God.

But God, Tests, according to His Books, and Laws (That is what Quran and Bible both say)

 

[FearGod]

Hi Perseveranze,

Sorry for getting back to this late.

You asked me: "What do you think the Prophet Muhammad(صلى الله عليه وآله وسل&#1605 was before he became a Prophet? "

I believe, the Messengers of God are perfect submitters to God.
When we talk about submitting to God, I believe that means, submitting and following the "Laws" of God that is revealed. For how else one can submitte to God, without knowing His Laws? Or, what kind of submission is that, if one, does not act according to the Laws of God?
For every Age God, revealed His Laws, by sending a Messenger.
At the time of Muhammad, and just before Muhammad reveals Quran, the Most Recent Law, was Injil.
Thus, For Muhammad to be a Perfect Submitter to God, I believe He was following the Laws of Injil. I know that, He was not called by name "A Christian".
But His actions was according to the laws of Injil.

i don't agree with you.

We can still be submitted to god even if you think that he changed his laws.
IMHO submission isn't limited to just one specific law.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

i don't agree with you.

We can still be submitted to god even if you think that he changed his laws.
IMHO submission isn't limited to just one specific law.

I agree with you.
Because, the spiritual Laws of God, is the same in all Books, and is not limited to one specific Law.