Why some people believe god doesn't exist?

[allah lover]

Hello everyone.

Why some people believe god doesn't exist?
-----------

I mean of course we can't see something like god, but I don't get how this make people believe god can't exist.

I mean how logical it is to have such a belief system.

It's like this:

Hey!! I don't see any space creatures!! So I believe that we are the only existing creatures.

So even if we agree that We haven't find any way to totally prove god existence, does it make God "impossible to exist"?

So here we are.

We see a world.

How could we logically believe that it came out of nowhere, It wasn't created by no one and the world was like: TADAAAA!!! HERE I COME AND I'VE COME FROM NOWHERE. SUDDENLY I JUST POPPED OUT BOYS!!!

Which belief is more logical?

to believe that some god created this world or to believe that this world has just popped out, out of nowhere?

Tell me guys, how you hold such a funny belief?

What do you think about science then?

You think science is dull?

Cause if the world can come out of nothing, So what's the point of scientific knowledge?

Cause you see, in our world things can come out of nothing.

So any imaginable science would be based on nothing then.

 

[FranklinMichaelV.3]

Hello everyone.

Why some people believe god doesn't exist?
-----------

I mean of course we can't see something like god, but I don't get how this make people believe god can't exist.

I mean how logical it is to have such a belief system.

It's like this:

Hey!! I don't see any space creatures!! So I believe that we are the only existing creatures.

So even if we agree that We haven't find any way to totally prove god existence, does it make God "impossible to exist"?

So here we are.

We see a world.

How could we logically believe that it came out of nowhere, It wasn't created by no one and the world was like: TADAAAA!!! HERE I COME AND I'VE COME FROM NOWHERE. SUDDENLY I JUST POPPED OUT BOYS!!!

Which belief is more logical?

to believe that some god created this world or to believe that this world has just popped out, out of nowhere?

Tell me guys, how you hold such a funny belief?

What do you think about science then?

You think science is dull?

Cause if the world can come out of nothing, So what's the point of scientific knowledge?

Cause you see, in our world things can come out of nothing.

So any imaginable science would be based on nothing then.

I'm not that up on Logical understanding. But I think that by reason Something cannot come from nothing...and science doesn't make that claim.

 

[LuisDantas]

There are several problems with the idea of a god, particularly a creator god.

Mainly, the world does not present itself as if it were meant to exist. Nor do human beings.

There is also the matter that if we attempt to explain existence with the idea of a creator god, we then have to deal with the origin of God himself. Which is that much harder to explain, particularly when he is supposed to be all-powerful yet also so limited as to make such an imperfect existence.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

How could we logically believe that it came out of nowhere, It wasn't created by no one and the world was like: TADAAAA!!! HERE I COME AND I'VE COME FROM NOWHERE. SUDDENLY I JUST POPPED OUT BOYS!!!

The same way you think God can just exist without a source... Where does Allah come from?

So any imaginable science would be based on nothing then.

As would any religion, by the exact same logic... So, what's your point?

 

[allah lover]

There are several problems with the idea of a god, particularly a creator god.

Isn't there any problem with the idea of world coming out from nothing?

Mainly, the world does not present itself as if it were meant to exist. Nor do human beings.
There is also the matter that if we attempt to explain existence with the idea of a creator god, we then have to deal with the origin of God himself. Which is that much harder to explain, particularly when he is supposed to be all-powerful yet also so limited as to make such an imperfect existence.

What does this suppose to mean?

I mean you prefer the world in an other way?

Like a world with milk rivers? With ice-cream mountains?

What if this world is the only possible world to exist?

How can you believe it is possible to have an other world existed?

A world where Energy comes out of nowhere.

Where sometimes fire burns sometimes it cools things down.

Or a world where everything is brown and soft.

How you know that's possible to have world in another way? So you say THIS world is imperfect?
---

Another thing is how you say this world is imperfect?

Cause it doesn't suit YOUR personal satisfaction?

 

[allah lover]

The same way you think God can just exist without a source... Where does Allah come from?

You want source?

I'll give you source.

Look around yourself!! Yes do it!!

What do you see?

Where those things come from?

All the stars and planets and the list goes on.....

All those things have come out of nowhere? You're kidding me?

How can you believe like that?

As would any religion, by the exact same logic... So, what's your point?

Yes but if we think like that.

If we think that the world have come out of nowhere.

Then science is ridiculous. Then science would be based on nothing.

But if we think a little logical and believe that world can't just come out of nowhere then science can breath.

My point is it's a lot more logical not to think that the world had came out of nowhere.

 

[FranklinMichaelV.3]

You want source?

I'll give you source.

Look around yourself!! Yes do it!!

What do you see?

Where those things come from?

All the stars and planets and the list goes on.....

All those things have come out of nowhere? You're kidding me?

How can you believe like that?



Yes but if we think like that.

If we think that the world have come out of nowhere.

Then science is ridiculous. Then science would be based on nothing.

But if we think a little logical and believe that world can't just come out of nowhere then science can breath.

My point is it's a lot more logical not to think that the world had came out of nowhere.

But science doesn't say it comes from nowhere....

 

[1137]

To say something cannot come from nothing only implies something else, not necessarily a God.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

You want source?

I'll give you source.

Look around yourself!! Yes do it!!

What do you see?

Where those things come from?

All the stars and planets and the list goes on.....

All those things have come out of nowhere? You're kidding me?

How can you believe like that?

I didn't ask where the world came from; I asked where the God that supposedly created the world came from. If you have no answer for that, your argument collapses on itself.

My point is it's a lot more logical not to think that the world had came out of nowhere.

But was created by a god that came from....??? Wait for it... Nowhere.

 

[Poeticus]

What do you see?

Where those things come from?

All the stars and planets and the list goes on.....

Namaste,

That's the biggest strawman of all time.

M.V.

 

[LuisDantas]

Isn't there any problem with the idea of world coming out from nothing?

Perhaps, particularly if one has some expectation of a reason for being.

Predisposition to think of things as necessarily having been created may also cause some disconfort.

However, for practical purposes existence is not really a controversial or difficult idea; we can arrive at plenty of useful, reliable conclusions and findings without any need to first explain how, why or if existence "came to be".

In that sense, there is no need for - and, in fact, no particular help from - the concept of God.

What does this suppose to mean?

Mainly, that I would expect a world created by Divine Will to be markedly different from the one we exist in.

I mean you prefer the world in an other way?

Well, sure. Don't we all wish the world were at least a little bit different in some ways?

Like a world with milk rivers? With ice-cream mountains?

Maybe a world where there is no anencephaly? Or where pregnancy only occurs when a couple actually loves each other and is emotionally prepared to deal with the birth of a new child? Or where it is not really possible to feel oblivious and callous towards the suffering of others?

What if this world is the only possible world to exist?

For practical purposes, it sure seems to be.

How can you believe it is possible to have an other world existed?

If we are allowing for the possibility of a supremely good, all-powerful, all-wise creator God the we must answer why a better world did not come to be, don't we?

A world where Energy comes out of nowhere.

I do not know for certain what you mean here. One can argue that energy does come out of nowhere in our own world. It really depends on how one interprets your meaning.

Where sometimes fire burns sometimes it cools things down.

Or a world where everything is brown and soft.

What about those hypothetical worlds?

How you know that's possible to have world in another way? So you say THIS world is imperfect?

Even taking for granted that no other world is possible, it is still all to clear that this is indeed an imperfect world - often a tragically imperfect one.

Wouldn't a perfect world have, for starters, a lot less war and famine?

---

Another thing is how you say this world is imperfect?

Cause it doesn't suit YOUR personal satisfaction?

You can put it that way if you want, but really, do you think I am being too egotistical here?

 

[FranklinMichaelV.3]

...so can someone please show me where science says something comes from nothing? And is it using nothing the same way the laymen use nothing?

 

[LuisDantas]

If we think that the world have come out of nowhere.

Then science is ridiculous. Then science would be based on nothing.

That, however, is not a premise that science takes or needs.

But if we think a little logical and believe that world can't just come out of nowhere then science can breath.

My point is it's a lot more logical not to think that the world had came out of nowhere.

I don't think you are quite correct on your expectations about the role of science. Why do you think it says that existence came out of nowhere exactly?

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

...so can someone please show me where science says something comes from nothing? And is it using nothing the same way the laymen use nothing?

:sleep:... Did it happen yet?

 

[FranklinMichaelV.3]

:sleep:... Did it happen yet?

Nope

 

[captainbryce]

Hello everyone.

Why some people believe god doesn't exist?

Hello. There are many reasons why people may not be inclined to believe in God. Lack of evidence is usually the main reason. But generally, people choose not to believe for a variety of other reasons as well:

A) They may disillusioned by religion and disagree with (or disapprove of) the principles of religion (or specific religions)

B) They may be persuaded that science can and will explain everything to their satisfaction.

C) They may believe that they personally have no need for a god in their lives (thinking that they can handle all of life's challenges on their own).

D) They may not care whether God exists or not! This generally applies more to agnostics who generally are open to the possibility of God/gods existing, but reject organized religion and do not express a "belief" in anything that can't be proven.

I mean of course we can't see something like god, but I don't get how this make people believe god can't exist.

I mean how logical it is to have such a belief system.

It's no less logical than having a belief system in something just because that something CAN exist. People still need a reason to believe in something, whether it can exist or not. You don't just start believing in something without a reason. And many atheists feel like they have no reason to believe in God, anymore than you have a reason to believe in the flying spaghetti monster.

It's like this:

Hey!! I don't see any space creatures!! So I believe that we are the only existing creatures.

Well, many people (including the religious) DON'T believe that their are space creatures for precisely that reason (among others). On the other hand, there are some who are open to the possibility of space creatures existing, but don't profess a belief in them one way or the other without proof. I agree with you that in principle it is no different. But religious people are typically just as hypocritical about this as skeptics are.

So even if we agree that We haven't find any way to totally prove god existence, does it make God "impossible to exist"?

No. But many skeptics would claim that this isn't the real issue. First of all, very few people have ever claimed that it is "impossible" for God to exist. They simply say that since there is no evidence of his existence, they choose not to believe in him. That is no more or less reasonable on it's own than your position, (ie: choosing to believe in him, in spite of the lack of evidence).

How could we logically believe that it came out of nowhere, It wasn't created by no one and the world was like: TADAAAA!!! HERE I COME AND I'VE COME FROM NOWHERE. SUDDENLY I JUST POPPED OUT BOYS!!!

Which belief is more logical?

to believe that some god created this world or to believe that this world has just popped out, out of nowhere?

Both beliefs are equally logical, and equally illogical. Apply your same argument to God! How did God just come out into existence for no reason? It's the same thing! If one thing is possible, then both are possible, and if one is not possible, then neither should be.

Tell me guys, how you hold such a funny belief?

I don't hold such a belief myself. I am merely playing devil's advocate. I do believe in God. But I also believe in logic, reasoning and constructing sound arguments. And there are some fundamental gaps in logic with regard to your questions.

What do you think about science then?

You think science is dull?

I love science and I believe that science is perfectly harmonious with the bible. I believe that man's lack of understanding (of both) is what seemingly creates conflict between them.

Cause if the world can come out of nothing, So what's the point of scientific knowledge?

That's a non-sequitur. IF the world came out of nothing, then the point of scientific knowledge would be the same as if the world was made by God. The point of scientific knowledge from the standpoint of an atheist is to learn how and why the world came into existence, where our existence is ultimately taking us, and what the point of everything is. The point of scientific knowledge for a theist is to understand how (the method by which) God works.

 

[idav]

To say something cannot come from nothing only implies something else, not necessarily a God.

Throwing god into the equation means something(universe) coming from something eternal (god).

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

Throwing god into the equation means something(universe) coming from something eternal (god).

Why can't the universe itself be eternal?

 

[captainbryce]

Why can't the universe itself be eternal?

A) Because that is not consistent with science (which tells us that it had a definite, singularity beginning, and that it is expanding from that beginning for the past 13.7 billion years)

B) Because even if it COULD, now you've just destroyed your argument against an eternal being existing. The classic argument of "well who created God then?" suddenly holds no water if we acknowledge that something can in fact be "eternal" or have "always existed".

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

B) Because even if it COULD, now you've just destroyed your argument against an eternal being existing. The classic argument of "well who created God then?" suddenly holds no water if we acknowledge that something can in fact be "eternal" or have "always existed".

I never argued that such a thing couldn't exist... I said if God can exist eternally, then by the same logic, why can't anything else (say, the universe)? The problem isn't the assertion that God has no source, it's the assertion that God is the ONLY thing that can have no source.