Why the law of Moses prohibits anal sex

[Simplelogic]

Yeah, because cholera is really only a problem for people in nice areas.

Goodness. Most humans would be fine drinking spring water. The further downstream you go the more hazardous. This whole rabbit trail is getting annoying.

 

[Hawkins]

Was He trying to protect them from acquiring venereal diseases or from being stoned to death?

Ciao

- viole

No. God foresight is in much longer terms. That is, if you choose to twist what is designed to be, you won't live long in the eternal Heaven. That's why Law is laid against those who choose to twist His design purposes but without repenting such that they will be blocked outside the gate of Heaven.

Leviticus 20:13 (NIV)
If a man has sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They are to be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.

 

[viole]

No. God foresight is in much longer terms. That is, if you choose to twist what is designed to be, you won't live long in the eternal Heaven. That's why Law is laid against those who choose to twist His design purposes but without repenting such that they will be blocked outside the gate of Heaven.

Well, His foresight did not work. Gay males are still alive and kicking, so to speak. They are twisting His design all the time. And now they can even marry.

Leviticus 20:13 (NIV)
If a man has sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They are to be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.

Gross. What is the purpose of laying blood on their heads?

Is that the objective source of your moral values?

Ciao

- viole

 

[rosends]

There is no concept in the Tanakh of God creating evil...God did not create Evil, man did.

oh
יוֹצֵר אוֹר וּבוֹרֵא חֹשֶׁךְ, עֹשֶׂה שָׁלוֹם וּבוֹרֵא רָע; אֲנִי יְהוָה, עֹשֶׂה כָל-אֵלֶּה

 

[Simplelogic]

oh
יוֹצֵר אוֹר וּבוֹרֵא חֹשֶׁךְ, עֹשֶׂה שָׁלוֹם וּבוֹרֵא רָע; אֲנִי יְהוָה, עֹשֶׂה כָל-אֵלֶּה

Are you sure you want to go there?

 

[rosends]

Are you sure you want to go there?

you already did. I just quoted a text. You can either claim that the text is wrong, or explain how it says something in accord with what you said. The easiest answer is that the author was lying. Second would be that the text is a misquote. Third is that the words in question mean something else entirely. What is your explanation?

 

[Simplelogic]

"I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things." Isaiah 45:7

These words certainly seem to paint a gut-wrenching picture of God actually admitting to being responsible for creating evil. No thought could be further from the truth or more blasphemous. What God is speaking of is obviously the opposite of "peace", in the same way He contrasted "light" and "darkness". This peace means tranquility of life, and the word translated "evil" more literally means "calamity". Some translations actually use the word "calamity" in this verse instead of "evil". This calamity is the picture of God's judgment on man for his sinful deeds. Many examples of this type of picture could be cited. The great flood was a major calamity and judgment on man. There was judgment in the form of calamity on Sodom and Gomorrah, Pharaoh in Egypt, Israel in the wilderness, and so on. Many times this judgment is called "evil". Here are a couple of examples where the same Hebrew word is used.

And the Lord repented of the evil ("harm" NKJV)which he thought to do unto his people. Exodus 32:14 KJV

"Thus says the Lord: 'Stand in the court of the Lord's house, and speak to all the cities of Judah, which come to worship in the Lord's house, all the words that I command you to speak to them. Do not diminish a word. Perhaps (What? God didn't know for sure?!) everyone will listen and turn from his evil way, that I may relent concerning the evil ("calamity" NKJV)which I purpose to bring on them because of the evil of their doings." Jeremiah 26:2-3

Note: By using the word "perhaps", it should be apparent that God wasn't even sure if the people would repent!

Therefore thus says the Lord God of hosts, the God of Israel: 'Behold, I will bring on Judah and on all the inhabitants of Jerusalem all the evil ("doom" NKJV) that I have pronounced against them; because I have spoken to them but they have not heard, and I have called to them but they have not answered.'" Jeremiah 35:17

These are examples of the same "evil" God was speaking of in Isaiah 45:7. God most certainly did not bring evil into existence as though it would not exist had He not created it.

 

[rosends]

"I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things." Isaiah 45:7

These words certainly seem to paint a gut-wrenching picture of God actually admitting to being responsible for creating evil. No thought could be further from the truth or more blasphemous. What God is speaking of is obviously the opposite of "peace", in the same way He contrasted "light" and "darkness". This peace means tranquility of life, and the word translated "evil" more literally means "calamity". Some translations actually use the word "calamity" in this verse instead of "evil". This calamity is the picture of God's judgment on man for his sinful deeds. Many examples of this type of picture could be cited. The great flood was a major calamity and judgment on man. There was judgment in the form of calamity on Sodom and Gomorrah, Pharaoh in Egypt, Israel in the wilderness, and so on. Many times this judgment is called "evil". Here are a couple of examples where the same Hebrew word is used.

And the Lord repented of the evil ("harm" NKJV)which he thought to do unto his people. Exodus 32:14 KJV

"Thus says the Lord: 'Stand in the court of the Lord's house, and speak to all the cities of Judah, which come to worship in the Lord's house, all the words that I command you to speak to them. Do not diminish a word. Perhaps (What? God didn't know for sure?!) everyone will listen and turn from his evil way, that I may relent concerning the evil ("calamity" NKJV)which I purpose to bring on them because of the evil of their doings." Jeremiah 26:2-3

Note: By using the word "perhaps", it should be apparent that God wasn't even sure if the people would repent!

Therefore thus says the Lord God of hosts, the God of Israel: 'Behold, I will bring on Judah and on all the inhabitants of Jerusalem all the evil ("doom" NKJV) that I have pronounced against them; because I have spoken to them but they have not heard, and I have called to them but they have not answered.'" Jeremiah 35:17

These are examples of the same "evil" God was speaking of in Isaiah 45:7. God most certainly did not bring evil into existence as though it would not exist had He not created it.

Wow. That's a whole lotta nothing. It posits a power outside of God. It claims that God brings about a concept which he did not create. You fill your opening remarks with personal interpretation and subjective inference ("peace means tranquility of life" which is your own understanding). And why is the statement that God created everything "gut wrenching"? My gut isn't wrenched. My faith is strengthened. Why is it blasphemous? In fact, I see your position as blasphemous. And that's as a result of my prayer, study, meditation and contemplation.

And the fact that you rely on other interpretations to tell you what the word in question means is just sad. Haven't you prayed on it yourself? Or do you just hand that authority over to someone else to tell you what words mean? Because the word means "evil."

 

[Simplelogic]

This is another one of your Rabbi's lies. The notion that God somehow created evil and is a part of evil is down right blasphemous!

Wow. That's a whole lotta nothing. It posits a power outside of God. It claims that God brings about a concept which he did not create. You fill your opening remarks with personal interpretation and subjective inference ("peace means tranquility of life" which is your own understanding). And why is the statement that God created everything "gut wrenching"? My gut isn't wrenched. My faith is strengthened. Why is it blasphemous? In fact, I see your position as blasphemous. And that's as a result of my prayer, study, meditation and contemplation.

And the fact that you rely on other interpretations to tell you what the word in question means is just sad. Haven't you prayed on it yourself? Or do you just hand that authority over to someone else to tell you what words mean? Because the word means "evil."

You are touting the same BS logic that Christian Calvanists do. That God is micromanaging the fate of humanity and good and evil are all part of His greater will. VOMIT!! No wonder you can't see past your Rabbi's interpretations. You don't really love God. Nor can you if you believe He behaves this way. You have accepted a view of God's sovereignty which is not congruent with the Tanakh:

Scriptures that indicate God has limited His knowledge.

There are many passages in the Bible that indicate God does not necessarily know what man will do. The following are just a few of them. This picture of a creator who chooses to not know what his creature will do shows up right at the beginning of the Bible in the creation account itself .

"Out of the ground the Lord God formed every beast of the field and every bird of the air, and brought them to Adam to see what he would call them." Genesis 2:19

If God is all-knowing of what man will do, why was He so inquisitive of what Adam would do?

Then the Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. And the Lord regretted that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved in His heart. So the Lord said, "I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth,... for I regret that I have made them." Genesis 6:5-7

How can a wise God do something that He knows He will regret in the future? This passage clearly implies that, had God known when He created man that he would become as evil as he did, He would not have created him! Thus, He did not know. God knew it was a possibility that man could turn toward ultimate evil. That is part of the risk He took in relinquishing control and giving man a free will. But that is not the same as knowing man would become as evil as he did. God had higher hopes for His creation.

But the Lord came down to see the city and the tower which the sons of men had built. And the Lord said, "Indeed, the people are one and they all have one language..." Genesis 11:5,6

Gathering information again! And obviously, it was information He didn't completely possess before.

And the Lord said, "Because the outcry against Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grievous, I will go down now and see whether they have done altogether according to the outcry against it that has come to Me; and if not, I will know." Genesis 18:20,21

It sounds like He didn't know for sure and was going on a fact-finding mission again!

But the Angel of the Lord called to him from heaven and said, "Abraham, Abraham!" And he said, "Here I am." And He said, "Do not lay your hand on the lad, or do anything to him;for now I know that you fear God, since you have not withheld your son, your only son, from Me." Genesis 22:11,12

Again, "now I know", as though He wasn't completely sure before.

Now the word of the Lord came to Samuel, saying, "I greatly regret that I have set up Saul as king, for he has turned back from following Me, and has not performed My commandments." 1Samuel 15:11

How can an intelligent God do something He knew He would wish He hadn't done?

"And they built the high places of Baal which are in the Valley of the Son of Hinnom, to cause their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire to Molech, which I did not command them, nor did it come into My mind that they should do this abomination, to cause Judah to sin." Jeremiah 32:35 (see also Jeremiah 7:31 and 19:5)

God said Himself that it never came into His mind!!

 

[Simplelogic]

Wow. That's a whole lotta nothing. It posits a power outside of God. It claims that God brings about a concept which he did not create. You fill your opening remarks with personal interpretation and subjective inference ("peace means tranquility of life" which is your own understanding). And why is the statement that God created everything "gut wrenching"? My gut isn't wrenched. My faith is strengthened. Why is it blasphemous? In fact, I see your position as blasphemous. And that's as a result of my prayer, study, meditation and contemplation.

And the fact that you rely on other interpretations to tell you what the word in question means is just sad. Haven't you prayed on it yourself? Or do you just hand that authority over to someone else to tell you what words mean? Because the word means "evil."

The Tanakh teaches that there are powers outside of God.

 

[Tumah]

This is another one of your Rabbi's lies. The notion that God somehow created evil and is a part of evil is down right blasphemous!

You are touting the same BS logic that Christian Calvanists do. That God is micromanaging the fate of humanity and good and evil are all part of His greater will. VOMIT!! No wonder you can't see past your Rabbi's interpretations. You don't really love God. Nor can you if you believe He behaves this way. You have accepted a view of God's sovereignty which is not congruent with the Tanakh:

Scriptures that indicate God has limited His knowledge.

There are many passages in the Bible that indicate God does not necessarily know what man will do. The following are just a few of them. This picture of a creator who chooses to not know what his creature will do shows up right at the beginning of the Bible in the creation account itself .

"Out of the ground the Lord God formed every beast of the field and every bird of the air, and brought them to Adam to see what he would call them." Genesis 2:19

If God is all-knowing of what man will do, why was He so inquisitive of what Adam would do?

Then the Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. And the Lord regretted that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved in His heart. So the Lord said, "I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth,... for I regret that I have made them." Genesis 6:5-7

How can a wise God do something that He knows He will regret in the future? This passage clearly implies that, had God known when He created man that he would become as evil as he did, He would not have created him! Thus, He did not know. God knew it was a possibility that man could turn toward ultimate evil. That is part of the risk He took in relinquishing control and giving man a free will. But that is not the same as knowing man would become as evil as he did. God had higher hopes for His creation.

But the Lord came down to see the city and the tower which the sons of men had built. And the Lord said, "Indeed, the people are one and they all have one language..." Genesis 11:5,6

Gathering information again! And obviously, it was information He didn't completely possess before.

And the Lord said, "Because the outcry against Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grievous, I will go down now and see whether they have done altogether according to the outcry against it that has come to Me; and if not, I will know." Genesis 18:20,21

It sounds like He didn't know for sure and was going on a fact-finding mission again!

But the Angel of the Lord called to him from heaven and said, "Abraham, Abraham!" And he said, "Here I am." And He said, "Do not lay your hand on the lad, or do anything to him;for now I know that you fear God, since you have not withheld your son, your only son, from Me." Genesis 22:11,12

Again, "now I know", as though He wasn't completely sure before.

Now the word of the Lord came to Samuel, saying, "I greatly regret that I have set up Saul as king, for he has turned back from following Me, and has not performed My commandments." 1Samuel 15:11

How can an intelligent God do something He knew He would wish He hadn't done?

"And they built the high places of Baal which are in the Valley of the Son of Hinnom, to cause their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire to Molech, which I did not command them, nor did it come into My mind that they should do this abomination, to cause Judah to sin." Jeremiah 32:35 (see also Jeremiah 7:31 and 19:5)

God said Himself that it never came into His mind!!

1. There is already a word used in the Bible for "calamity." It is "איד". So that kind of begs the question: why use a word that at best is an a roundabout reference to it, rather than the correct word?
2. Your verses are not questions unless you believe that G-d looks like a man. If you don't, then any verse that attributes human characteristics to G-d should be understood as metaphors and anthropomorphisms rather than literal.

 

[rosends]

The Tanakh teaches that there are powers outside of God.

you have a vision of a fallible, changeable human concept of God. I'll stick with אֲנִי רִאשׁוֹן וַאֲנִי אַחֲרוֹן, וּמִבַּלְעָדַי אֵין אֱלֹהִים. Have fun with your idea of divinity. It would be difficult to assert, as you have, that the text is perfect and that God does not change (you cited Malachi 3:6 IIRC) when you then say that God is still learning and that there are powers outside his. But have fun with that. May your faith keep you strong and guide you to answers.

 

[Simplelogic]

1. There is already a word used in the Bible for "calamity." It is "איד". So that kind of begs the question: why use a word that at best is an a roundabout reference to it, rather than the correct word?
2. Your verses are not questions unless you believe that G-d looks like a man. If you don't, then any verse that attributes human characteristics to G-d should be understood as metaphors and anthropomorphisms rather than literal.

1.Do you believe that God does evil acts?

2. What you are suggesting is that God is lying to us about Himself. You can cloak it all you want. Christians say the same thing.

 

[Simplelogic]

you have a vision of a fallible, changeable human concept of God. I'll stick with אֲנִי רִאשׁוֹן וַאֲנִי אַחֲרוֹן, וּמִבַּלְעָדַי אֵין אֱלֹהִים. Have fun with your idea of divinity. It would be difficult to assert, as you have, that the text is perfect and that God does not change (you cited Malachi 3:6 IIRC) when you then say that God is still learning and that there are powers outside his. But have fun with that. May your faith keep you strong and guide you to answers.

You have labeled God (something humans have no right to do). The only thing we can do is listen to how God describes Himself. Your logic is terribly flawed and God is the author of all evil on this planet. You would be better off being an atheist then to attribute such lies to His name.

 

[rosends]

You have labeled God (something humans have no right to do). The only thing we can do is listen to how God describes Himself. Your logic is terribly flawed and God is the author of all evil on this planet. You would be better off being an atheist then to attribute such lies to His name.

And you have embraced a notion of a perfect unchanging God who has regrets, learns new things, and has to share power with other forces. That is at least שִׁתּוּף and a problem, or at least it would be, were you Jewish.

 

[JoStories]

This may be a concept within Buddhism but it has nothing to do with the Torah.

BTW…you can't say on the one had that "you are receiving a lesson" only to deny that that very lesson is connected to a greater power.

Yes, Actually, I can. My lessons are for me to learn. My goal is enlightenment but that comes of many lessons from many lifetimes. You don't know nor does it appear that you care to know any other thoughts than your own, and you don;t know mine. IMO, you appear to be a very young soul, one rigid in his thinking and unkind to others who don't willingly kowtow to what you espouse. That's fine, for you. It is not for me, and as such, your posts really have no meaning to me other than to continue to observe the path of those so rigidly set in one mindset as to be frozen.

 

[Simplelogic]

And you have embraced a notion of a perfect unchanging God who has regrets, learns new things, and has to share power with other forces. That is at least שִׁתּוּף and a problem, or at least it would be, were you Jewish.

I let the Tanakh define God. I don't try to mix my God with pagan philosophy which is where your Rabbi's invented their ultra sovereign God concept. I guess all the starving and suffering children of the world should just accept that its just the hand that God dealt them. I guess the same goes for young kids being violently molested. All part of God's greater plan right?

 

[Simplelogic]

Yes, Actually, I can. My lessons are for me to learn. My goal is enlightenment but that comes of many lessons from many lifetimes. You don't know nor does it appear that you care to know any other thoughts than your own, and you don;t know mine. IMO, you appear to be a very young soul, one rigid in his thinking and unkind to others who don't willingly kowtow to what you espouse. That's fine, for you. It is not for me, and as such, your posts really have no meaning to me other than to continue to observe the path of those so rigidly set in one mindset as to be frozen.

This thread is about the Torah. Calm down. I love learning about other peoples religions.

 

[JoStories]

You have labeled God (something humans have no right to do). The only thing we can do is listen to how God describes Himself. Your logic is terribly flawed and God is the author of all evil on this planet. You would be better off being an atheist then to attribute such lies to His name.

It's odd how telling your posts reveal you to be. No Jewish person I have ever known or met spells out the word G*d. NONE. Neither do they consider G*d a "he". Its merely a word of convenience. Furthermore, just two posts earlier, you stated that God was NOT the cause of evil, that man was. And here you state that God is the author of evil on this planet. If you cannot keep your thoughts clear enough to make sense, you might want to step aback a bit so your are not so often removing that foot from your arse. (please forgive the abrupt tone of my post. This poster is stretching my nerves.)

 

[rosends]

I let the Tanakh define God. I don't try to mix my God with pagan philosophy which is where your Rabbi's invented their ultra sovereign God concept. I guess all the starving and suffering children of the world should just accept that its just the hand that God dealt them. I guess the same goes for young kids being violently molested. All part of God's greater plan right?

So you disagree with אֲנִי רִאשׁוֹן וַאֲנִי אַחֲרוֹן, וּמִבַּלְעָדַי אֵין אֱלֹהִים. That's ok. I mean, it is just textual.