eugenius
The Truth Lies Within
yes a rocking cradle should give you the shivers but not a global flood.
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Would it Physically Impossible to Load Up Noah's Arc?
- Thread starter eugenius
- Start date
yes a rocking cradle should give you the shivers but not a global flood.
It should come with a disclaimer. No actual animals were harmed in the telling of this myth.
I want to start this off saying I'm not a conventional believer in God.. I do not claim Christianity as my religion basically because of the corruption that has slowly and utterly fallen onto the many churches of that world (I'm not saying all Christians are corrupt... just that too many are for me to want to associate myself with those types..)
As far as the Biblical Noah story.. I can only give a few reasons why it makes sense at all. FIRST to the Jewish people the 'world' was in fact only a small portion of the actual world, in fact not even the whole of the Middle East.
I believe 'God' (or whatever you want to call it) saw that his people, the Jews, had become corrupt and twisted (this is a theme with the Jewish people throughout the Bible.. and not to knock on Jewish people but... couldn't he have chosen someone else who didn't defy him every three minutes? heh). According to the non-canonical Book of Enoch the world had become corrupted in many ways and so God sent Enoch as a messenger to warn the Jewish World that he was going to destroy them if they didn't play nice. Didnt work out.. so God said, "I liked that Enoch guy, nice fellow", "I will save his grandson, Noah. Yep." So Noah wasn't chosen just because he was 'right with God', but because who he was related too. Makes you wonder about what kind of God that 'god' is...
Anyway... before this gets any longer: the flood was most likely contained only to that region... there are a few other flood stories around the world, but the majority of these tales originate from the Middle East. Since at the time the ME was the center of the civilized world, its the most logical explanation. That being said Noah would only need to gather animals SPECIFICALLY native to that region. If they existed in other regions it would be pointless to bring them aboard.
I know some would say I'm taking the Noah story out of context.. but if you think about it alot of ancient Hebrew writings were written in a very specific way (for example they tended to ignore things outside of the Hebrew World) so it makes since that a 'world-wide flood' might really only mean their world, the "Chosen People's World". And that's not taking the flood as a metaphor, just taking it as what is most logical.
Once again I'm sorry for a very long post.
As far as the Biblical Noah story.. I can only give a few reasons why it makes sense at all. FIRST to the Jewish people the 'world' was in fact only a small portion of the actual world, in fact not even the whole of the Middle East.
I believe 'God' (or whatever you want to call it) saw that his people, the Jews, had become corrupt and twisted (this is a theme with the Jewish people throughout the Bible.. and not to knock on Jewish people but... couldn't he have chosen someone else who didn't defy him every three minutes? heh). According to the non-canonical Book of Enoch the world had become corrupted in many ways and so God sent Enoch as a messenger to warn the Jewish World that he was going to destroy them if they didn't play nice. Didnt work out.. so God said, "I liked that Enoch guy, nice fellow", "I will save his grandson, Noah. Yep." So Noah wasn't chosen just because he was 'right with God', but because who he was related too. Makes you wonder about what kind of God that 'god' is...
Anyway... before this gets any longer: the flood was most likely contained only to that region... there are a few other flood stories around the world, but the majority of these tales originate from the Middle East. Since at the time the ME was the center of the civilized world, its the most logical explanation. That being said Noah would only need to gather animals SPECIFICALLY native to that region. If they existed in other regions it would be pointless to bring them aboard.
I know some would say I'm taking the Noah story out of context.. but if you think about it alot of ancient Hebrew writings were written in a very specific way (for example they tended to ignore things outside of the Hebrew World) so it makes since that a 'world-wide flood' might really only mean their world, the "Chosen People's World". And that's not taking the flood as a metaphor, just taking it as what is most logical.
Once again I'm sorry for a very long post.
eugenius
The Truth Lies Within
So we've got a few for "regional flood", a few for "it's mythical", and many for "it just never happened"
Honestly a world flood is impossible, thats a fact.. no matter how you look at it. Unless 'god' made some kind of 'magical portal' that made the inside of the boat larger then it really was.. which is a load, obviously.
BUT looking at it only from a 'regional flood' makes sense and really doesn't take the Bible out of context, remembering the old testament was a Jewish book written from a Jewish point of view about the Hebrew world.
Then again looking at it from a myth or that it never happened also can make sense.. I'm not trying to tell anyone what is right or wrong. That's the beauty of being human.. we have the free will to make our own decessions.
I simply want to say that a regional flood story about Noah IS possible not saying that "it for fact happened".
BUT looking at it only from a 'regional flood' makes sense and really doesn't take the Bible out of context, remembering the old testament was a Jewish book written from a Jewish point of view about the Hebrew world.
Then again looking at it from a myth or that it never happened also can make sense.. I'm not trying to tell anyone what is right or wrong. That's the beauty of being human.. we have the free will to make our own decessions.
I simply want to say that a regional flood story about Noah IS possible not saying that "it for fact happened".
J Bryson
Well-Known Member
I made no vote as to whether or not a flood actually happened, but rather spoke to as to why some might find value in the story. I don't know enough about Mideastern history at the time to venture an opinion regarding a regional flood.
As far as value... no there isn't any value. I suppose the only point of the story is that 'God' made a promise to watch after his people and he continued to do so by weeding out the bad but keeping the line going. In reality much of the Bible has little relevance to modern society, it simply shows a pattern of what 'God' does, what he is capable of, and how he often reacts to this world... which honestly tends to be in an angry and destructive nature most of the time.. which makes you wonder, I believe in God, I do, but being what kind of creature he really is.. why would anyone choose to worship him??? Anyway that is a topic for a different day.
eugenius
The Truth Lies Within
As far as value... no there isn't any value. I suppose the only point of the story is that 'God' made a promise to watch after his people and he continued to do so by weeding out the bad but keeping the line going. In reality much of the Bible has little relevance to modern society, it simply shows a pattern of what 'God' does, what he is capable of, and how he often reacts to this world... which honestly tends to be in an angry and destructive nature most of the time.. which makes you wonder, I believe in God, I do, but being what kind of creature he really is.. why would anyone choose to worship him??? Anyway that is a topic for a different day.
Why hasn't he done anything since? I assume that he sees us as 1000% "worse" and "evil" as a whole now, as opposed to 5000 years ago?
J Bryson
Well-Known Member
As far as value... no there isn't any value. I suppose the only point of the story is that 'God' made a promise to watch after his people and he continued to do so by weeding out the bad but keeping the line going. In reality much of the Bible has little relevance to modern society, it simply shows a pattern of what 'God' does, what he is capable of, and how he often reacts to this world... which honestly tends to be in an angry and destructive nature most of the time.. which makes you wonder, I believe in God, I do, but being what kind of creature he really is.. why would anyone choose to worship him??? Anyway that is a topic for a different day.
It's an interesting topic, and I obviously (though respectfully) disagree with you. If you'd care to start another thread, I'm willing to discuss it at greater length.
I think he tends to not give a darn about us... I know that isn't what Bible people what you to believe. "God is love"... I don't know if I feel that way. I respect God because he's my 'boss', in a way.. does that mean I have to love him? I personally don't know that answer.
And the world continues to have stuff go wrong. And if you think about it... I said the flood was to punish his own chosen people, the only people he really cares about. If you look at it his chosen people have suffered clamity after clamity, very unfairly I might add. The most recent major one being World War II, but even in the Middle East his chosen people, the Jews, continue to receive unfair persecution.
And the world continues to have stuff go wrong. And if you think about it... I said the flood was to punish his own chosen people, the only people he really cares about. If you look at it his chosen people have suffered clamity after clamity, very unfairly I might add. The most recent major one being World War II, but even in the Middle East his chosen people, the Jews, continue to receive unfair persecution.
painted wolf
Grey Muzzle
I've often wanted to see a small experimental ark run... maybe 1/4th the 'actual size'.
Let's see how plausible it is to cram 1/4th of the animal species into a small space and just how much work it is to keep everyone fed, clean and healthy.
My guess is that it won't work to well... which is why it's never been done.
wa:do
Let's see how plausible it is to cram 1/4th of the animal species into a small space and just how much work it is to keep everyone fed, clean and healthy.
My guess is that it won't work to well... which is why it's never been done.
wa:do
It could be done virtually, with computer modelling. All you need is a supercomputer and a few clever mathematics grad students.
painted wolf
Grey Muzzle
Ah, but computer models never get all the random factors quite right. Like just how much does an elephant poo when it's sea-sick?
wa:do
J Bryson
Well-Known Member
Nah, he was told to use gopher wood, if memory serves.
rojse
RF Addict
Imagine if you loaded up two animals, and one of them were gay.
Perhaps that explains why we don't have unicorns or dragons now.
But here's the thing: if you presuppose a worldwide flood a la the Noah story, you've already taken away the requirement that things have to be physically possible (in the normal sense of the term) in order to happen. The answer to your question is simply "it's a miracle."
And you can't exclude miracles as an explanation because you had to assume them as plausible to answer the previous question of "how could a worldwide flood even happen in the first place?"