Your saved as soon as you accept jesus.

[The Hammer]

If you want to know for yourself if Jesus is the Truth, then you can find out. You have to get his teachings and obey them.

As I stated, I have been there, and done that already. I willfully left Christianity, and my "only hope for being 'saved' "

 

[Yes]

I was Christian for 25 years, and more devout then you know. So don't pretend to know anything about me, thank you.

Maybe I was tempted away by "Satan" as you would say. Or maybe the more I studied Christianity in school, and in church the more I realized it was not for me.

You are a hypocrite. You just got through telling me not to think I know anything about you, and then you told me what I would say for the reason you stopped being a "Christian".

 

[Yes]

As I stated, I have been there, and done that already. I willfully left Christianity, and my "only hope for being 'saved' "

Tell me, how did you obey Jesus.

 

[The Hammer]

You are a hypocrite. You just got through telling me not to think I know anything about you, and then you told me what I would say for the reason you stopped being a "Christian".

Never claimed to not be one. But in all fairness this is your exact wording, from a previous post:

"When Satan came to earth, he made copy-cat stories, and promoted gods of stone and wood."

I worship Gods of wood and stone, and was therefore "tempted" by Satan. I didn't make an assumption about you. I made a statement based on your previous response.

 

[The Hammer]

Tell me, how did you obey Jesus.

Obeyed 10 commandments. Showed nothing but love and respect for everyone, church every sabbath, prayed daily (not for things, or help, just in reverence). I basically tried to be as Christ-like in all of my activities as I could. I don't have much more in way of details, as they are escaping me at this hour.

 

[serp777]

I think the premise of us needing to be saved is completely flawed.

Jesus was here to be a scape goat for the non existent sins of a non existent fore bearer (Adam), in order to forgive us from himself, in order to save us from himself. its thoroughly incomprehensible. And he did so by getting himself killed and tortured, which isn't much different from suicide. What could possibly be the message of this when he could just forgive us easily? he is all powerful after all and sets all the rules. The whole idea that we are born sick because of the sins committed by someone else, and that we need to be redeemed is just disgusting. Just because my ancestors allegedly did something wrong doesn't mean I did. it makes God seem like a cosmic sadaam Hussein, which is insulting to God.

 

[Yes]

Obeyed 10 commandments. Showed nothing but love and respect for everyone, church every sabbath, prayed daily (not for things, or help, just in reverence). I basically tried to be as Christ-like in all of my activities as I could. I don't have much more in way of details, as they are escaping me at this hour.

You said nothing about fearing God, admitting you are a sinner, being sorry for your sins, confessing your sins and repenting of them.
We do not have to go to church, and Jesus is our Sabbath rest.

 

[Yes]

I think the premise of us needing to be saved is completely flawed.

Jesus was here to be a scape goat for the non existent sins of a non existent fore bearer (Adam), in order to forgive us from himself, in order to save us from himself. its thoroughly incomprehensible. And he did so by getting himself killed and tortured, which isn't much different from suicide. What could possibly be the message of this when he could just forgive us easily? he is all powerful after all and sets all the rules. The whole idea that we are born sick because of the sins committed by someone else, and that we need to be redeemed is just disgusting. Just because my ancestors allegedly did something wrong doesn't mean I did. it makes God seem like a cosmic sadaam Hussein, which is insulting to God.

Jesus is the Greatest Love ever known.

 

[Willamena]

You're saved as soon as you accept spellchecker.

 

[serp777]

Jesus is the Greatest Love ever known.

That literally addresses nothing i've said. I'll post it again.

I think the premise of us needing to be saved is completely flawed.

Jesus was here to be a scape goat for the non existent sins of a non existent fore bearer (Adam), in order to forgive us from himself, in order to save us from himself. its thoroughly incomprehensible. And he did so by getting himself killed and tortured, which isn't much different from suicide. What could possibly be the message of this when he could just forgive us easily? he is all powerful after all and sets all the rules. The whole idea that we are born sick because of the sins committed by someone else, and that we need to be redeemed is just disgusting. Just because my ancestors allegedly did something wrong doesn't mean I did. it makes God seem like a cosmic sadaam Hussein, which is insulting to God.

 

[Yes]

That literally addresses nothing i've said. I'll post it again.

I think the premise of us needing to be saved is completely flawed.

Jesus was here to be a scape goat for the non existent sins of a non existent fore bearer (Adam), in order to forgive us from himself, in order to save us from himself. its thoroughly incomprehensible. And he did so by getting himself killed and tortured, which isn't much different from suicide. What could possibly be the message of this when he could just forgive us easily? he is all powerful after all and sets all the rules. The whole idea that we are born sick because of the sins committed by someone else, and that we need to be redeemed is just disgusting. Just because my ancestors allegedly did something wrong doesn't mean I did. it makes God seem like a cosmic sadaam Hussein, which is insulting to God.

You know nothing. Where should one start?
Jesus is the Greatest Lover ever known.

 

[serp777]

You know nothing. Where should one start?
Jesus is the Greatest Lover ever known.

Start anywhere. I've never met a Christian who has been able to rebuttal this. I usually get some response like "You don't understand Christainity." But I was a christian when i was a kid and dropped it because no one could answer my questions.

Muslims would say Muhammad is the greatest lover ever known. And the greatest lover makes Jesus sound like a pornstar or something.

 

[The Hammer]

You said nothing about fearing God, admitting you are a sinner, being sorry for your sins, confessing your sins and repenting of them.
We do not have to go to church, and Jesus is our Sabbath rest.

Kinda thought that was tit-for-tat with saying I was Christian. That kinda goes with the territory. You said how did I obey Jesus. Not how did I obey God. Sure, though, I did not specifically mention that.

 

[Yes]

Start anywhere.

I did. I said Jesus is the Greatest Love every known.
If Jesus did not leave his place in heaven and come to earth to die for us, you would not know the Greatest Love ever known.

I've never met a Christian who has been able to rebuttal this. I usually get some response like "You don't understand Christainity." But I was a christian when i was a kid and dropped it because no one could answer my questions.

You need to find out for yourself. You have to do that by obeying Jesus. Jesus reveals himself to those who get his teachings and obeys them. We get understanding after we obey.

Muslims would say Muhammad is the greatest lover ever known. And the greatest lover makes Jesus sound like a pornstar or something.

Muhammad was not said to be sinless, to have come from heaven, and to die for us. Muhammad lived a very worldly life.

 

[serp777]

I did. I said Jesus is the Greatest Love every known.
If Jesus did not leave his place in heaven and come to earth to die for us, you would not know the Greatest Love ever known.


You need to find out for yourself. You have to do that by obeying Jesus. Jesus reveals himself to those who get his teachings and obeys them. We get understanding after we obey.



Muhammad was not said to be sinless, to have come from heaven, and to die for us. Muhammad lived a very worldly life.

Saying Jesus is the greatest love doesn't start anywhere. That's just an allegation and it doesn't explain any of the logical issues with the christian story as i've posted. Can you maybe respond about how you reconcile Jesus being a scape goat? Or how about the fact that we are born sick and that we are associated with the sins committed by other people and the sins of a non existent adam?Or how about the fact that Jesus basically committed suicide by getting himself killed?

"You need to find out for yourself. You have to do that by obeying Jesus."

This is a cop out. its like saying "I can't explain it to you, so i'll just tell you to figure it out so i don't have to address it." Might I remind you that the apostles received the words and explanations of Jesus, as well as the various miracles, and the resurrection; And yet i'm expected to just know the answers? I'm asking you how to explain it. I don't think you CAN explain it. prove me wrong.

We get understanding after we obey.

What? That's not how the apostles were convinced. They didn't obey at first. They got understanding first. Why am I expected to obey first? God designed us to be skeptical. he knows what it would take to convince us and he has infinite power. If he cares about belief, why not just re arrange the stars in aramaic to write Yahweh is here?

 

[Desert Snake]

Ok, so I may have made some assumptions about the OP. There was a lot of wiggle room IMO, since the intent of the post, and the view of the poster (you) was not made very clear.

If you think I misrepresented then I will apologize.

I don't care. It's not like I was going to be able to convince you of anything anyway. See, that's why you are presenting strawman arguments, they are trying to negate my beliefs as opposed to presenting anything substantial. First clue you don't have a substantial argument in the first place.

 

[Desert Snake]

I am a Hindu. By 'we' I mean the Hindus. Remember the brightest of diamonds, Kohinoor, is from India. What do you know about diamonds!

That makes no sense. Anything remotely on topic?

 

[Yes]

Saying Jesus is the greatest love doesn't start anywhere. That's just an allegation and it doesn't explain any of the logical issues with the christian story as i've posted. Can you maybe respond about how you reconcile Jesus being a scape goat? Or how about the fact that we are born sick and that we are associated with the sins committed by other people and the sins of a non existent adam?Or how about the fact that Jesus basically committed suicide by getting himself killed?

Jesus is the Greatest Love ever known. You would not know that if he had not come to earth and died for us.

This is a cop out. its like saying "I can't explain it to you, so i'll just tell you to figure it out so i don't have to address it." Might I remind you that the apostles received the words and explanations of Jesus, as well as the various miracles, and the resurrection; And yet i'm expected to just know the answers?

How do you get that you are expected to just know the answer when I told you to get Jesus' teachings and obey them?

I'm asking you how to explain it. I don't think you CAN explain it. prove me wrong.

I am explaining it to you, and I am telling you how to get understanding.

What? That's not how the apostles were convinced. They didn't obey at first. They got understanding first.

The Apostles obeyed Jesus. Jesus told his Apostles to obey his teachings and then he would reveal himself to them See John 14:21.

Why am I expected to obey first? God designed us to be skeptical. he knows what it would take to convince us and he has infinite power. If he cares about belief, why not just re arrange the stars in aramaic to write Yahweh is here?

The Father and Jesus make their home with those who love them by obeying, Those are the people Jesus reveals himself.

We have to prepare our hearts for Jesus to live in our hearts.

 

[The Hammer]

I don't care. It's not like I was going to be able to convince you of anything anyway. See, that's why you are presenting strawman arguments, they are trying to negate my beliefs as opposed to presenting anything substantial. First clue you don't have a substantial argument in the first place.

I was not on this thread to defend my beliefs, as mine were not presented. I was on here to ask questions about the beliefs posted in the OP. Whether or not I got them wrong in your opinion is of no consequence, again. I asked a question and instead of having my questions answered. I continue to get berated by 3 separate people, because my views are not in line with yours. You try to turn it around and make me look like that bad guy, for asking simple questions, that I thought someone with religious views would kind enough to answer. I mean, I did answer your question of me. Please, you want to turn this around and question my beliefs go ahead. I will present a defense.

 

[Desert Snake]

I think the premise of us needing to be saved is completely flawed.

Jesus was here to be a scape goat for the non existent sins of a non existent fore bearer (Adam), in order to forgive us from himself, in order to save us from himself.

Totally incorrect.

its thoroughly incomprehensible

Well, yeah, because it's wrong.

. And he did so by getting himself killed and tortured, which isn't much different from suicide. What could possibly be the message of this when he could just forgive us easily? he is all powerful after all and sets all the rules. The whole idea that we are born sick because of the sins committed by someone else, and that we need to be redeemed is just disgusting.

That's some extreme made up position of some church adherents, it's not biblical at all.

Just because my ancestors allegedly did something wrong doesn't mean I did. it makes God seem like a cosmic sadaam Hussein, which is insulting to God.

Uh......right. o.k. Well, if you are talking about Jesus sacrificing Himself in order to forgive the sins of Adam, totally wrong! Jesus sacrificed Himself for the sins of His followers, has nothing to do with ''''''''''original sin'''''''''''''''''''//just some church term, it's irrelevant here.