No, I do not mean that. I asked way back in the beginning of this thread if every bedouin has read the Quran. Does every bedouin even know to read? So if they cannot read, is the Quran superficial? Are those bedouins not Muslim?
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Don't the Hinduism (Dharmic) people need a concise Scripture?
- Thread starter paarsurrey
- Start date
No, I do not mean that. I asked way back in the beginning of this thread if every bedouin has read the Quran. Does every bedouin even know to read? So if they cannot read, is the Quran superficial? Are those bedouins not Muslim?
paarsurrey
Veteran Member
Quran is Recitation, people learn it by heart, all or a part of Quran, they don't need to know writing or reading. Muhammad learned from G-d and from him his companions, this system has always existed side by side with the written Quran, one supporting the other. Right? Please
Regards
That's how the Vedas and Puranas were passed along before being written down. And people still learn by recitation. Maybe I truly am dense, but I still really don't understand what all your fuss is about. Hinduism and the Vedas have done very nicely for several thousands of years without any help from outsiders.
paarsurrey
Veteran Member
It will be just in appreciation of the Word of G-d in Vedas and Puranas. Is it bad? Please
Regards
Of course its not bad. (Hindus, at least most of us, don't believe in 'bad', as you're using it.) But neither is it necessary. Is it necessary in Islam to read the Koran?
That is interesting to note, and points towards one of the most significant differences between Islam and Hinduism. All of the below is my sincere outsider impression, so please feel free to correct as convenient or needed.
Islam feels to me a lot like an exalted bet. It relies entirely on the idea that there is a Creator God that gave humanity the gift of the Qur'an. Almost as necessary is to believe that any religious shortcomings or mistakes will definitely be the fault of the human element.
Hinduism, by contrast, offers a wide variety of stances towards the deity concept, up to and including rejecting its use entirely. And it has a lot more sympathy, if not outright respect, towards the human element. Choosing who to trust and who to follow is a very important part of Hindu practice, and the quality of the practice will definitely be affected by that decision. A skilled Guru will not only take responsibility for his use of any scriptures he might connect to, he will also offer his or her own interpretation and comments and encourage the students to do likewise. The Vedas, Upanishads and other texts are wonderful (and very inspiring) resources, but they are not nearly as indispensable to Hindu practice as the Qur'an is to Muslim practice. The teachings (Dharma) are gloriously personal and customizable, and in such customization one finds Hinduism's strength: it is not afraid to fix its own missteps as needed.
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paarsurrey
Veteran Member
Yes, for sure. It is all due to the wrong understandings of Quran due to the human element, errors of omission and or commission on the human part.
I agree with you, if I have correctly understood one.
Regards
paarsurrey
Veteran Member
It is your wrong understanding. I don't agree with you. Please
Regards
It is ok to disagree, but maybe you can tell me how you do?
Edited to add: and maybe it should fall to actual adherents to Hinduism to correct my understanding of Hinduism?
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And that is why, perhaps ironically, Islam can never suit each and every human being. It forbids itself from taking the actions that would be necessary to reach such an admitedly ambitious goal.
Islam requires monotheism, and of a very specific form at that. And it fails to take the very necessary step of giving human resourcefulness and intent some credit,
Some people may live under such expectations with various degrees of confort. But it is a flaw as opposed to a strength of Islam that it expects such exotic beliefs of everyone.
paarsurrey
Veteran Member
One makes a merit a demerit and a demerit a merit? Sorry, one is simply wrong. I don't agree with one here.
Regards
Regards
I realize you don't, but may you please specify what you are disagreeing with?
Actually @LuisDantas seems to be pretty spot on. Hinduism is like a living organism. It evolves and adapts as it goes. Scripture is fine to read and understand but is not required. It is up to the individual to find their own path.
Luis, I personally think your understanding of Hinduism is really good ... better than many Hindus, on a certain level.
It is also my view that on this discussion, Paarsurrey has repeatedly shown a poor understanding of Hinduism.
Thanks, pals. I feel flattered.
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
Oh, that was about the historical understanding of RigVeda. Of course, he was a theist and I am an atheist. Our religious views differ.
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
Oh yeah, Parsurrey has seen them, seen them all. There is earth, there is sun, there is land which Allah created by parting the ocean for humans to live. And then, there is the Moon, which Allah 'rent' in two, if you see with the help of the Islamic telescope. Who makes the air blow, the rivers sun, it is Allah only.
You may be surprised to know that the two books do compute for 2.2 billion Christians, 1.6 billion Muslims.
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One factor that may help explain the popularity of the Abrahamics is that they are comparably accessible, at least at first glance. One may presumably learn of Islam in a single day and recite the Shahada in less than a minute. If I am not mistaken that would be enough to make that person a Muslim. It is not really much more difficult for Christianity or even the Bahai Faith.
By contrast, we Dharmi have a considerable amount of additional responsibility and work even at the first stages of the faith. I must assume that discourages a considerable number of people.
Still, I don't think that is an actual deficiency but rather a feature. The way I see it we are always responsible for our beliefs even and perhaps most of all when we don't truly understand their full meanings and consequences. Dharmic religion tends not to gloss over that, leading to an overall significantly more substantial religious experience.
By contrast, we Dharmi have a considerable amount of additional responsibility and work even at the first stages of the faith. I must assume that discourages a considerable number of people.
Still, I don't think that is an actual deficiency but rather a feature. The way I see it we are always responsible for our beliefs even and perhaps most of all when we don't truly understand their full meanings and consequences. Dharmic religion tends not to gloss over that, leading to an overall significantly more substantial religious experience.
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
Oh yes, Paarsurrey. Appreciation of God's word in Vedas is not bad, however Puranas are not considered to be the word of God. They are like Sahih.
Words of Vedas have sparks of brilliance which you hardly find in any other book. My all time favorite is 'Nasadiya Sukta'. If Einstein, Heisenberg, Planck, Sagan and Hawking were to write poetry, they would have said what 'Nasadiya' said more than 3,000 years ago.
"Sages who searched with their heart's thought discovered the existent's kinship in the non-existent. ..
Who verily knows and who can here declare it, whence it was born and whence comes this creation?
The Gods are later than this world's production. Who knows then whence it first came into being?"
http://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/rigveda/rv10129.htm
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Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
Yeah, Mohammad was an illiterate. He was only repeating what Allah's word that Gabriel was bringing to him including when Allah asked him to marry the wife of his step son, or when Allah said it is not necessary for Mohammad to treat all his wives equally or when Allah asked him not to deny sex to himself. Each word of Al-Quran is from Allah. Mohammad did not write even a word of it.
And circumcision. Don't know why the foreskin mattered so much to Allah. And if it did matter, why did not he create men without the foreskin?
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