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  1. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    But I didn't ask what thought is not a cause of generosity. Instead I asked what thought is a cause of generosity. So the question remains unanswered: What is the generous thought (which is not greed) that is a cause of generosity?
  2. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    (I think I have the answer, if you're unsure. I can give you my opinion, and you can tell me if you agree.)
  3. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    [emoji4] So we agree that hate is the thought that is a cause of murder, and lust is the thought that is a cause of adultery. So then, what is the thought that is a cause of generosity?
  4. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    I agree. So generosity is a generous action caused by a generous thought, I think. Don't you?
  5. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    Yes, we agree about these vices. Perhaps we will agree about virtues as well. Consider generosity: I'm thinking generous thoughts aren't generosity but generous actions--such as giving money to a charity--can be generosity. Are you thinking the same?
  6. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    Yes, that is a more accurate way is saying it. It seems we agree that hate causes murder and lust causes adultery, or at least these thoughts are contributing causes to these actions. I think this is true. How about you?
  7. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    Yes, that makes sense to me! Now a couple of other examples: Hate and lust. These appear to me to be opposites of murder and adultery in a way. It seems to me that: (1) Hateful thoughts are hate, but hateful actions aren't hate and (2) Lustful thoughts are lust, but lustful actions aren't...
  8. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    Yes, now that you put it that way, I think you might be right. So a murderous thought is not murder, but a murderous action is murder. I now agree. What about adultery? I now think that--like murder--an adulterous thought is not adultery, but an adulterous action is adultery. Do we still agree?
  9. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    Or do we not agree about what murder sometimes is?
  10. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    Yes, I think my answer is similar to your own. Both thoughts and actions can be called murderous, though one does not necessarily have to actually kill someone to commit murder. Is this what you are thinking, too?
  11. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    Please explain. Do you mean murder is usually a thought, but sometimes both a thought and an action?
  12. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    I'd like to respond to this later, when I have time.
  13. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    OK, how's this? Is it at all possible that the action of purposefully killing an innocent human being who does not want to die an action we might sometimes--though not always--accurately say is murder?
  14. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    I'll be happy to reply, when I have time.
  15. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    OK, is this question more precise? Is the action of killing an innocent human being who does not want to die an action we might say is murder? (It's not a trick question, just a simple one.)
  16. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    Thank you. So let's consider this thought--the one we call forgiveness--by way of comparison. For example, murder. It begins with a thought (a murderous desire) and ends in an action (an act of killing an innocent human being). Please let me ask the question I've asked myself: Is the act of...
  17. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    If there is nothing else you want to add at the moment, I'd like to ask some questions about your idea that forgiving actions are not forgiving--the same questions I've asked myself. That way I can see if you come to different conclusions than me, so that I might understand why. [emoji4]
  18. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    Yes. So let's consider your idea more carefully, if that's OK. Or did you first have something else to say, which you want me to consider?
  19. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    Agreed.
  20. Spockrates

    Wondering About Forgiveness

    You're second reply was close to what I was going to say! [emoji4]
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