20 Signs that God exist, and Quraan is the word of God

[Sabour]

Maybe as you go through life, you'll have the opportunity to meet some gays. I hope so. Walk a mile in their shoes. Walk a mile in everyone's shoes, every chance you get.

When I walk a mile in there shoes I see them wishing they were not that way.

Believe me, I do that a lot, the walking in every ones shoes. And when I do that, I make sure I adapt their way of thinking and not mine. Cz otherwise I won't be in their shoes. I will be still in mine.

I've seen young boys who seemed so effeminate to me that I assumed they would grow up to be gay. My main experience with young gays was in college, when I was around a lot of them and able to observe a bit. I've read many stories of young boys whose parents knew they were gay before the child hit puberty.

And I know some people who look gay on the first sight because of the way they approach and react to things. But they are not.

I don't think that tells much.

Really, you don't know what you are talking about. May I suggest that you reserve your certainty about things until you've had a bit more experience with those things? You say lots of stuff here in your messages which is simply untrue.


Don't let your Quranic/Muslim Truth overwhelm the truth which you can observe out in the world. That will lead to terrible confusion. As with evolution, for example. If you believe that evolution is untrue -- because you think that's what your Perfect Book says -- then you will be unable to process information which comes directly to your eyes and ears as you go about life.

Same with gays. Observe them. Then try to understand how your observations fit with Quranic verses.

I didn't completely rule out the possibility. I am aware that many scientists say that one may be born this way. But I also saw many scientists saying no it is the actions and the way they were raised.

So I think there is a matter of belief in the subject because you can't clearly study it and adapt an opinion.

 

[Sabour]

that the Earth was flat, and that promiscuous women cause earthquakes.

And that is another proof why Quraan is the word of God.

 

[cocokorina]

I call myself Muslim because i submitted and surrendered myself to the creator.

I affirm my faith in Allah, His angels, His Books, His meeting, His Apostles, and i believe in Resurrection and i believe in Qadr (Divine Decree)

You don't know even what Muslim means,we don't pray to Muhammed or Muslims to him but to the creator.

Now what Hadith i want to accept or which Hadith i want to refuse is simply not of your own business.

How i want to pray,or if i don't want to pray is also not of your own business.

this is the tactic all muslims use. when it comes to hadith that you dont like, then you either call them 'false' or simply say that you dont believe in hadith.
when quran is taken out of of 'context', then you use hadith, and tafsir to explain the context. tafsir were also narrated by sahabas who narrated hadith. its okay to take hadith to make islam look peaceful and great but not when it shows the true colors of islam.
yes i know muslims donot pray to mohammad. but i know that muslims have set guideline of how they pray and how the imam leads prayer in the masjid. the fact that you're beating around the bush and not answering how you pray and if you even perform wudu before prayers simply shows how dishonest you're being when it comes to the importance of hadith. the fact that first you bring up 'shia' prayer difference, and then denying any knowledge of Ali, Hussain or battle karbala just shows how you're trying desperately to hide the importance of hadith and narrations by sahabas.

 

[FearGod]

this is the tactic all muslims use. when it comes to hadith that you dont like, then you either call them 'false' or simply say that you dont believe in hadith.
when quran is taken out of of 'context', then you use hadith, and tafsir to explain the context. tafsir were also narrated by sahabas who narrated hadith. its okay to take hadith to make islam look peaceful and great but not when it shows the true colors of islam.
yes i know muslims donot pray to mohammad. but i know that muslims have set guideline of how they pray and how the imam leads prayer in the masjid. the fact that you're beating around the bush and not answering how you pray and if you even perform wudu before prayers simply shows how dishonest you're being when it comes to the importance of hadith. the fact that first you bring up 'shia' prayer difference, and then denying any knowledge of Ali, Hussain or battle karbala just shows how you're trying desperately to hide the importance of hadith and narrations by sahabas.

You gave me a verse and you asked me to interpret it without relying on any hadith and i did and the others also did and you lost the debate.

I explained to you what Islam means and which is submitting oneself to God,so i am a Muslim.

Now you are asking me how i am a Muslim and not praying in the mosque behind the Imam.

My reply will be "because i am submitting myself to the creator",then you ask me again,how you don't pray in the mosque and call yourself a Muslim.

Don't you ever heard about quranists, we believe every word in the quran but very strict regarding the hadith,it is as simple as that.

You know that the hadith was collected long after the death of the prophet and there was no reward for memorizing the hadith which isn't the case with the quran which Muslims had memorized it by heart.

What you call the Muslims who lived before the collection of the hadith, were they not Muslims because there was no book of the hadith.

Do you think you are a Muslim because of praying,what if a hypocrite

Matthew 6:5 [ Prayer ] “And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full.

 

[beenie]

What you call the Muslims who lived before the collection of the hadith, were they not Muslims because there was no book of the hadith.

This, right here, is an excellent question. I look forward to an answer, and not some contrived, brainwashed gibberish.

 

[Sabour]

This, right here, is an excellent question. I look forward to an answer, and not some contrived, brainwashed gibberish.

They were muslims who were following the Quraan, the teaching of the prophet and working by what he said (the hadith).

Because they lived these they don't need a book to know what the prophet said. They used to live with him.

So were they working by the hadith? Yes.

 

[FearGod]

They were muslims who were following the Quraan, the teaching of the prophet and working by what he said (the hadith).

Because they lived these they don't need a book to know what the prophet said. They used to live with him.

So were they working by the hadith? Yes.

What if Bukhari didn't have the idea of authoring a book about the sayings and the actions of the prophet ?

Bukhari was a Persian and he traveled to Mecca to author his book,so if the hadith was indeed in need,then why not being authored all along with the quran,why waiting for Bukhari to think about it ?

Why the prophet didn't ask them to record all his actions and sayings the time he was alive,why the need to remember what he had said or what he had did long after his death,that doesn't make sense.

I am OK with the hadith and it was a great intelligent work but if it was indeed needed then the prophet will be the first one asking for it.

 

[Sabour]

What if Bukhari didn't have the idea of authoring a book about the sayings and the actions of the prophet ?

Bukhari was a Persian and he traveled to Mecca to author his book,so if the hadith was indeed in need,then why not being authored all along with the quran,why waiting for Bukhari to think about it ?

Why the prophet didn't ask them to record all his actions and sayings the time he was alive,why the need to remember what he had said or what he had did long after his death,that doesn't make sense.

I am OK with the hadith and it was a great intelligent work but if it was indeed needed then the prophet will be the first one asking for it.

I disagree.

The prophet didn't ask for the compiling for the Quraan

 

[FearGod]

I disagree.

The prophet didn't ask for the compiling for the Quraan

But the verses were recorded once revealed to him,the quran was memorized by heart aside of writing it down once it was revealed to him.

the Prophet Muhammad himself could neither read nor write, he dictated the verses orally and instructed scribes to mark down the revelation on whatever materials were available: tree branches, stones, leather, and bones. The scribes would then read their writing back to the Prophet, who would check it for mistakes. With each new verse that was revealed, the Prophet Muhammad also dictated its placement within the growing body of text. When the Prophet Muhammad died, the Quran has been fully written down. It was not in book form, however. It was recorded on different parchments and materials, held in the possession of the Companions of the Prophet.

Reference : Compilation of the Quran

The question remains,why the haditاh wasn't recorded and compiled similar to the quran ?

 

[Sabour]

But the verses were recorded once revealed to him,the quran was memorized by heart aside of writing it down once it was revealed to him.

the Prophet Muhammad himself could neither read nor write, he dictated the verses orally and instructed scribes to mark down the revelation on whatever materials were available: tree branches, stones, leather, and bones. The scribes would then read their writing back to the Prophet, who would check it for mistakes. With each new verse that was revealed, the Prophet Muhammad also dictated its placement within the growing body of text. When the Prophet Muhammad died, the Quran has been fully written down. It was not in book form, however. It was recorded on different parchments and materials, held in the possession of the Companions of the Prophet.

Reference : Compilation of the Quran

The question remains,why the haditاh wasn't recorded and compiled similar to the quran ?

Yep I know the story. My point was he didn't ask them to compile it.

As for hadith, It is impossible to ask someone to write it down while you are talking. It doesn't sound right. The idea is that over time, the saying of someone would become less and less. Because people will start forgetting.


If you look at the way of Bukhari collected hadith, you will know how authentic it is.

 

[FearGod]

Yep I know the story. My point was he didn't ask them to compile it.

As for hadith, It is impossible to ask someone to write it down while you are talking. It doesn't sound right. The idea is that over time, the saying of someone would become less and less. Because people will start forgetting.


If you look at the way of Bukhari collected hadith, you will know how authentic it is.

I am not talking about authentication.

My point is that the book of hadith was an idea of a man and not the prophet.

The prophet asked them to keep and memorize the quran.
Investigating and collecting the hadith was a good idea but can't be anything else.

 

[Sabour]

I am not talking about authentication.

My point is that the book of hadith was an idea of a man and not the prophet.

The prophet asked them to keep and memorize the quran.
Investigating and collecting the hadith was a good idea but can't be anything else.

Okay so you are okay with authenticity.

You agree it was a good idea.

You accept the prophet.

You accept the quraan which says follow the teaching of the prophet and that he was a good example.

What is the problem with the hadith than?

 

[FearGod]

Okay so you are okay with authenticity.

You agree it was a good idea.

You accept the prophet.

You accept the quraan which says follow the teaching of the prophet and that he was a good example.

What is the problem with the hadith than?

My problem with it,OK

Explain this hadith

The Prophet [FONT=Helvetica, Arial][FONT=Helvetica, Arial]

[/FONT][/FONT] said, "Were dogs not a species of creature I should command that they all be killed; but kill every pure black one." [Muslim, Narrated AbuDharr: "...The black dog is a devil."]

 

[Sabour]

What is the rating? Can you relate in arabic ? Or book or number ?

 

[FearGod]

What is the rating? Can you relate in arabic ? Or book or number ?

(1) Narrated Abdullah ibn Mughaffal: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: Were dogs not a species of creature I should command that they all be killed; but kill every pure black one. (Book #16, Hadith #2839)


(2) Narrated Jabir ibn Abdullah: The Prophet of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) ordered to kill dogs, and we were even killing a dog which a woman brought with her from the desert. Afterwards he forbade to kill them, saying: Confine yourselves to the type which is black. (Book #16, Hadith #2840)

Search the word black dog in the Hadith (Hadis) Books (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Sahih Muslim, Sunan Abu-Dawud, and Malik's Muwatta)

 

[Sabour]

(1) Narrated Abdullah ibn Mughaffal: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: Were dogs not a species of creature I should command that they all be killed; but kill every pure black one. (Book #16, Hadith #2839)


(2) Narrated Jabir ibn Abdullah: The Prophet of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) ordered to kill dogs, and we were even killing a dog which a woman brought with her from the desert. Afterwards he forbade to kill them, saying: Confine yourselves to the type which is black. (Book #16, Hadith #2840)

Search the word black dog in the Hadith (Hadis) Books (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Sahih Muslim, Sunan Abu-Dawud, and Malik's Muwatta)

عن جابر بن عبد الله رضي الله عنه قال : أمَرَنا رَسُولُ اللهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم بِقَتْلِ الكِلابِ ، حَتَّى إِنَّ المَرْأةَ تَقْدُمُ مِنَ البَادِيَةِ بِكَلْبِهَا فَنَقْتُلُهُ ، ثُمَّ نَهَى النَّبيُّ صلى الله عليه وسلم عَنْ قَتْلِهَا ، وَقَالَ ( عَلَيْكُمْ بِالأسْوَدِ البَهِيمِ ذِي النُّقْطَتَيْنِ فَإنَّهُ شَيْطَانٌ ) .
رواه مسلم ( 1572 ) .
قال النووي – رحمه الله – : ” معنى ( البهيم ) : الخالص السواد ، وأما النقطتان : فهما نقطتان معروفتان بيضاوان فوق عينيه ، وهذا مشاهد معروف ” انتهى من ” شرح مسلم ” ( 10 / 237 ) .


The words I highlighted are missing from the hadith. I am not sure how to explain them in english. Please check

 

[FearGod]

عن جابر بن عبد الله رضي الله عنه قال : أمَرَنا رَسُولُ اللهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم بِقَتْلِ الكِلابِ ، حَتَّى إِنَّ المَرْأةَ تَقْدُمُ مِنَ البَادِيَةِ بِكَلْبِهَا فَنَقْتُلُهُ ، ثُمَّ نَهَى النَّبيُّ صلى الله عليه وسلم عَنْ قَتْلِهَا ، وَقَالَ ( عَلَيْكُمْ بِالأسْوَدِ البَهِيمِ ذِي النُّقْطَتَيْنِ فَإنَّهُ شَيْطَانٌ ) .
رواه مسلم ( 1572 ) .
قال النووي – رحمه الله – : ” معنى ( البهيم ) : الخالص السواد ، وأما النقطتان : فهما نقطتان معروفتان بيضاوان فوق عينيه ، وهذا مشاهد معروف ” انتهى من ” شرح مسلم ” ( 10 / 237 ) .


The words I highlighted are missing from the hadith. I am not sure how to explain them in english. Please check

All agree that it means the black dog is Satan.

 

[Sabour]

All agree that it means the black dog is Satan.

Actually the part I had trouble translating is this one البَهِيمِ ذِي النُّقْطَتَيْنِ

 

[Gjallarhorn]

Who wants to bet this thread gets past 20 pages without getting through to the OP?

I'd say it's easy money.

I win! Pay me.

 

[cocokorina]

You know that the hadith was collected long after the death of the prophet and there was no reward for memorizing the hadith which isn't the case with the quran which Muslims had memorized it by heart.

you do realize that quran was also compiled AFTER the death of mohammad?

What you call the Muslims who lived before the collection of the hadith, were they not Muslims because there was no book of the hadith.

what makes one a muslim? someone that believes in allah AND believes in mohammad as the last messenger? thats what the kalimah and shahada says.
if they were all muslims before mohammad, why did god feel the need to send mohammad?

Do you think you are a Muslim because of praying,what if a hypocrite

[2:43] You shall observe the Contact Prayers (Salat) and give the obligatory charity (Zakat), and bow down with those who bow down.

i wonder how you can offer salat without ever reading the hadith? quran doesn't show anywhere how one should offer salat.

if muslims are supposed to pray for the heart, why do they go to the masjid? you never answerd, how does the imam lead prayer? who taught him?

if you're ignoring the 2nd pillar of islam which is salat, then you know nothing about islam yourself.