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A Question for fellow Christians.

dingdongknockknock

dingdongknockknock

Member
I think anyone could be saved because god loves all his children. But if you want to or not is a choice. You cant just be like oh im gonna pretend to accept jesus so i go to heaven and can cheat and lie and do whatever i want! When you get saved you have to truly believe and follow the lords commanments. I also think you need to get baptised as well.
 
sandandfoam

sandandfoam

Veteran Member
dingdongknockknock said:
I think anyone could be saved because god loves all his children. But if you want to or not is a choice. You cant just be like oh im gonna pretend to accept jesus so i go to heaven and can cheat and lie and do whatever i want! When you get saved you have to truly believe and follow the lords commanments. I also think you need to get baptised as well.
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I have come to think God saves everyone .
I see 2 problems with your point of view:-
If God loves all his children and everyone isn't saved it has to be because:-
a/ God doesn't want to save everyone. This doesn't square with God loving all his children.
b/ God can't save everyone. This doesn't square with being God.
 
dingdongknockknock

dingdongknockknock

Member
stephenw said:
I have come to think God saves everyone .
I see 2 problems with your point of view:-
If God loves all his children and everyone isn't saved it has to be because:-
a/ God doesn't want to save everyone. This doesn't square with God loving all his children.
b/ God can't save everyone. This doesn't square with being God.
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Not exactly God gives us a choice whether or not to believe in him and love him. That is why there is different religions, instead of god making us so we have to believe in him, we get a choice.
 
sandandfoam

sandandfoam

Veteran Member
dingdongknockknock said:
Not exactly God gives us a choice whether or not to believe in him and love him. That is why there is different religions, instead of god making us so we have to believe in him, we get a choice.
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And He loves us so much that if we don't believe we get Eternal damnation? The idea of such a God makes no sense to me.
 
A

angellous_evangellous

Guest
dingdongknockknock said:
I think anyone could be saved because god loves all his children. But if you want to or not is a choice. You cant just be like oh im gonna pretend to accept jesus so i go to heaven and can cheat and lie and do whatever i want! When you get saved you have to truly believe and follow the lords commanments. I also think you need to get baptised as well.
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Strange.
 
sandandfoam

sandandfoam

Veteran Member
dingdongknockknock said:
Well it is kind of hard to explain so you will have to find out by reading the bible if you want to know.:rolleyes:
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I've been reading it a lot. "You diligently study the Scriptures because you think by them you possess eternal life. These are the Scriptures that testify about me, yet you refuse to come to me to have life" (John 5:39-40)
I don't think God has had nothing to say or has dissappeared since the Bible was written. I think he likes sinners too.
To borrow from Gully and Mulholland 'Grace is a scandal when we're infatuated with moral purity'
 
ChristineES

ChristineES

Tiggerism
Premium Member
What they don't get is that God does not separate Himself from people, they separate from God. He gives them a choice.
 
doppelganger

doppelganger

Through the Looking Glass
ChristineES said:
What they don't get is that God does not separate Himself from people, they separate from God. He gives them a choice.
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If people have a choice, then "God" separates them first and they might imagine they have a "choice" to no longer be separated. There has to be a somebody to make the choice though. How can a "choice" occur without somebody to make it?
 
ChristineES

ChristineES

Tiggerism
Premium Member
doppelgänger;1058021 said:
If people have a choice, then "God" separates them first and they might imagine they have a "choice" to no longer be separated. There has to be a somebody to make the choice though. How can a "choice" occur without somebody to make it?
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The person can make the choice to change it at any time. God wants all people to united to Him, but he won't force anyone. If He did, then we would all be a bunch of robots.
 
A

angellous_evangellous

Guest
ChristineES said:
The person can make the choice to change it at any time. God wants all people to united to Him, but he won't force anyone. If He did, then we would all be a bunch of robots.
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Embrace the horror of this statement.

Freewill at the cost of billions of human lives lived in destitute, tortured squalar at the hands of other people who have chosen to be "seperate" from God, and further billions to be in a (permanent?) unimaginable cosmic hell.

O that God would have placed us in a cosmology where we would only choose good from good!!
 
doppelganger

doppelganger

Through the Looking Glass
ChristineES said:
The person can make the choice to change it at any time. God wants all people to united to Him, but he won't force anyone. If He did, then we would all be a bunch of robots.
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You misunderstood my post. "God" separates people from "God" first, because a choice to be separated cannot occur without there already being a separation. So the separation must occur before any choice does. Then the issue is whether one can "choose" to not be separated . . . which puts us into a "strange loop."
 
sandandfoam

sandandfoam

Veteran Member
ChristineES said:
The person can make the choice to change it at any time. God wants all people to united to Him, but he won't force anyone. If He did, then we would all be a bunch of robots.
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I'm thinking choice is an illusion. I think Dopp has pointed out elsewhere that if you don't perceive it as an illusion then you do indeed experience it as choice. But he might clarify that.
This was posted on another thread :-The definition of Christian Universalism DOES INCLUDE THE BELIEF that God "will have all men to be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth" (1 Tim. 2:4).
ChristineES, how does your belief in choice sit with the idea that God will have all men come to a knowledge of the truth?
 
ChristineES

ChristineES

Tiggerism
Premium Member
I will answer, although this thread was for Christians, or at least I will try to.

You are assuming that I believe people are born separated from God, at least I think that is what you are saying. The opposite is true in my view. I believe that people are born united with God. When a person becomes able to make a decision at a certain age, then they make the choice to either stay united to God or to separate from Him. That age can 5 years old or maybe not until the person is an adult.

I don't understand anything about original sin, I never engage in such discussions.
 
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