A Universe from Nothing?

[Rick O'Shez]

There are no material particles as such, therefore there is no material reality as such.

"As such?" Try dropping a brick on your foot and see how material THAT feels.

 

[godnotgod]

What a strange oxymoron.

Why? Have you succeeded in destroying Emptiness?

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Why? Have you succeeded in destroying Emptiness?

You seem to think of it as an absolute. Emptiness is the polar opposite to "indestructible".

 

[godnotgod]

"As such?" Try dropping a brick on your foot and see how material THAT feels.

Because there is no material reality does not mean dropping a brick on foot will not cause pain. Technically speaking, it has to do with electron resistance, and not 'materiality'. Sorry, the old materialist paradigm is dead, so cease and desist already your juvenile clock and brick experiments before I toss a brick into your clock.....cuckoo...cuckoo.

Here, watch this:

 

[YmirGF]

I don't feel attacked, because there is no 'I' that exists to attack, but I see you are on the attack, but you can't attack me, because there is nothing to attack. I am the Indestructible Sunyata. Sunyata is not a thing, but is just the nature of things, which is that what you call 'things' are in reality, empty of any 'thing' self-nature. A rock is not a rock, as it possesses no inherent 'rock nature'.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Alan Watts had a drink problem so I don't take his waffling too seriously.

Do the clock experiment and the brick experiment and then report your findings.

 

[godnotgod]

You seem to think of it as an absolute. Emptiness is the polar opposite to "indestructible".

It's indestructibility is absolute

 

[godnotgod]

When I say that I am the Indestructible Sunyata, I mean that is my true nature, not that it is a thing that I am. My true nature is the same nature as that of the Universe, as yours is, making our consciousness universal as well.

You know, when Yeshu said 'I Am', he did not mean he is a thing that exists; he meant his true nature is Pure Being that comes out of this eternal Present Moment, and not out of history; not out of time and space.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

...making our consciousness universal as well.

How is your "universal consciousness" different from your "cosmic consciousness"? What exactly is the difference?

 

[godnotgod]

In fact science is providing tons of information about the true nature of reality which is why we keep resorting to QM and such. Its giving an explanation for all the weirdness in the world and getting rid of the illusion, showing us the trick behind the magic.

OK, so it sounds like you're saying SOME info re: the 'true nature of reality' has come to light from QM. Just give me one bit of info about that true nature of reality you are referring to.

 

[godnotgod]

How is your "universal consciousness" different from your "cosmic consciousness"?

Cosmic Consciousness is the highest realization of Universal Consciousness.

Here. Refer to page 72:

http://worldprayerfoundation.com/resources/Ken Keyes-Handbook to Higher Consciousness.pdf

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Cosmic Consciousness is the highest realization of Universal Consciousness.
Here. Refer to page 72:
http://worldprayerfoundation.com/resources/Ken Keyes-Handbook to Higher Consciousness.pdf

Lordy, a new-age nightmare, there are 7 stages and 180 pages! I'm not ploughing through all that.

Could you just answer my question? What exactly is the difference between universal and cosmic consciousness? You use these terms regularly, so SURELY you can explain clearly what the difference is.

Saying "Cosmic Consciousness is the highest realization of Universal Consciousness" doesn't help because you haven't clearly explained what either of them are.

Even better, how about giving clear, succinct definitions for both of these, which should make the difference clear. Please use plain English, a couple of sentences for each should do it.

 

[`mud]

Oscillations and subsequent harmonics,
the invisible soup of the Cosmos !
And nothing is ever in the same place again !
There are really no circles, just arches.
~
Silliness abounds.
~
'mud

 

[Thief]

About time....agree!

About a sharp point...what about it? Do you imagine that God hung around for an eternity of eternities in non-dual existence..... and suddenly a mere 15 billion years ago it occurred to Him to make something from nothing to create duality....and now there is God and that which is not God.?

the book I got uses the word...void....
what most people call ...nothing....

I see the 'uncreated' as perfectly uniform
no heat....no cold
no light...no shadow
no Voice .....no Echo

kinda hard to say...I AM! .....with nothing to show for it

 

[Thief]

Its not about a watch and measuring. Sure that cognitive tool exists but so does time as a force of some sort.

Its called fourth dimensional space.

there are four basic forces
time is only a measure of movement

movement is real enough
space is real enough

the measure is all in your head

 

[Rick O'Shez]

time is only a measure of movement

No, it's more fundamental than that, there is the arrow of time: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entropy_(arrow_of_time)

Personal perception of time is based on observing change, but that's rather different.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

I see the 'uncreated' as perfectly uniform

How can you see something that is uncreated?

 

[Rick O'Shez]

There are really no circles, just arches.

If you look at the natural world most change is cyclical.

 

[Thief]

No, it's more fundamental than that, there is the arrow of time: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entropy_(arrow_of_time)

Personal perception of time is based on observing change, but that's rather different.

perception and reality are separate items
that we 'sense' a passing of time
but it's not real

time is not a force

 

[Thief]

How can you see something that is uncreated?

think about it