Abortion is murder

[Smoke]

By few I meant exactly 2! Out of many friends. It's not that I am surrounded by aborting people

As it turns out, I know quite a few, but not everybody is equally open about it. One of my students whom I didn't know on a personal level at all mentioned it very casually: "I won't be here tomorrow; I'm going to have an abortion." On the other end of the spectrum, a close friend of mine never mentioned a hint of it to me until I'd known her for over fifteen years.

I had an ethics professor who refused to discuss abortion because he had found that inevitably there were women in the class who came to him privately and said they were very uncomfortable because they had had abortions themselves, and didn't like to talk about it.

 

[Tau]

Then there's no point, is there? I have to stand by my original assessment of your OP as flamebait. By your own admission, you're not interested in a civil exchange of ideas. You just wanted to **** people off. That's flamebait.

You don't think your statements **** me off?

They and others here do as well, but thats my choice, everyones chooses whether they are ****** off or not, no one makes us.

Strange how women who want their babies refer to the embryo as 'My baby' yet when they don't want the child it is a 'Fetus' or an 'Embryo', like it is somehow less human.

For the record Storm and anyone else reading this, I cannot be swayed because sometimes one must choose which line they stand on, and I stand on the line that is marked 'protect the humans' now that might sound trite or idealistic but it is something I believe in, it is part of my entire outlook, all or nothing, everyone or no one, at all costs, including.......convenience......there is always adoption.

No excuses, here me and the Bible are convergent, THOU SHALT NOT KILL

You may be killing a clump of animal cells or a tiny unborn baby sorry 'embryo', to me you are killing a potential productive member of society, the pro choicers cheapen life and pave the way for other homicidal practices.

 

[Storm]

You don't think your statements **** me off?

No, I'm sure they do. The difference, however, is that I'm trying to have a civil exchage of ideas. I'm trying to understand the other side. I'm trying to help the other side understand me. Part of that is not TRYING to **** each other off. For instance, I haven't characterized your position as misogyny.

You don't seem to be willing to do that.

 

[Nessa Nenharma]

A good friend of mine told me she found out she was pregnant. I could see the happiness in her eyes as she spoke of a nursery and tiny clothes ( yes she considered it a baby as soon as she found out). She put off going to the doctor at first because she was picky and couldn't find one that she felt she could trust. When she finally made it in to one, she was 5 months pregnant. She had her first sonogram at that time and something was discovered that she would have found earlier if she had only gone to the doctor. Her baby hadn't developed a full brain, only parts. It was alive, but she was told that it would die upon birth and she had the decision to abort it or not. The doctors gave her a 40% chance of living (due to other complications) if she had the baby. She wrestled with the decision for a long time before deciding to abort it.
If she wasn't able to have an abortion she could have died trying to give birth to her baby.

It is because of this story and others like it that I am pro-choice.

My stance is: I would rather a woman come into a medical clinic, where doctors who know what they are doing can perform her abortion, than to have it 'taken care of', like my grandmother's mother-in-law did to her with a coat hanger in the bathtub.

:bb:

Nessa

 

[Smoke]

No excuses, here me and the Bible are convergent, THOU SHALT NOT KILL

Then you're a pacifist, and oppose all killing for any reason whatsoever?

 

[Tau]

A good friend of mine told me she found out she was pregnant. I could see the happiness in her eyes as she spoke of a nursery and tiny clothes ( yes she considered it a baby as soon as she found out). She put off going to the doctor at first because she was picky and couldn't find one that she felt she could trust. When she finally made it in to one, she was 5 months pregnant. She had her first sonogram at that time and something was discovered that she would have found earlier if she had only gone to the doctor. Her baby hadn't developed a full brain, only parts. It was alive, but she was told that it would die upon birth and she had the decision to abort it or not. The doctors gave her a 40% chance of living (due to other complications) if she had the baby. She wrestled with the decision for a long time before deciding to abort it.
If she wasn't able to have an abortion she could have died trying to give birth to her baby.

It is because of this story and others like it that I am pro-choice.

My stance is: I would rather a woman come into a medical clinic, where doctors who know what they are doing can perform her abortion, than to have it 'taken care of', like my grandmother's mother-in-law did to her with a coat hanger in the bathtub.

:bb:

Nessa

I do not rule out abortion entirely, sometimes it is a kindness, I oppose elective abortion, which is different.

Your stance is rational and a lesser of two evils to me, I concur in principle, but only because laws are not strong enough to deter back street abortionists.

 

[Willamena]

Well thats an act of nature, and not a result of the violation of man.

You have a point. It's pregenancy that is the result of a violation of man.

 

[Tau]

Then you're a pacifist, and oppose all killing for any reason whatsoever?

Pretty much.

Only to defend oneself is it ever ok to kill anyone if it is absolutely necessary.

 

[Tau]

No, I'm sure they do. The difference, however, is that I'm trying to have a civil exchage of ideas. I'm trying to understand the other side. I'm trying to help the other side understand me. Part of that is not TRYING to **** each other off. For instance, I haven't characterized your position as misogyny.

You don't seem to be willing to do that.

I stated earlier that I was posting an opinion (in protest) against being excluded from a thread in a general debate forum....

I cannot will not ever concede that elective abortion is conducive to the Greater Good.

 

[Storm]

I stated earlier that I was posting an opinion in protest against being excluded from a thread in a general debate forum....

Well, then, get over it. We're allowed to have debates exclusive to certain perspectives, and for good reason. I don't protest the Christian-only threads, much less troll in them.

 

[Reverend Rick]

Can we all agree that it is at the very least a selfish act? Think about it, Republicans are sometimes selfish with their wealth and do not want to be taxed, women who do not want to sacrifice for their child choose to abort it when they could easily accept responsibility or transfer it to a more responsible couple.

What chaps my butt is a child is a blessing, a gift from God. Perhaps an early abortion may not be a considered a child, but partial birth abortion is murder, no doubt about it. Any doctor who performed such a procedure deserves the same treatment.

 

[Draka]

I can't help but think of something George Carlin once said. "Why is it when it is a human it is an abortion, but when it's a chicken it's an omelet?"

 

[Draka]

Can we all agree that it is at the very least a selfish act? Think about it, Republicans are sometimes selfish with their wealth and do not want to be taxed, women who do not want to sacrifice for their child choose to abort it when they could easily accept responsibility or transfer it to a more responsible couple.

What chaps my butt is a child is a blessing, a gift from God. Perhaps an early abortion may not be a considered a child, but partial birth abortion is murder, no doubt about it. Any doctor who performed such a procedure deserves the same treatment.

Can't agree that it is a selfish act. I know I don't, and am pretty sure you don't, know all the reasons that all these different women get abortions. To just chalk all of them up to being selfish is very presumptious and a tad rude actually.

I can agree with partial birth abortion though. That is just sick.

 

[Tau]

Well, then, get over it. We're allowed to have debates exclusive to certain perspectives, and for good reason. I don't protest the Christian-only threads, much less troll in them.

Troll is a strong word to bandy about casually Storm..noted.

 

[Smoke]

Pretty much.

Only to defend oneself is it ever ok to kill anyone if it is absolutely necessary.

Then a woman can have an abortion to defend herself if the pregnancy puts her at risk?

 

[Tau]

Then a woman can have an abortion to defend herself if the pregnancy puts her at risk?

Absolutely.

I am not insane y know.

 

[Storm]

Can we all agree that it is at the very least a selfish act?

In some cases, yes. In others, no.

Think about it, Republicans are sometimes selfish with their wealth and do not want to be taxed, women who do not want to sacrifice for their child choose to abort it when they could easily accept responsibility or transfer it to a more responsible couple.

Well, I agree with you, but that doesn't mean much coming from me. I think the Golden Rule is ultimately selfish, but that's for another thread.

What chaps my butt is a child is a blessing, a gift from God. Perhaps an early abortion may not be a considered a child, but partial birth abortion is murder, no doubt about it. Any doctor who performed such a procedure deserves the same treatment.

I think you mean late term abortion. I could be wrong, but my understanding of "partial birth abortion" is that it's just a certain method not restricted to late term abortion. FOr clarity, I would consider late term abortion to be the third trimester.

 

[Storm]

Troll is a strong word to bandy about casually Storm..noted.

If the shoe fits. If I were to go into a Christian only thread and start talking about how they misunderstand Christ, that would be trolling, too. I don't, however, because it's RUDE.

 

[doppelganger]

Aborting infants by elective termination is simply murder.

So what? What am I supposed to do about it? I'm unlikely to have the option of choosing.

 

[Tau]

If the shoe fits. If I were to go into a Christian only thread and start talking about how they misunderstand Christ, that would be trolling, too. I don't, however, because it's RUDE.

Rude is better, I am not a Troll, I find that label RUDE as well.