Pawpatrol
Active Member
Right — we force on all unborn babies the right of living. How terrible of us.
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Abortion
- Thread starter an anarchist
- Start date
Pawpatrol
Active Member
It's not forced at all. Usually the woman gladly commits an act that she knows very well may lead, eventually, to parenthood. If she finds herself weak and incapable of such a task she would be better advised to keep her pants on.
I think I hear you. I think the baby needs to not have it and has a (negative) right not to be harmed by the government. The government has not, however, caused the mother to harm the child. It may have failed in its duty though if it doesn't intervene, which is just as bad I admit. The child has no positive right to be cared for by the politicians only a negative right not to be harmed by them.
I wouldn't punish the heroine addict for having the child, but I also wouldn't punish them for not having the child. They are personally involved. I am doing nothing. It costs me nothing, and I put in no effort.
Laws can be excuses not to do anything ourselves. Somebody will take care of the child, because I pay taxes? Actually the child will wind up in the horrid foster care system and will probably experience sex very early in life and probably drugs, too. Laws look fantastic on paper or bound up in covers, and they are given very promising or distracting titles. They are not the same as actions.
Love is, if not an action, a very powerful motivator.
I agree it is an emotion, but most people who believe that a fertilized egg is a human also believe that love is much more than an emotion. It is increasinly common to believe that not only that God is love but that Love created the physical universe and that the baby is human even before sperm and egg unite. Hence contraception is murder to more people than you might expect.
I do not believe contraception is murder, but if it would decrease abortions I'd be for outlawing contraception, but the issue is complex. I don't like outlawing things willy nilly. We each must bear some responsibility. We can't put everything into the government's hands.
The terrible thing is what you want to do to pregnant people.Right — we force on all unborn babies the right of living. How terrible of us.
Argentbear
Well-Known Member
i have to guess that you don't think that is a person but are just not mature enough to say so.
So why isn't it a person? It's obviously a Homo sapiens and it's an individual...
Pawpatrol
Active Member
Women. They're pregnant women. I don't do anything to them. I say it's wrong of them to get themselves pregnant and then to abort because "they're not ready" or whatever.
And what do you say to the victims of rape?
And there it is: rapist mentality.
Consent to one thing isn't consent to just that thing and not anything else.
Consent to sex isn't consent to pregnancy, just as someone inviting you into their apartment isn't consent to sex.
an anarchist
Your local loco.
I feel like these two things don't connect.
Sex has the inherent risk of pregnancy.
Inviting someone into your house does not have the inherent risk for sex
It's telling that you object to the word "people" being used to describe women.
I said "want to do."
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
I find arguements laced with such moral indignation vastly inferior. Weak? Incapable? Keep her pants on? Committs? Such holier-than-thou approaches and verbage, especially for something that doesn't effect you, need not apply for proper morality.
an anarchist
Your local loco.
They definitely could have worded their reply differently.
But I am curious about they point they bring up.
Sex has the inherent risk of pregnancy. It's just the thing about taking responsibility for your actions. By having sex you accept the risk of pregnancy, do you not? Therefore, is there not consent to take a risk to get pregnant i.e. consent to get pregnant? And if so, then should you not be responsible for your action of creating life?
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
Women are people. This is understood, is it not?
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
Sex may resort in pregnancy, yes. But consenting to having sex is not the same as consenting to have a baby. That's an entirely different issue. This is why the legal world is a jungle of jargon, often with confusing and meaningless differences to the uninitiated (such as DUI vs DWI), because we must separate one issue from the other.
We can acknowledge the risk of something happening without consenting to it.
Take car crashes as an example: we know that driving comes with the risk of getting into a collision. Still, driving a car doesn't imply that you've consented to have people run into you.
Also, we can also acknowledge that consent can be withdrawn, even if freely given originally. Initial consent to something doesn't imply continual, ongoing consent forever. A wanted pregnancy can become an unwanted pregnancy. Continual consent all the way until birth is the standard.
@PawpatroI is saying the quiet part out loud. Usually, anti-choicers try to put up a facade to pretend that their position isn't just about punishing women for having sex the anti-choicer disapproves of.
Because, as we all know, sexual assault is never committed by someone known to and trusted by the victim.
an anarchist
Your local loco.
Is this what is called a "strawman"?
Either way, you're completely mischaracterizing what I said. Either it went over your head or you just felt like building a strawman maliciously.
What you said was both stupid and thoughtlessly arrogant.
Before talking, take the time to learn something. You may wish to begin by scanning these
including
- Approximately 80-85% of completed rapes are committed by someone who is known to the victim/survivor.
an anarchist
Your local loco.
You're added to my ignore list. You are always needlessly rude and arrogant. You will get no further interaction from me