About Jinns

[Bowman]

I fail to see how Jinns and gods differ they are both supernatural so proving most Abrahamic religions are therefore actually polytheistic and monotheism is an aberrant irregularity.

Cheers

Jinn are created.

God is not created.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

Isn't there a notion in the Quran that some of the Jinn are the gods of Pagans, and that they mislead people into worshipping them?

 

[Bowman]

Isn't there a notion in the Quran that some of the Jinn are the gods of Pagans, and that they mislead people into worshipping them?

Since jinn are demons, and demons deceive people, then yes, the Koran is full of examples of this.

Portions of the Koran are even narrated by demons and entire suras are named in honor of them.

 

[mohammed_beiruti]

I think the Biblical equivalence of the djinns are demons. Basically two terms describing the same thing. But I've only read the first three surah's of the Qur'an and there's not a lot on djinns in those ones, save for a passing reference to Iblis, that is Satan, so I don't really know much about them.

But I would say that Mohammad was superstitious... just like the rest of us. ^_^ (I mean no disrespect; I know I'm superstitious)

convincing you with jinns existance as hard as convincing an athiest with God existance!

 

[gnostic]

If Jinns have free will like humans, then wouldn't it be true that some jinns are good and some are bad?

 

[Bowman]

If Jinns have free will like humans, then wouldn't it be true that some jinns are good and some are bad?

All jinn in the Koran are evil.

After all, jinn are demons...

 

[gnostic]

According to the Koran, they are fallen angels.

All jinn in the Koran are evil.

After all, jinn are demons...

But Muslims don't view that some angels had fallen, because angels can't rebel against God, mainly because angels have no free will.

Jews also don't believe that angels could rebel as well, because they have no free will, hence angels can't be fallen. The difference between Islamic and Jewish teachings is that Jews don't believe Satan to be going against God's wishes or the personification of evil, as Muslims and Christians believe. Judging by the Book of Job, Satan was only doing God's bidding, that is to test Job's faith.

Read Zardoz and Levite's posts (post 21 and post 22, respectively), from Jews Only: Is there or was there a war in heaven? (Same Faith Debates thread).

Getting back to Islamic belief. Djinns are not former angels. Ask any Muslim and they will say the same thing. To them, djinns are different class of spiritual beings, and like humans, they have free will.

 

[Bowman]

But Muslims don't view that some angels had fallen, because angels can't rebel against God, mainly because angels have no free will.

Then they are denying their book of faith.

Reference chapter 72...

Jews also don't believe that angels could rebel as well, because they have no free will, hence angels can't be fallen.

Then they also are denying their book of faith.

Reference Ezekiel chapter 28...

The difference between Islamic and Jewish teachings is that Jews don't believe Satan to be going against God's wishes or the personification of evil, as Muslims and Christians believe. Judging by the Book of Job, Satan was only doing God's bidding, that is to test Job's faith.

Both Muslims and Jews do not comprehend their scriptures, brother...

Read Zardoz and Levite's posts (post 21 and post 22, respectively), from Jews Only: Is there or was there a war in heaven? (Same Faith Debates thread).

Thanks for the link...

Getting back to Islamic belief. Djinns are not former angels.

They are according to the Koran.

Ask any Muslim and they will say the same thing. To them, djinns are different class of spiritual beings, and like humans, they have free will.

Since when does Muslim thought agree with that of the Koran?

 

[gnostic]

Both Muslims and Jews do not comprehend their scriptures, brother...

Since when does Muslim thought agree with that of the Koran?

I may often disagree with their interpretations (actually I disagree with Muslims, more than Jews, about their respective scriptures), but I must say this is pretty arrogant things to say.

I actually disagree with Christian interpretation of the bibles, particularly the Old Testament, than I disagree with Jewish interpretation. That's strange considering that I grew up hearing Christian interpretations and teaching. I don't know any Jews.

 

[Bowman]

I may often disagree with their interpretations (actually I disagree with Muslims, more than Jews, about their respective scriptures), but I must say this is pretty arrogant things to say.

I actually disagree with Christian interpretation of the bibles, particularly the Old Testament, than I disagree with Jewish interpretation. That's strange considering that I grew up hearing Christian interpretations and teaching. I don't know any Jews.

Looks like you practice the same...

 

[xkatz]

Looks like you practice the same...

He was voicing his opinion. You were saying that Jews and Muslims do not properly comprehend their scripture, which does come off as arrogant.

 

[Bowman]

He was voicing his opinion. You were saying that Jews and Muslims do not properly comprehend their scripture, which does come off as arrogant.

It is complete confidence.

 

[TashaN]

If Jinns have free will like humans, then wouldn't it be true that some jinns are good and some are bad?

Exactly. It's well known in islamic tradition that there are good jinns and bad jinns, just like us human beings.

All jinn in the Koran are evil.

After all, jinn are demons...

Where did you get that from?

Just because many jinns are evil, that doesn't mean there are no good faithful ones.

Satan himself was a good servant of God, but then he refused to bow down to Adam when he was ordered to do that by God. Arrogance got to Satan. Satan (a jinni) thought that jinns were much better than Adam (human).

 

[Bowman]

Where did you get that from?

Just because many jinns are evil, that doesn't mean there are no good faithful ones.

Satan himself was a good servant of God, but then he refused to bow down to Adam when he was ordered to do that by God. Arrogance got to Satan. Satan (a jinni) thought that jinns were much better than Adam (human).

Care to show me where in the Koran, that a jinn is good?

 

[TashaN]

Care to show me where in the Koran, that a jinn is good?

Good AND bad.

 

[Bowman]

Good AND bad.

Show me a direct verse from your book of faith.

 

[.lava]

Show me a direct verse from your book of faith.

hello, friend first of all i have to mention the creature named as Shaytan is a jinn. but it has chosen evil therefor it is not called jinn anymore. that's the difference between bad and good of jinns. jinns are also people like us so they can either follow Satan or law of God. jinns also have messengers among themselves, they can also commit sin and repent like any human. besides there's one entire surah that's titled Jinn in Qur'an, read if you like.

72:1 Say: It has been revealed to me that a party of the jinn listened, and they said: Surely we have heard a wonderful Quran,

27:17 And his hosts of the jinn and the men and the birds were gathered to him, and they were formed into groups.

51:56 I created the jinn and humankind only that they might worship Me.

46:29 And when We turned towards you a party of the jinn who listened to the Quran; so when they came to it, they said: Be silent; then when it was finished, they turned back to their people warning (them).

7:179 And certainly We have created for hell many of the jinn and the men; they have hearts with which they do not understand, and they have eyes with which they do not see, and they have ears with which they do not hear; they are as cattle, nay, they are in worse errors; these are the heedless ones.

.

 

[Bowman]

hello, friend first of all i have to mention the creature named as Shaytan is a jinn. but it has chosen evil therefor it is not called jinn anymore. that's the difference between bad and good of jinns. jinns are also people like us so they can either follow Satan or law of God. jinns also have messengers among themselves, they can also commit sin and repent like any human. besides there's one entire surah that's titled Jinn in Qur'an, read if you like.

72:1 Say: It has been revealed to me that a party of the jinn listened, and they said: Surely we have heard a wonderful Quran,

27:17 And his hosts of the jinn and the men and the birds were gathered to him, and they were formed into groups.

51:56 I created the jinn and humankind only that they might worship Me.

46:29 And when We turned towards you a party of the jinn who listened to the Quran; so when they came to it, they said: Be silent; then when it was finished, they turned back to their people warning (them).

7:179 And certainly We have created for hell many of the jinn and the men; they have hearts with which they do not understand, and they have eyes with which they do not see, and they have ears with which they do not hear; they are as cattle, nay, they are in worse errors; these are the heedless ones.

.

Thanks for your reply.

All of your ayat do not tell us that jinn are good, however, and actually context indicates that they were evil.

Let’s define the very term “jinn”, and see for ourselves what it overwhelmingly refers to…




جن= “jinn”

“jinn” definition:

Collective noun. Genii, demons, spirits, as apposed to men. The darkness of night; intense darkness; the confusedness of the darkness of night. Concealment. The genii; and sometimes the angels; according to some, the spiritual beings that are concealed from the senses, or that conceal themselves from the senses; all of such beings; thus comprising the angels; all of these being jinn; thus called because they are feared but not seen: or, according to others, certain of the spiritual beings; for the spiritual beings are of three kinds; the good being the angels; and the evil being the devils; and the middle kind, among whom are good and evil, being the jinn; as is shown in the first twelve verses of sura 72; or it here means intelligent invisible bodies, predominantly of the fiery, or of the aerial quality; or a species of souls, or spirits, divested of bodies; or human souls separate from their bodies; or the jinn are the angels exclusively. According to some, in sura 18.50 it is said that Iblees was one of the Jinn; or, as some say, the jinn were a species of the angels, who were the guardians of the earth, and of the gardens of paradise. A state of possession by a devil, or by a jinn; diabolical, or demonical, possession; and hence meaning loss of reason; or madness, insanity, or unsoundness in mind or intellect.

It comes from the root “janna”, which means it veiled, concealed, hid, covered, or protected him; said of the night; to be covered; to cover. The primary signification is the veiling, or concealing, from the sense. Overshadowed; to be dark, wrap, be mad, dark, be hidden to, be excited, He, a man, was, or became, possessed by a devil, or demon; and hence meaning bereft of reason; or mad, insane, unsound in mind or intellect, or wanting therein.

References:
An Arabic-English Lexicon, E.W. Lane, volume two, pp. 462 - 464
The Dictionary of the Holy Qur’an, 1st edition, Abdul Mannan Omar pp. 104 - 105
A Dictionary and Glossary of the Koran, John Penrice, p. 29
Concordance of the Koran, Gustav Flugel, pp. 45 - 46


Clearly, “jinn” are fallen angels – of which, are demons.

The context of your example in sura 72 proves this out…

وأنا لمسنا السماء فوجدنها ملئت حرسا شديدا​

وشهبا​

Waanna lamasna alssamaa fawajadnaha muli-at harasan shadeedan washuhuban

72.8 And that we had sought the heaven, so we found her filled (with) strong guards in war, and stars that dart down after a devil.



The jinn narrative above clearly shows that a war occurred in heaven with the result being the expulsion of ‘stars’ (i.e. fallen angels) cast down after the devil.

This is the same event as recorded in the Biblical Book of Revelation, and refers to Satan’s fallen angels.

 

[Bowman]

Further look at this ayah…


وخلق الجان من مارج من نار

Wakhalaqa aljanna min marijin min narin

55.15 And He created the Father of the Devils from a mixture from fire.




جان= “janna”

“janna” definition:

Noun. A serpent, genius, demon. As pertaining to 15.27…“The Father of Devils;” or the part for the whole, Jinn or Genii. Also a white serpent: or a small white serpent: or a great serpent: or a species of serpent having black-bordered eyes inclining to yellow, harmless, and abounding in houses. It is related that these creatures, who were upon the earth, and who acted corruptly therein, and shed blood, wherefore God sent angels who banished them from the earth: and it is said that these angels became the inhabitants of the earth after them.

الجان= “al” + “janna” = “aljanna” = the Father of the Devils


It comes from the root “janna”, which means it veiled, concealed, hid, covered, or protected him; said of the night; to be covered; to cover. The primary signification is the veiling, or concealing, from the sense. Overshadowed; Covered, to be dark, cover, wrap, conceal, be mad, dark, be hidden to, be excited, veiling, or concealing from the sense. He, a man, was, or became, possessed by a devil, or demon; and hence meaning bereft of reason; or mad, insane, unsound in mind or intellect, or wanting therein.


References:
An Arabic-English Lexicon, E.W. Lane, volume two, pp. 462 - 464
The Dictionary of the Holy Qur’an, 1st edition, Abdul Mannan Omar pp. 104 - 105
A Dictionary and Glossary of the Koran, John Penrice, p. 29
Concordance of the Koran, Gustav Flugel, pp. 45 - 46



Here we have a clear reference that Satan is referred to as the father of the jinn…of which can only mean that jinn are demons.





And yet another key word in the very same verse…



وخلق الجان من مارج من نار

Wakhalaqa aljanna min marijin min narin

55.15 And He created the Father of the Devils from a mixture from fire.



مارج= “marijin”

“marijin” definition:

A confused affair, or case; or error. Mixture, a mixture, or that which is mixed. A mixture of fire; or flame mixed with the black substance of fire; or flame of fire; or fire without smoke, whereof was created El-Jann, i.e. Iblees, the father of the Jinn, or Genii, or the Jinn collectively. Flame; fire free from smoke. It comes from the root “maraja”, which means he (a beast of carriage) fed in a pasture. He sent a beast of carriage to pasture; or left it to pasture wheresoever it would; he pastured it. He mixed a thing with another thing, or two things together. He hath let them flow freely, yet so that one does not become mixed with the other; he hath made them flow. He marred or spoiled his affair. It (a deposit, and a covenant, and religion) became corrupt; impaired; spoiled; marred; or disordered. It (a ring on the finger, and an arrow) became unsteady.

References:
An Arabic-English Lexicon, E.W. Lane, volume seven, p. 2704
The Dictionary of the Holy Qur’an, 1st edition, Abdul Mannan Omar p. 529


Again, the Koran confirms that jinn have as their ‘father’, the devil…of which can only make them evil…

 

[gnostic]

Exactly. It's well known in islamic tradition that there are good jinns and bad jinns, just like us human beings.

hello, friend first of all i have to mention the creature named as Shaytan is a jinn. but it has chosen evil therefor it is not called jinn anymore. that's the difference between bad and good of jinns. jinns are also people like us so they can either follow Satan or law of God. jinns also have messengers among themselves, they can also commit sin and repent like any human. besides there's one entire surah that's titled Jinn in Qur'an, read if you like.

Thank you, TashaN and .lava. I thought that might have be the case, esp if they have free will.

Although, you were replying to Bowman, .lava, I do appreciate your explanation about there being good jinns and bad jinns.