About Jinns

[gnostic]

Collective noun. Genii, demons, spirits, as apposed to men. The darkness of night; intense darkness; the confusedness of the darkness of night. Concealment. The genii; and sometimes the angels; according to some, the spiritual beings that are concealed from the senses, or that conceal themselves from the senses; all of such beings; thus comprising the angels; all of these being jinn; thus called because they are feared but not seen: or, according to others, certain of the spiritual beings; for the spiritual beings are of three kinds; the good being the angels; and the evil being the devils; and the middle kind, among whom are good and evil, being the jinn; as is shown in the first twelve verses of sura 72; or it here means intelligent invisible bodies, predominantly of the fiery, or of the aerial quality; or a species of souls, or spirits, divested of bodies; or human souls separate from their bodies; or the jinn are the angels exclusively. According to some, in sura 18.50 it is said that Iblees was one of the Jinn; or, as some say, the jinn were a species of the angels, who were the guardians of the earth, and of the gardens of paradise. A state of possession by a devil, or by a jinn; diabolical, or demonical, possession; and hence meaning loss of reason; or madness, insanity, or unsoundness in mind or intellect.

Originally the word, "genii", which was a plural for "genius", were indeed spirits, according to the Latin or Roman religion, they were not evil, like demons. The nature of genii were that of spirits who protected the person, household (family or property), hence guardian spirits or minor deities. They were benevolent beings.

In a way, genii were like guardian angels of Christian belief, but they were angels as well, because angels are foreign to the Roman pagan belief.

The current concept of "genie" or jinn as being wish-giver or personification of evil were also foreign to the Roman religion.

Again, I think you are pushing to hard Christian concepts into different religions, which to my mind, misrepresent the religion. The Roman genii are not the same as demons or jinns.

 

[.lava]

Thank you, TashaN and .lava. I thought that might have be the case, esp if they have free will.

Although, you were replying to Bowman, .lava, I do appreciate your explanation about there being good jinns and bad jinns.

my pleasure and you're welcome. they are people like us. simple that is.

btw BOWMAN, -i am not screaming, just trying to make sure you see it- translation of verses you share are not correct. beware of the source you use

.

 

[Bowman]

Originally the word, "genii", which was a plural for "genius", were indeed spirits, according to the Latin or Roman religion, they were not evil, like demons. The nature of genii were that of spirits who protected the person, household (family or property), hence guardian spirits or minor deities. They were benevolent beings.

In a way, genii were like guardian angels of Christian belief, but they were angels as well, because angels are foreign to the Roman pagan belief.

The current concept of "genie" or jinn as being wish-giver or personification of evil were also foreign to the Roman religion.

Again, I think you are pushing to hard Christian concepts into different religions, which to my mind, misrepresent the religion. The Roman genii are not the same as demons or jinns.

The authors of the Koran provide a physical description of the jinn which matches exactly with that of the demons mentioned in the Book of Revelation.

Thus...the classic definition and the physical description both match.

If it walks like a duck and it talks like a duck.....

 

[Bowman]

btw BOWMAN, -i am not screaming, just trying to make sure you see it- translation of verses you share are not correct. beware of the source you use

.

My renderings have never been refuted.

 

[gnostic]

The authors of the Koran provide a physical description of the jinn which matches exactly with that of the demons mentioned in the Book of Revelation.

Thus...the classic definition and the physical description both match.

If it walks like a duck and it talks like a duck.....

But you've mistaken a chicken for a duck.

And though they are both birds, a chicken is flightless, can't float on a water like a duck, and together, they can't produce offspring.

 

[Bowman]

But you've mistaken a chicken for a duck.

And though they are both birds, a chicken is flightless, can't float on a water like a duck, and together, they can't produce offspring.

Give us your physical description of jinn, brother.

 

[gnostic]

Physical description? What physical description?

It supposed made out of smoke, and yet they can supposedly take on the form of any person or animal, so how do you expect me to describe them physically? And supposedly, it can invisible and incorporeal, like other spirits.

The stupid thing is that smoke can be seen and smelt, hence smoke is not incorporeal nor invisible. Hence, I would put jinns as mythological category as of fairy and unicorn. Deities, angels and demons also fall under this category, of being mythological.

I love mythology (and legend, and folklore), but it doesn't mean that I'd actually believe in these mythological creature or beings.

 

[Bowman]

Physical description? What physical description?

It supposed made out of smoke, and yet they can supposedly take on the form of any person or animal, so how do you expect me to describe them physically? And supposedly, it can invisible and incorporeal, like other spirits.

The stupid thing is that smoke can be seen and smelt, hence smoke is not incorporeal nor invisible. Hence, I would put jinns as mythological category as of fairy and unicorn. Deities, angels and demons also fall under this category, of being mythological.

I love mythology (and legend, and folklore), but it doesn't mean that I'd actually believe in these mythological creature or beings.

The Koran gives ample physical description of the jinn.

 

[gnostic]

The Koran gives ample physical description of the jinn.

I have read all references to the jinns in the Qur'an before I began this thread, Bowman, and none of satisfied me as to their "physical" description.

Reading the Qur'an I always feel the Qur'an is horrendous when it come to narration, and describing anything in this scripture, is often too vague to my likely. When I read, the Genesis for example, I at least know what going on in the narration, but the Qur'an have the tendency to jump from subject to subject, and required a lot of interpretation.

 

[Bowman]

I have read all references to the jinns in the Qur'an before I began this thread, Bowman, and none of satisfied me as to their "physical" description.

Reading the Qur'an I always feel the Qur'an is horrendous when it come to narration, and describing anything in this scripture, is often too vague to my likely. When I read, the Genesis for example, I at least know what going on in the narration, but the Qur'an have the tendency to jump from subject to subject, and required a lot of interpretation.

Now that you know the manner in which the Koran has been written, you need to apply that knowledge in its interpretation.

Sura 100 gives us a great physical description of jinn, and was even named in honor of them.

Compare how this Koranic chapter took as its source the Biblical Book of Revelation...


Sura 100 Summary



100…

.1 The Demonic Locusts…Fire-colored Breastplates……...Rev 9.7, 9.9, 9.17
.2 The Demonic Locusts…Fire emitted…………..................Rev 9.17– 8
.3 The Demonic Locusts…Women’s hair………...................Rev 9.7– 9.8, 9.16– 9.17
.4 The Demonic Locusts…Swarm of Locusts…………........Rev 9.1– 9.5
.5 The Demonic Locusts…Gathering beyond number….....Rev 9.13-16
.6 Repent to the Lord…………………………………..Rev 2.21-22, 9.20-21, 16.9-11
.7 Jesus the Faithful Witness…………….………….....Rev 1.2, 1.5, 1.9, 3.14
.8 The Wealth of Jesus………………………………....Rev 3.17-19, 5.12
.9 The First Resurrection……………………………....Rev 1.5, 1.18, 20.5-6, 20.13-14
.10 Jesus knows the Heart………………………………Rev 2.23
.11 Jesus is the Resurrection…………………………....Rev 10.7, 11.15, 18.8

 

[gnostic]

Qur'an 100 is pretty much useless, and doesn't describe the jinns at all, certainly have no physical description.

Don't you mean Surah 72?

 

[Bowman]

Qur'an 100 is pretty much useless, and doesn't describe the jinns at all, certainly have no physical description.

Don't you mean Surah 72?

Sura 100 is absolutely loaded with physical attributes of the jinn...in the Arabic....of which, is almost completely lost in most English translations.

 

[MathewJames]

The jinn and angels are the same. Some of them made an agreement to follow satan a long time ago. Those are the ones mostly described in the Qur'an. IMO the Qur'an does not have as much info about them as the Book of Enoch.

 

[Bowman]

The jinn and angels are the same. Some of them made an agreement to follow satan a long time ago. Those are the ones mostly described in the Qur'an. IMO the Qur'an does not have as much info about them as the Book of Enoch.

Can you share some of what you have learned...?

 

[MathewJames]

There were angels/jinns appointed to watch over humanity. But many of them were seduced by the pleasures they saw humans enjoying and wanted to be part of it. These so called fallen angels made an eternal pact with one another that once they started they could never turn back. They possesed humans and began doing and doing what ever they wanted.

 

[Bowman]

There were angels/jinns appointed to watch over humanity. But many of them were seduced by the pleasures they saw humans enjoying and wanted to be part of it. These so called fallen angels made an eternal pact with one another that once they started they could never turn back. They possesed humans and began doing and doing what ever they wanted.

Do you have any scripture to share...?

 

[MathewJames]

check out the first 1/3 of the book of enoch, but I am not sure if you would consider that scripture.

 

[Bowman]

check out the first 1/3 of the book of enoch, but I am not sure if you would consider that scripture.

Not seeing it, brother.

Got any specific verses from Enoch...?

 

[MathewJames]

Chapter 7

1It happened after the sons of men had multiplied in those days, that daughters were born to them, elegant and beautiful.
2And when the angels, (3) the sons of heaven, beheld them, they became enamoured of them, saying to each other, Come, let us select for ourselves wives from the progeny of men, and let us beget children.
(3) An Aramaic text reads "Watchers" here (J.T. Milik, Aramaic Fragments of Qumran Cave 4 [Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1976], p. 167).
3Then their leader Samyaza said to them; I fear that you may perhaps be indisposed to the performance of this enterprise;
4And that I alone shall suffer for so grievous a crime.
5But they answered him and said; We all swear;
6And bind ourselves by mutual execrations, that we will not change our intention, but execute our projected undertaking.
7Then they swore all together, and all bound themselves by mutual execrations. Their whole number was two hundred, who descended upon Ardis, (4) which is the top of mount Armon.
(4) Upon Ardis. Or, "in the days of Jared" (R.H. Charles, ed. and trans., The Book of Enoch [Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1893], p. 63).
8That mountain therefore was called Armon, because they had sworn upon it, (5) and bound themselves by mutual execrations.
(5) Mt. Armon, or Mt. Hermon, derives its name from the Hebrew word herem, a curse (Charles, p. 63).
9These are the names of their chiefs: Samyaza, who was their leader, Urakabarameel, Akibeel, Tamiel, Ramuel, Danel, Azkeel, Saraknyal, Asael, Armers, Batraal, Anane, Zavebe, Samsaveel, Ertael, Turel, Yomyael, Arazyal. These were the prefects of the two hundred angels, and the remainder were all with them. (6)
(6) The Aramaic texts preserve an earlier list of names of these Watchers: Semihazah; Artqoph; Ramtel; Kokabel; Ramel; Danieal; Zeqiel; Baraqel; Asael; Hermoni; Matarel; Ananel; Stawel; Samsiel; Sahriel; Tummiel; Turiel; Yomiel; Yhaddiel (Milik, p. 151).
10Then they took wives, each choosing for himself; whom they began to approach, and with whom they cohabited; teaching them sorcery, incantations, and the dividing of roots and trees.
11And the women conceiving brought forth giants, (7)
(7) The Greek texts vary considerably from the Ethiopic text here. One Greek manuscript adds to this section, "And they [the women] bore to them [the Watchers] three races–first, the great giants. The giants brought forth [some say "slew"] the Naphelim, and the Naphelim brought forth [or "slew"] the Elioud. And they existed, increasing in power according to their greatness." See the account in the Book of Jubilees.
12Whose stature was each three hundred cubits. These devoured all which the labor of men produced; until it became impossible to feed them;
13When they turned themselves against men, in order to devour them;

 

[MathewJames]

Not seeing it, brother.

Got any specific verses from Enoch...?

Not sure if Chapter 7 reads to your question. The word jinn is not used.