African American Culture Appropriation(hypocrisy?)

[Kangaroo Feathers]

The thought is that a culture that develops under the hardship of slavery and discrimination is cheapened when it is appropriated by the culture that oversaw slavery and discrimination. It's like a German catholic taking on the airs of a Jew and talking about the hardships of the Holocaust.

What do you think "a German catholic taking on the airs of a Jew and talking about the hardships of the Holocaust." would be analogous to, specifically? Like what actual, specific action?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

I don't think I need to rephrase anything, my meanings are clear. Can you answer the core question here or not?

I do not read highly charged emotional posts. They take away from the point(s) you make and close any communication beyond our own personal views.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

OMG!
The cultural appropriation here is utterly beyond the pale.
When I get my hands around the waist of that burly black stud, I am going to rip off his kilt and throw it as far as I can.
Tom

Am I supposed to be outraged by this appropriation?

Or this?

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

I do not read highly charged emotional posts. They take away from the point(s) you make and close any communication beyond our own personal views.

If you'd read it, you'd have seen it wasn't emotional. I'm still waiting for any attempt to explain how borrowing diminishes anyone.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

If you'd read it, you'd have seen it wasn't emotional. I'm still waiting for any attempt to explain how borrowing diminishes anyone.

Im not hip with sarcasm either. Tone it down and dont take it personal....

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

Im not hip with sarcasm either. Tone it down and dont take it personal....

What sarcasm?

So, I assume all this dodging is tacit admission that you can not, in fact, support your claim?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

You are taking this quote personal:

You know nothing about me or my backgro

I said. I honestly dont believe you understand it.

So explain it, then

Will you listen?

I take a lot of thought in my posts.

What nonsense. Most places it's considered highly respectful to speak to people in their native language, rather than expect them to speak English. Indeed, many places the insult is expecting them to speak English while yo

As long as you do so with respect, its fine. If you spit at their culture, it is not.

How are minorities "diminished" by borrowing from them? Specifically? How is anyone diminished by borrowing? You

They dont see it as borrowing.

They see it as stealing.

Their view not yours (as a group)

I never suggested anyone be anything but respectful. That doesn't mean I need permission to borrow from anyone's culture, any more than anyone n

Everyone defines respect differently. As long as people are open to see everyone elses views, then all is good.

You're making the claim. It's up to you to support it.

Support it for you to disagree with it?

I gave you my thoughts and opinions. Cultural appropriation is a personal topic that hits chords with people. The support comes in opinions and experiences.

If you cant respect that, then how are you going to attempt to understand others beyond first appearances.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

What sarcasm?

So, I assume all this didging is tacit admission that you can not, infact, support your claim?

Cultural appropriate is a personal heated topic. Supports and claims are experiences and opinions especially from those who are in the middle of it. Ive seen people ignorant of other cultural practices. Some respect is still ackowedge even history clashes.

For example,

I went to see my family deep in North Carolina. We saw KKK memorials. At the chitlin' parade, KKK and African americans were riding side by side. They had some respect to each other even though their own groups its highly the opposite.

You may never agree; and, that does not mean I never supposed my point. You just disagree with it.

 

[SomeRandom]

View attachment 22306

Am I supposed to be outraged by this appropriation?

View attachment 22307

Or this?

To be fair, I'm sure many were offended by Black Knight's rather poor appropriation of cinema.

 

[Cacotopia]

What about for profit? Is that negative or positive?

You ever go to the country that the African Americans, or ANYONE ELSE are yammering about, hey stop stealing our culture? They're selling it like hot cakes over there. They sell it everywhere in the origin nation. I have yet to find a culture in the world that doesn't sell their own culture within their own borders. Tourism is a massive economic business for them. I haven't been everywhere yet, 30 or so countries, but literally every single one I been too they sell their cultural identity to tourists. Come see our ceremonies, but you have to wear our sarongs and kamen, which they ain't gonna lend to you, you gone buy those suckers, I have a batik sarong and kamen when I have to attend important ceremonies. they sell kilts in Scotland, lederhosens in Germany, and "authentic TX BS" is a cow patty contained in resin. It's everywhere.

So who are these folks speaking against cultural appropriation? I find it odd that they aren't going to the source.

 

[Cacotopia]

Cultural appropriate is a personal heated topic. Supports and claims are experiences and opinions especially from those who are in the middle of it. Ive seen people ignorant of other cultural practices. Some respect is still ackowedge even history clashes.

For example,

I went to see my family deep in North Carolina. We saw KKK memorials. At the chitlin' parade, KKK and African americans were riding side by side. They had some respect to each other even though their own groups its highly the opposite.

You may never agree; and, that does not mean I never supposed my point. You just disagree with it.

I think it's paramount to understand your own and other's history just in case you might not want to repeat the mistakes of the past again. If you want to understand current events, look into the past that led to the current decisions.

 

[Cacotopia]

Is that a problem for someone who cherishes their "wheelhouse of solitude"?
Tom

I don't need physical interaction. I explained that I like to keep up with my real friends that I have met in the past not a bunch of tourists I'll never see again.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

You ever go to the country that the African Americans, or ANYONE ELSE are yammering about, hey stop stealing our culture? They're selling it like hot cakes over there. They sell it everywhere in the origin nation. I have yet to find a culture in the world that doesn't sell their own culture within their own borders. Tourism is a massive economic business for them. I haven't been everywhere yet, 30 or so countries, but literally every single one I been too they sell their cultural identity to tourists. Come see our ceremonies, but you have to wear our sarongs and kamen, which they ain't gonna lend to you, you gone buy those suckers, I have a batik sarong and kamen when I have to attend important ceremonies. they sell kilts in Scotland, lederhosens in Germany, and "authentic TX BS" is a cow patty contained in resin. It's everywhere.

So who are these folks speaking against cultural appropriation? I find it odd that they aren't going to the source.

A lot of people who sell their items dont chose to. They Need to. Native Americans sell their cultural items to tourists because it brings money to their reservations. The US comes to their POW WOWS during national holidays.

I dont know about India (??) But outside the urban areas, its a necessity. Cultural appropriation isnt intended unless one needs to "sell themselves" to survive. I mean, if I go and take a family arlum from a family, they arent willing to sell that right away. Religious items such as sacred scripture people uphold til death. The Catholic Church sells "holy water" but the water isnt holy until blessed by the priest. Can you imagine someone taking it and using it with soap to wash themselves with?

Cultural appropriation is about people's personal traditions they dont Want to give a way. They dont Want to give it to the very people who kill their own people. Can you imagine Muslims giving away their Qurans at the will of their christian foes.

The context is totally different than touristism. Totally.

 

[Cacotopia]

Plenty of harm can come from isolationist ideals. This is a fickle topic to be sure. Say your family has a practice in herbalism. In indonesia there is a guy that has about 40 acres of jungle and he knows where all the medicinal plants grow in the wild. But he won't share the information with anyone outside his family, but the continued aid to the surrounding community his service provides is dependent on his children being interested in continuing the family business. Or musicians and artists not sharing techniques learned from personal experience, or family medical practices not sharing cures, or corporations holding a recipe or cure secret because it is very profitable for them.

It hurts the whole to withhold beneficial information. You need money to live so you hold certain things close to the chest so that others are dependent on your services. If you share these ideas then you are no longer needed, but if you hold on to them to closely, they die with you.

 

[Cooky]

Cultural appropriation is a personal topic that hits chords with people. The support comes in opinions and experiences.

If you cant respect that, then how are you going to attempt to understand others beyond first appearances.

Some might see it as an excuse to manipulate people who don't *look* like they belong in said culture.

...Are you sure it's not a control thing?

 

[Revoltingest]

De ja vu



Its more than just taking something from someone else.

Think of if you had a family valuable thats been in your generation for years. (Hypothetical) You want to keep it in your own family and pass it down.

Only in This hypothetical, only, if I came and took one of your family's cherished items, painted it my own rainbow colors, and said "Im respecting your family not droping the item to break", how would you feel (or someone in the position who values family items if you dont would feel) that I, a stranger, would do such a thing to your family line?

Even if you dont care about family values or dont have any, if someone does, how would you think They would feel about breaking their generations valuables?

Only answer according to the details of the analogy not mix a match them.

If its right, how?

If its wrong, how?

Nothing in between.



Dont understand the connection. Stereotypes isnt the same as appropriation.

Stealing some possession from someone is vastly different from embracing part
of someone else's culture. In the latter case, there's no material loss. It's unrealistic
& selfish to expect to enforce exclusivity on matters like clothing, music, etc.

Huh? How does this relate?

People often label something as a "choice" for the purpose of denying rights to that choice.
They feel that if something isn't a "choice", then & only then they've a right to it.
I don't buy into that argument.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Some might see it as an excuse to manipulate people who don't *look* like they belong in said culture.

...Are you sure it's not a control thing?

Coercion, type of thing? Im not sure I understand.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Stealing some possession from someone is vastly different from embracing part
of someone else's culture. In the latter case, there's no material loss. It's unrealistic
& selfish to expect to enforce exclusivity on matters like clothing, music, etc.

With both, stealing material item or generation honored tradition in the same culture go hand in hand. It doesnt make sense to many, but not all things "stolen" or appropriated has to be material. Thats why one should ideally have some familar connection with that said culture so they know when and whats respectful and whats not.

For example, ASL isnt material, but as a hearing person, if I use it for my own benefit, its taking something not owned and, thereby, insulting the people raised to use the language to which helps them communicate. Can you imagine someone taking away your soul means of communicating? Chopping off arms of a painter, ears of a musician, eyes of an scketch artist, and so forth. You can take our paints literally but personally, it does more damage than taking an item. Goes deeper than that.

I choose not to use ASL for personal use even though I have a hearing/brain challenge that keeps me from understanding spoken language even though I can hear. Its a balance.

People often label something as a "choice" for the purpose of denying rights to that choice. They feel that if something isn't a

I cant remember the connection. Though, Pagans didnt have a choice when their customs where appropriate by christians as to save their lives by going along with appr* Pagan culture.

I have a choice to use ASL for my advantage. I have a choice to go to a Catholic Church and take the holy water as drinking water...or use the mats Muslims pray on for home decoration.

Thats the difference

 

[Revoltingest]

With both, stealing material item or generation honored tradition in the same culture go hand in hand. It doesnt make sense to many, but not all things "stolen" or appropriated has to be material. Thats why one should ideally have some familar connection with that said culture so they know when and whats respectful and whats not.

For example, ASL isnt material, but as a hearing person, if I use it for my own benefit, its taking something not owned and, thereby, insulting the people raised to use the language to which helps them communicate. Can you imagine someone taking away your soul means of communicating? Chopping off arms of a painter, ears of a musician, eyes of an scketch artist, and so forth. You can take our paints literally but personally, it does more damage than taking an item. Goes deeper than that.

I choose not to use ASL for personal use even though I have a hearing/brain challenge that keeps me from understanding spoken language even though I can hear. Its a balance.



I cant remember the connection. Though, Pagans didnt have a choice when their customs where appropriate by christians as to save their lives by going along with appr* Pagan culture.

I have a choice to use ASL for my advantage. I have a choice to go to a Catholic Church and take the holy water as drinking water...or use the mats Muslims pray on for home decoration.

Thats the difference

When insulting people, the problem is insulting them, not appropriating culture.
Of course, I exclude people who feel insulted simply over the loss of exclusivity.

 

[columbus]

For example, ASL isnt material, but as a hearing person, if I use it for my own benefit, its taking something not owned and, thereby, insulting the people raised to use the language to which helps them communicate. Can you imagine someone taking away your soul means of communicating?

This is complete BS.
You using ASL doesn't take anything away from deaf people at all. No more than my learning French and speaking it took away the soul of France.
Tom