Alabama passes bill making some transgender healthcare a felony

[Reyn]

That I know for sure in Indiana with parental permission (I haven't researched the law beyond that state in regards to this).

Okay. I'm sure you think you're clever at this point but most all I see is someone, desperate to defend something which can't rationally be defended. The reason it's not legal in sane places for an 8 year old to have sex with a 42 year old is because the 8 year old isn't capable of giving consent. The same goes for tattoos, sterilization, and other permanent forms of alteration. My question, which you continue to side track is why children should be allowed to take puberty blockers, cross sex hormones, and even have surgery, revolving around their gender identity?

 

[SkepticThinker]

Exactly why do you think it’s okay for a child to decide whether they are a boy or a girl? How even can they?

Who else but the child him/herself? Exactly why do you think it's okay for someone else to decide for someone else what their gender should be?

 

[SkepticThinker]

Let's see how that works with the law. A child can't decide to drive a car, drink whiskey, smoke or use tobacco. He is legally controlled by his or her parents or guardian in most every important aspect of life but you think he should be allowed to change his sex on a whim?
That's far more damaging than letting a kid get drunk or cut school.
Dos not compute.

Nobody is saying anything about "on a whim."
Just you.

 

[Reyn]

Who else but the child him/herself? Exactly why do you think it's okay for someone else to decide for someone else what their gender should be?

No one is deciding the sex of the child, they are observing it. That is what happens when the doctor says, "it's a boy!" or "It's a girl!".

 

[metis]

No one is deciding the sex of the child, they are observing it. That is what happens when the doctor says, "it's a boy!" or "It's a girl!".

But it's hormones, not "equipment", that mostly decides which way they mostly desire to go.

 

[Reyn]

But it's hormones, not "equipment", that mostly decides which way they mostly desire to go.

I am not discussing intersex, which is rare. I'm discussing natal males and females here.

 

[metis]

I am not discussing intersex, which is rare. I'm discussing natal males and females here.

I wasn't referring to "intersex" either.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Okay. I'm sure you think you're clever at this point but most all I see is someone, desperate to defend something which can't rationally be defended. The reason it's not legal in sane places for an 8 year old to have sex with a 42 year old is because the 8 year old isn't capable of giving consent. The same goes for tattoos, sterilization, and other permanent forms of alteration. My question, which you continue to side track is why children should be allowed to take puberty blockers, cross sex hormones, and even have surgery, revolving around their gender identity?

Because I side with science and medicine. Because I've clearly studied this more than you.
And I'm not desperately defending something. Why should I be desperate in the face of ignorance when I have decades of knowledge and experience guiding me?
And I don't think I'm clever. I know I am. Just looks to me like you are frustrated getting beat at your own game that you wanted to play.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Here is the why. Answer the question.
List of youngest birth mothers - Wikipedia

I did. As I said, children generally aren't physiological capable of reproduction. This link is of exceptions, not the norms.
When a woman as an adult and she is told no it is misogyny, and most likely a male of a comparable situation will not be told no, neither by the doctor or the law.
And getting sterilized,if a child is wanting it that is a red flag that must be explored because it doesn't normally happen.

 

[Wildswanderer]

Nobody is saying anything about "on a whim."
Just you.

And how can you know what is a whim and what isn't? Kids are apt to play all kinds of make-believe games that have nothing to do with their actual identity. And you've got morons wanting to let them pretend to be cats all day also. The world has gone insane.

 

[SkepticThinker]

So you are claiming no one who gets a sex change regrets it later?
It's all in the mind, therefore a whim. It's not real. Used to be known as mental illness for good reason.

Just because something occurs in one's mind, doesn't make it a mere "whim."

 

[SkepticThinker]

Those are not what I mean by tampering with nature. Removing cancer and removing healthy tissue for cosmetic reasons are not compatible. Neither is blocking the natural hormones that lead to development and growth.

And yet they are actual examples of how we tamper with "nature" all the time. Your refusal to acknowledge that, aside. I hope you don't wear glasses, because that would be "tampering with nature." If you want to be all natural, you should walk around not being able to see anything.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Not legally. Because they aren't of legal age to choose.

Why do you think you get to decide someone else's medical decisions for them?

 

[SkepticThinker]

Okay. I'm sure you think you're clever at this point but most all I see is someone, desperate to defend something which can't rationally be defended. The reason it's not legal in sane places for an 8 year old to have sex with a 42 year old is because the 8 year old isn't capable of giving consent. The same goes for tattoos, sterilization, and other permanent forms of alteration. My question, which you continue to side track is why children should be allowed to take puberty blockers, cross sex hormones, and even have surgery, revolving around their gender identity?

Children aren't being given gender-changing surgery before the age of 18.
That's just Republican/Tucker Carlson culture war crap that is completely made up. But thanks to them and their lies, children's hospitals are now getting bomb threats. Children's hospitals.

 

[SkepticThinker]

No one is deciding the sex of the child, they are observing it. That is what happens when the doctor says, "it's a boy!" or "It's a girl!".

No. That's observing the sex of the child.

 

[SkepticThinker]

And how can you know what is a whim and what isn't? Kids are apt to play all kinds of make-believe games that have nothing to do with their actual identity. And you've got morons wanting to let them pretend to be cats all day also. The world has gone insane.

You're the one declaring it a "whim," not me. You're the one declaring it "make believe games," not me. Both of those are obviously being used in a derogatory manner.

I'm leaving it up to the individuals involved to decide, because I am not equipped enough, nor informed enough to make medical decisions for other people. Just for myself.

 

[Subduction Zone]

And yet they are actual examples of how we tamper with "nature" all the time. Your refusal to acknowledge that, aside. I hope you don't wear glasses, because that would be "tampering with nature." If you want to be all natural, you should walk around not being able to see anything.

And worse yet allowing others to see everything

 

[Wildswanderer]

You're the one declaring it a "whim," not me. You're the one declaring it "make believe games," not me. Both of those are obviously being used in a derogatory manner.

I'm leaving it up to the individuals involved to decide, because I am not equipped enough, nor informed enough to make medical decisions for other people. Just for myself.

You are leaving it up to kids who can't decide what underwear they want today to decide on their gender? Kids who can't even decide where they should live, and have to be told to bath and brush their teeth making life altering decisions? Lunacy.

 

[Wildswanderer]

Why do you think you get to decide someone else's medical decisions for them?

Because I'm a adult and as such I'm legally responsible if I have a child to care for. It's literally my job to make their medical decisions for them.

 

[Subduction Zone]

You are leaving it up to kids who can't decide what underwear they want today to decide on their gender? Kids who can't even decide where they should live, and have to be told to bath and brush their teeth making life altering decisions? Lunacy.

They are not deciding their gender. You really should look into the science that supports the claims of the transgender. When you make nonsensical statements that no one else is claiming you lose the argument.