Another School Shooting

[Father Heathen]

Hard to take you serious when you have such a serious lack of knowledge concerning the fire arm laws in the USA.

It's funny how people who's overly simplistic, pre-canned, and spoonfed point of view comes from very limited, narrow, and biased media sources (sometimes with a political or social agenda) presume to know better about an issue than those with a lifetime of direct experience with it.

For most of my life I've lived in small towns where every household owns atleast one firearm, and have known lots of family and friends with them; I've always been around them. People who've hunted, target practice, etc. yet never any gun related crimes or accidents. Everyone in these communities have always treated firearms and firearm usage with a great sense of respect and responsibility.
But then you hear this mewling and screeching from quant and distant lands telling you that your friends and family are blood-thirsty, trigger happy lunatics, and that once they're disarmed, gang violence will disappear from inner city ghettos and the mentally ill will be cured.

 

[Revoltingest]

And if simplistic solutions like oppressive gun control really worked,
then Brazil wouldn't have a higher gun death problem than Americastan.
List of countries by firearm-related death rate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Things is complicated. We can all agree that we want a low rate of wrongful
gun use, so the real question should be how we achieve it while preserving
civil liberties.

 

[Apex]

Why is anyone surprised at this?
America's right to bear arms is strongly supported, obviously the British could attack any time now!
So why get upset over this obvious consequence?
Sad but it goes with the territory.

USA gun policy global comparisons

Cheers

OMG! Look at that! Those numbers are insane!

Canada's homicide rate is over 500% more than Japan's! Canada's gun crime is spiraling out of control! What are they doing about this? Surely they are instituting harsh crack downs on guns in their country. Right?

 

[suncowiam]

OMG! Look at that! Those numbers are insane!

Canada's homicide rate is over 500% more than Japan's! Canada's gun crime is spiraling out of control! What are they doing about this? Surely they are instituting harsh crack downs on guns in their country. Right?

Are you saying one shouldn't try to achieve Japan's rate because its too close to perfect?

I don't understand what your sarcasim is implying. Yes, I do want a rate of near zero or even zero concerning death by firearms.

Maybe you should truly be concerned at the rate that Canada and US has compared to Japan and not make a simple sarcastic statement desensitizing the harm that firearms can irreversibly do?

So, I'm all about stopping these deaths by firearms and preserving the right of a sane and responsible person.

How do we get there? And what do we do, if we cannot?

 

[Tiapan]

I demand my right as an individual to own what ever weapon of mass destruction I can create, as my inalienable right through civil liberty. But do I really need it if my appendage already big enough.

 

[Tiapan]

OMG! Look at that! Those numbers are insane!

Canada's homicide rate is over 500% more than Japan's! Canada's gun crime is spiraling out of control! What are they doing about this? Surely they are instituting harsh crack downs on guns in their country. Right?

I guess your right it would be hard to avoid with such close proximity to the USA. I bet most gun homicides are in the nearest southern areas and far less in the north until you hit Alaska. That's the beauty of free trade.

If you watch american action films all problems are solved with high velocity chunks of lead, yet UK Australian and European action films are usually solved with brains. Is there a reason for this difference?

Cheers

 

[Sunstone]

The Gun Lobby is so opposed to even the most reasonable restrictions on guns that it may take a Constitutional amendment to achieve something approximating rationality on this issue.

 

[Revoltingest]

I guess your right it would be hard to avoid with such close proximity to the USA. I bet most gun homicides are in the nearest southern areas and far less in the north until you hit Alaska. That's the beauty of free trade.

If you watch american action films all problems are solved with high velocity chunks of lead, yet UK Australian and European action films are usually solved with brains. Is there a reason for this difference?
Cheers

Yeah, right.....those brainy Aussie peaceniks who just talk, reason & glomp
their way out of personal conflicts with guys like Toecutter & Humongus.....

I demand my right as an individual to own what ever weapon of mass destruction I can create, as my inalienable right through civil liberty. But do I really need it if my appendage already big enough.

Why is it that anti-gun types always experience sexual feelings when the subject of guns arrives?
Given the diversity of humanity, it's not reasonable to presume that your arousal happens in others,
or that there aren't practical & philosophical reasons for our advocacy. For example, if a dingo is
stealing your baby, you could shoot it (the dingo).

 

[suncowiam]

Yeah, right.....those brainy Aussie peaceniks who just talk, reason & glomp
their way out of personal conflicts with guys like Toecutter & Humongus.....

Why is it that anti-gun types always experience sexual feelings when the subject of guns arrives?
Given the diversity of humanity, it's not reasonable to presume that your arousal happens in others,
or that there aren't practical & philosophical reasons for our advocacy. For example, if a dingo is
stealing your baby, you could shoot it (the dingo).

I actually think there is a specific psychology of owning guns that gun owners become dependent on, maybe even to the point of addiction.

By no means am I stating this as a fact but I get the sense of confidence and empowerment when talking to gun owners. They feel less helpless to their environment. Many gun owners debate defense from criminals, defense from government and their constitutional right but I'm not convinced this is the main reason for those owners. They simply really love their guns. They find enjoyment and other psychological factors to "need" to continue the relationship .

I've had friends that started owning guns and they start making jokes of using their guns to control hypothetical situations.

Again, this is my opinion which is not founded but I offer it here with a full disclaimer.

 

[Revoltingest]

I actually think there is a specific psychology of owning guns that gun owners become dependent on, maybe even to the point of addiction.

People can obsess over anything. But is this mere pop psychology being used
to portray extreme elements of gun ownership & advocacy as the norm? We
don't see this same demonizing rationale applied to fast cars or motorcycles.
Why? Even the anti-gun rights types like these things.

By no means am I stating this as a fact but I get the sense of confidence and empowerment when talking to gun owners. They feel less helpless to their environment.

Really? I don't know a single gun owner IRL who feels helpless in the
first place. (Perhaps it's just the crowd I run with, eh.)
Guns are interesting. They symbolize & protect freedom. They put
meat on the table. And they're fun to shoot. (Although I over-did
it in competition, & what was fun became more like work.)

Many gun owners debate defense from criminals, defense from government and their constitutional right but I'm not convinced this is the main reason for those owners. They simply really love their guns. They find enjoyment and other psychological factors to "need" to continue the relationship.

There's no need to invent reasons to justify the "relationship". But
while you might doubt the sincerity or legitimacy of the constitutional
argument, many of us find it compelling, along with the reasons the
2nd Amendment is in the Constitution.

I've had friends that started owning guns and they start making jokes of using their guns to control hypothetical situations.
Again, this is my opinion which is not been founded but I offer it here with a full disclaimer.

I do take offense & alarm at the large number of untrained gun owners
who are cavalier about safety & etiquette. Guns can be great sport, but
they're very serious business.

 

[suncowiam]

They symbolize & protect freedom.

Fair response but let me focus on this particular line.

Is this really true that guns symbolize and protect freedom?

I consider myself and my family free since the age of six when we migrated to US . We have never owned guns and I can say that my freedom was never compromised.

 

[Revoltingest]

Is this really true that guns symbolize and protect freedom?

"True" is perhaps not the best word to apply here. I say it's a matter of cultural
& philosophical perspective. I see this symbolism because of who I am, ie, someone
who grew up around guns, competed with them as sport, became a Libertarian
(40 years ago), & see that security is something not left solely up to government.

I consider myself and my family free since the age six when we migrated to US. We have never owned guns and I can say that my freedom was never compromised.

Amricastan has many different environments, cultures, & political persuasions.
I don't expect that everyone will share my perspective.

 

[Father Heathen]

I demand my right as an individual to own what ever weapon of mass destruction I can create, as my inalienable right through civil liberty.

Does this ridiculously exaggerated analogy mean that you don't actually have a rational, substantiated argument?

But do I really need it if my appendage already big enough.

I could offer you a close look if you want to test your theory.

 

[Father Heathen]

Why is it that anti-gun types always experience sexual feelings when the subject of guns arrives?
Given the diversity of humanity, it's not reasonable to presume that your arousal happens in others,
or that there aren't practical & philosophical reasons for our advocacy. For example, if a dingo is
stealing your baby, you could shoot it (the dingo).

I think their tendancy to make such childish assertions is due to a resentment from seeing others who don't posess the same fears, paranoia, insecurities, and subservience as they do.

 

[suncowiam]

"True" is perhaps not the best word to apply here. I say it's a matter of cultural
& philosophical perspective. I see this symbolism because of who I am, ie, someone
who grew up around guns, competed with them as sport, became a Libertarian
(40 years ago), & see that security is something not left solely up to government.

Amricastan has many different environments, cultures, & political persuasions.
I don't expect that everyone will share my perspective.

Personally, I would say that Freedom is better symbolized by action, specifically action by individuals that are defiant to discrimination, bigotry, and tyranny. I don't mean to make it so grand sounding but I think it's still the best definition for me.

 

[oldbadger]

Hard to take you serious when you have such a serious lack of knowledge concerning the fire arm laws in the USA.

Ha ha! What a joke!
Don't bother to take me seriously........
Try taking the numbers of school and public shootings seriously.
Try taking the numbers of deaths per annum by shootings seriously.
Try taking the injuries per annum caused by shootings seriously.
Try taking the fact that people can own guns before they are even allowed to purchase beer....... seriously!.
Try taking the idea that guns are for brandishing on your doorsteps. (how pathetic that reads )...... seriously!
Try taking that members have previously mentioned on RF that guns should be available for the day when they will need to stand against their own government. ...... seriously?
The list could on and on and on...........
....... so you live in a land where your cops approach with drawn, held or touched pistols even for a speeding violation.
....... so you live in a land awash with guns..........
Don't take me seriously........ get on with it. And don't moan when it goes wrong, again, and again, and again.....

What do you call this? A 'rant'? No. It's a sad fact. Sad.

 

[Revoltingest]

Personally, I would say that Freedom is better symbolized by action, specifically action by individuals that are defiant to discrimination, bigotry, and tyranny.

Those things are good too.

I don't mean to make it so grand sounding but I think it's still the best definition for me.

Okey dokey.

 

[Revoltingest]

Ha ha! What a joke!
Don't bother to take me seriously........
Try taking the numbers of school and public shootings seriously.
Try taking the numbers of deaths per annum by shootings seriously.
Try taking the injuries per annum caused by shootings seriously.
Try taking the fact that people can own guns before they are even allowed to purchase beer....... seriously!.
Try taking the idea that guns are for brandishing on your doorsteps. (how pathetic that reads )...... seriously!
Try taking that members have previously mentioned on RF that guns should be available for the day when they will need to stand against their own government. ...... seriously?
The list could on and on and on...........
....... so you live in a land where your cops approach with drawn, held or touched pistols even for a speeding violation.
....... so you live in a land awash with guns..........
Don't take me seriously........ get on with it. And don't moan when it goes wrong, again, and again, and again.....

What do you call this? A 'rant'? No. It's a sad fact. Sad.

Sounds pretty ranty to me.
Just remember who yer friends are when the Huns come a'knock'n.

 

[McBell]

Ha ha! What a joke!
Don't bother to take me seriously........
Try taking the numbers of school and public shootings seriously.
Try taking the numbers of deaths per annum by shootings seriously.
Try taking the injuries per annum caused by shootings seriously.
Try taking the fact that people can own guns before they are even allowed to purchase beer....... seriously!.
Try taking the idea that guns are for brandishing on your doorsteps. (how pathetic that reads )...... seriously!
Try taking that members have previously mentioned on RF that guns should be available for the day when they will need to stand against their own government. ...... seriously?
The list could on and on and on...........
....... so you live in a land where your cops approach with drawn, held or touched pistols even for a speeding violation.
....... so you live in a land awash with guns..........
Don't take me seriously........ get on with it. And don't moan when it goes wrong, again, and again, and again.....

What do you call this? A 'rant'? No. It's a sad fact. Sad.

Thank you for further proving my point.
Perhaps if you put half as much time and energy learning about gun laws in the USA as you did in your pathetic little rant...

I shant be holding my breath though.

 

[oldbadger]

Sounds pretty ranty to me.
Just remember who yer friends are when the Huns come a'knock'n.

Ohhhhh........ They're aren't any Huns any more. They're Europeans now.
And what has the 2nd World War got to do with CR checks, quals, Licensing, Mandatory Insurance and compulsory home security for firearms got to do with the US entering the war after being attacked by the Axis Allies?