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Are you sure you are an Atheist?
- Thread starter Nefelie
- Start date
Demonslayer
Well-Known Member
Jabar
“Strive always to excel in virtue and truth.”
Thief
Rogue Theologian
so...what DOES God need Muslims (servants)for?He does not need Muslims to defend the Qur'an.
NewGuyOnTheBlock
Cult Survivor/Fundamentalist Pentecostal Apostate
Jehova isn't much of a God if he needs Christians to defend the Bible.
Christianity is idolatry as it holds the Bible to be the inerrant word of God; a series of documents with "who knows how much" lost in translation chosen by a council of human beings many years ago where the nominees were canonized by a show of hands ...
Then it appears that you and I are speaking the same language.
Good to know you have faith in such things.
Interesting, cause I understand this in the same way.
Whereas I do think of my body as separate from me at times, or even separate from itself. As in, my nose is not my arm. If I have problem (of any sort) with my arm, I'm not thinking that in my nose, or eye, or foot is the solution. Or the idea that I may treasure my full set of hair, but literally watch it be cut away from me and separated from the rest of my body.
If spirit were cut away from my body, I would think my body would cease to appear alive, cease to move.
Though I do entertain notion that my spirit is not contained to my body. But given my faith/conviction in the physical, I honestly do think it is contained to the body more often than not.
Also do appreciate modern medicine notions (or traditional eastern medicine conception) of the body being whole, in such a way where a problem in my arm could plausibly represent a problem/illness occurring elsewhere (or arguably everywhere) in the same body. While spiritually, I understand it is more likely a perceived problem stemming from a split mind, essentially confused about my own reality, manifesting in what I self identify as 'me.'
NewGuyOnTheBlock
Cult Survivor/Fundamentalist Pentecostal Apostate
I sense another lame attempt to convolute "complete confidence" with "strong belief in God or in the doctrines of religion based on spiritual apprehension rather than proof". It is an ineffective attempt to put atheism on the same plane as religion. It is erroneous thinking, sloppy thinking, wholly false. The "fath" of a theist that their car will start in the morning is completely different than the "faith" a theist holds in spirit, soul, doctrine, deities. The pathetic attempt tp equate the two is nothing more than word games, bait and switch, shell game.
I am sure that I am an atheist becuse I have no faith.
But "faith" in that sense is simply a contraction for the doctrine of faith. As an atheist you have no doctrine of faith, which is to say you belong to no particular set of religious ideas or institutions.
"Faith" in the sense of faith in spirit, soul, deities, or faith in the doctrine itself, doesn't differ, except for a minor grammatical classification, from faith that the car will start. Faith in deity, or instance, is faith that it will..., or faith that it does or has..., or faith that it is...
You've already expressed the faith you have. All the rest of this is your added, bonus perceptions. Which incidentally, are upheld by faith.
Agondonter
Active Member
True.
Christianity, too, is idolatry inasmuch it holds the Bible to be the inerrant word of God. Even so, we dont see them marching in their thousands protesting Muslims who actually did use pages from torn from the Bible as toilet paper.
Demonslayer
Well-Known Member
Blowin' up the infidels.
NewGuyOnTheBlock
Cult Survivor/Fundamentalist Pentecostal Apostate
I am apalled that a concept as simple as the distinction between "strong confidence" based on evidence vs. "belief" based on ... well ... nothing except maybe belief itself ... is as different as night and day. I am out of words and examples to illustrate a very simple, obtuse distinction. I have no words; and for me, that is a rare occurance.
--- EDIT ---
Religious faith is held to be above and beyond evidence. One need not prove Jesus rose from the dead or enlightenment is achieved via rituals and changing thought patterns or dream catchers ward away evil spirits and nightmares or Zoroastar was born of a virgin. The "evidence" of such beliefs is in the belief itself. I, like most atheists, have no such faith. None. Zip, zilch, nadda.
Trust ... faith ... "strong confidence" ... is based on evidence. Sure, when I was a kid, when someone told me a car would start because you turn the ignition, I gave it no further thought. Then I grew up and learned to think critically. I have "faith" in the spinning of the globe and in the starting of my car based on evidence; and on some level of understanding on how things work. I have "faith" that my car will start based on the fact that I have no good reason to believe otherwise.
The car starts because my ignition closes the circuit, the battery supplies power to the starter which turns the stuff inside which starts the process of compression and ignition blah blah blah. On the rare occasioins that my car does NOT start, proper diagnosing can clearly identify the reason behind this and upon effective repairs, voila, the car will start. This strong confidence is based on fact and evidence.
Religious faith is different. Back when I was a believer, I prayed for things to happen. I convinced myself by sheer will that my prayers would be answered. I convinced myself that this was true by sheer willpower. Strangely, I was immune to evidence back then: when my prayers weren't answered, i decided the reason was because of lack of faith or some deity's decision to answer my prayer with a "no" and continued to believe. If my car doesn't start and I have yet to discern the cause of the malfunction, I don't "believe" it will start tomorrow (after all, it's probably just mad at me or God made it not start to protect me from a terrible car wreck today); I have good reason at this point to have strong confidence that it will not start (based on the evidence that it has failed to do so today) until the root cause of this malfunction is discerned and repaired.
The inability of you to see the vast difference between "faith" (i.e. wishfull thinking based on spiritual apprehension or beliief) vs. "faith (i.e. strong confdence based on evidence and knowledge) is due simply to the fact that you don't want to.
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Agondonter
Active Member
NewGuyOnTheBlock:
FYI, as with most skeptics (and many believers), you haven't a clue as to what faith is.
FYI, as with most skeptics (and many believers), you haven't a clue as to what faith is.
NewGuyOnTheBlock
Cult Survivor/Fundamentalist Pentecostal Apostate
Enlighten me.
Demonslayer
Well-Known Member
Could be demons. You never know.
Agondonter
Active Member
Faith is not about beliefs, but an attitude towards life.