Ask About Islam

[KWED]

KWED both biases can go one way or another.

No idea what you are talking about.

First rule of doubt, know when to stop doubting.

You just made that up. There are no "rules of doubt".

 

[Link]

No idea what you are talking about.

You just made that up. There are no "rules of doubt".

There are rules. If you doubt everything that needs not be doubted, your doubts aren't useful. They don't distinguish what you should not affirm from what you should be sure of.

Same with truth and knowledge. If we deceive ourselves we are certain about things, when we aren't certain of, our knowledge of truth get's mixed with deceptions of falsehood.

Both not affirming what we don't know and not doubting what we should not doubt are rules we know. Ignore those rules, and you get confused and lost.

 

[muhammad_isa]

..they have made my life horrible including madness I probably will never heal from..

Mmm .. G-d is the best of helpers. Do not despair.
Easier said that done, I know.
I also have suffered with mental health problems.

 

[Link]

Mmm .. G-d is the best of helpers. Do not despair.
Easier said that done, I know.
I also have suffered with mental health problems.

Salam

Thank you. If you don't mind, can you private message me what you suffer from?

 

[muhammad_isa]

You refuse to admit that it even could be wrong. You reject even the possibility. Not a rational or reasonable position at all..

It is not the same as the Bible. The Bible is composed of multiple scrolls with multiple authors, often unknown.

The Qur'an has not been seriously challenged by anybody.
That is my experience and understanding.
I therefore have no reason to doubt it.

 

[KWED]

It is not the same as the Bible. The Bible is composed of multiple scrolls with multiple authors, often unknown.

Who mentioned the Bible?

The Qur'an has not been seriously challenged by anybody.

Jeez, the denial is bewildering! People have been challenging the Quran since it was written. Obviously, Muslims reject those challenges. However, to the independent observer the Quran is clearly the flawed work of 7th century Arab men.

That is my experience and understanding.

Your experience and understanding appears somewhat limited.

I therefore have no reason to doubt it.

Confirmation bias. You are a devout Muslim. Of course you have no reason to doubt it, just as devout Christians have no reason to doubt the Bible, devout Jews the Torah, etc...

You seem to have regressed to classic "the Quran is true because I believe it is true".

 

[KWED]

There are rules. If you doubt everything that needs not be doubted, your doubts aren't useful. They don't distinguish what you should not affirm from what you should be sure of.

Same with truth and knowledge. If we deceive ourselves we are certain about things, when we aren't certain of, our knowledge of truth get's mixed with deceptions of falsehood.

Both not affirming what we don't know and not doubting what we should not doubt are rules we know. Ignore those rules, and you get confused and lost.

As I thought, you're just making it up.

 

[KWED]

For some reason, sorcerers and devils believe I need to be "put in my place". And so they have made my life horrible including madness I probably will never heal from.

I also have suffered with mental health problems.

It is interesting how often people who convert to religion also have mental health issues, experienced personal trauma, etc. Could just be coincidence of course but religion certainly offers promises of certainty, purpose, community, love, forgiveness, redemption etc etc. All very attractive to people whose lives are in turmoil.

 

[Link]

It is interesting how often people who convert to religion also have mental health issues, experienced personal trauma, etc. Could just be coincidence of course but religion certainly offers promises of certainty, purpose, community, love, forgiveness, redemption etc etc. All very attractive to people whose lives are in turmoil.

Some people commit suicide for going through what I go through. Yes, seeking God's help and Ahlulbayt (a) helping and Quran healing, is a big thing for my mental health.

So maybe my illness is a blessing in disguise for me. Maybe I would have ran towards chasing a temporary world that perishes were it not for it.

All praise to God whatever he decides and writes for us.

 

[KWED]

All praise to God whatever he decides and writes for us.

Ok. So you do accept that our lives are determined by Allah's decree rather than determined by our own choices. Glad we sorted that out.

Why do you think god decided to give you crippling mental health issues in the first place? Is that the only way to get people to see his truth?

 

[stevecanuck]

When you take verses out of the Quran and try to use them at your advantage, things can backfire. Know that.

For those who disbelieve...in Islam, the believers and disbelievers will be tested on this earth and even on the Day of Judgement. In Islam, you have a brain that has been given to you and Allah created mankind in the best of forms. (surat teen) So, in saying this, Allah knows already who will believe or not but he has given free will to mankind. In Islam, God is the one that is in control over all. Yes, he made hellfire and he made Paradise.

Take for example a killer, a murderer, a rapist, or an abuser. These are horrible people, but if they turn to God in repentance and believe in the Oneness of Allah and his messages, Allah is able to forgive. But in Islam, there is one sin that He will never forgive and that is associating partners unto Him. In saying that, He is able to make hellfire for those he wants. Who are we to question Allah as to why. He has his wrath as well as he has His Mercy. I never said he has to be all God's love like in Christianity claims. In Islam, we believe Allah can do as He wills and wishes and we are not to question why.

All you've done is confirm verse 4:56. There is nothing merciful about torturing people forever under any circumstances. Your god is a monster.

 

[muhammad_isa]

There is nothing merciful about torturing people forever under any circumstances..

G-d is not merciful to a treacherous ingrate..
That person only has themselves to blame.

Some people sink so low, they leave themselves no way out.

 

[stevecanuck]

G-d is not merciful to a treacherous ingrate..

There's your logical disconnect.

Who else is in need of mercy if not one who has committed the unforgivable? One who has done what is asked of him (i.e. a Muslim) is not in need of it. Unbelievers are the only ones who are, but your god has unequivocally stated many hundreds of times that none will be forthcoming. That brings us back to the point that "The Merciful" simply is not.

 

[muhammad_isa]

Who else is in need of mercy if not one who has committed the unforgivable?

This is a complete misunderstanding of the situation.
G-d cannot logically forgive or show mercy to a person who does not repent.

It is yet again, the case of atheists stating they believe in a worldly reality which is not negotiable, but wanting to create a different reality because G-d can make us all live happily ever after.

 

[ppp]

G-d cannot logically forgive or show mercy to a person who does not repent.

Why not? I can. I have. How can I do something that is beyond the abilities of your god?

 

[muhammad_isa]

Why not? I can. I have. How can I do something that is beyond the abilities of your god?

Are you comparing yourself to G-d?

Does your forgiving a non-repentant person cause the person to change direction?
G-d is not a person. There is a part of G-d in each one of us. A soul.
If the soul does not repent, it cannot be on a righteous path.

A person who forgives, forgives for themselves. It does not benefit the non-repentant soul.
G-d has no need of being forgiven. He has no need.

There can be no change in a soul if it does not repent or ask for forgiveness. That is by definition, when we talk about G-d's forgiveness.

Hell is a consequence. It is not a punishment in the sense of one person punishing another.

 

[ppp]

Are you comparing yourself to G-d?

I am comparing myself to your entirely human claims about your god.

Does your forgiving a non-repentant person cause the person to change direction?

Sure. I can think of more than one occasion off the top of my head.

And the rest of your post does nothing to address my question.

I am not forcing you to answer it, ya know?

 

[muhammad_isa]

And the rest of your post does nothing to address my question.

On the contrary, it does, but you dismiss it.

 

[stevecanuck]

This is a complete misunderstanding of the situation.
G-d cannot logically forgive or show mercy to a person who does not repent.

It is yet again, the case of atheists stating they believe in a worldly reality which is not negotiable, but wanting to create a different reality because G-d can make us all live happily ever after.

You're just confirming what I said. Showing mercy implies that a deserved punishment is being suspended, and your god is just never going to do that. We agree.

 

[stevecanuck]

G-d is not merciful to a treacherous ingrate..

Btw, I would like all the unbelievers (non-Muslims) out there to see exactly how we are portrayed in Islam. They may smile at you, but this is how they actually see you (not all Muslims - just the ones who know and faithfully follow the Qur'an).