ppp
Well-Known Member
Whomever agrees with that is both incorrect and immoral.
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Ask About Islam
- Thread starter MyM
- Start date
ppp
Well-Known Member
What specifically do you think that I do not understand about the concept?
WonderingWorrier
Active Member
Whomever doesnt understand the explanation under that statement doesnt know what they are talking about.
WonderingWorrier
Active Member
Seems you are having trouble understanding the words.
ppp
Well-Known Member
I understand it, silly. I am saying that it is incorrect and immoral. Didn't I just say that?
ppp
Well-Known Member
So, you think that anyone who understands you must necessarily agree with you? Hmmm. Get used to disappointment. ;-)
Again, what specifically do you think that I do not understand about the concept?
WonderingWorrier
Active Member
Ok. Sorry. Thought you had just taken a statement out of context.
Can you please explain my explanation back to me in your own words.
WonderingWorrier
Active Member
Can you show me that you understand me?
ppp
Well-Known Member
Sure. As soon as you answer the question that I have posed to you twice and been ignored.
WonderingWorrier
Active Member
Not ignoring. Thought it makes more sense for you to say your comprehension of the concept before I say what I think you dont understand about it.
Otherwise you can just say that you knew that when you didnt.
You say you understand me. Show me you understand me.
ppp
Well-Known Member
I agree that it would have, had you originally asked me how I interpreted your post. Instead of assuming that I didn't.
Ayup. I completely and utterly agree with you there. You most certainly seem to have a firm grasp on the situation in which you find yourself. One might even say, the bed that you have made for yourself in which to lie -- were one so inclined to make such a comment.
WonderingWorrier
Active Member
I know you dont understand the whole concept because I havent told you it yet.
Ive just been showing a small piece of it. Wondering if you are able to grasp it.
Trying to keep it simple and not to overwhelm with information.
You say you understand what Im saying. Show me.
And yes I assumed you hadnt interpreted the husband post correctly in your answer because of what you quoted. I said sorry.
I asked for you to explain my explanation back to me.
Perhaps we do agree.
WonderingWorrier
Active Member
I was waiting but I have to go soon. Got things to do. When you reply I will get back to you as soon as I can.
Can you please tell me your comprehension of the concept, and also your interpretation of the husband post.
Show me you understand me.
Then I will have a better understanding of your answers.
joelr
Well-Known Member
It makes people happy to lessen the fear of death and believe myths about an afterlife.
It's easy to be fooled by bad evidence when you want something to be true.
I'm not "smarter" I just care more about what is actually true. So I'm taking an honest look at the evidence. It's far far worse than I even thought. All these religions are sure they are the only correct one. They are 100% sure the others are wrong. Well, I've reached that conclusion about all of them. There are many many atheists now, many who have de-converted.
But, I'm always asking for evidence. I looked through an entire video of evidence just last week on this thread?
As you can see in this thread when you can debunk evidence people sometimes get hostile or will not speak to you or throw accusations at you. It shows there is a personal emotion connection. That also does not make something true because people have that in all religions and cults.
muhammad_isa
Veteran Member
I don't see that.
I think one has more to fear about death if they believe in G-d.
What happens after death is unknown .. that is the fear about death that I hold.
joelr
Well-Known Member
I'm going by stats. In this study 33% of people in the U.S. attend a service and 11% of scientists attend some religious service.
https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/2378023116664353
I don't know what communities are like in Islam. There was a time among academics in Christian circles it was weird to be a non-believer, maybe back in the early 1900s. Now it's normal. All of the fighters in the UFC from Dagastan are Muslim and very traditional and speak about it often. So culture also plays a role.
No, no scientific research verifies theism in any way. In fact science has shown a world far richer and vast than any scripture has revealed. Scripture still speaks about the 7 heaven cosmology? Those 7vheavens are literally in space above earth. The blue sky is the cosmic ocean behind heaven. The planets and stars are all within this area. The angels and devil live on one of the levels. This is ridiculous ancient creation myths that are made up by ancient people who didn't have science. They pretended some God was speaking to them.
What scientist working on quantum mechanics or cosmology feels because of the work they believe more strongly Iron Age tales about a God who hates non-believers and thinks a world flood happened? What about scientists who join Scientology, does that make Scientology more true? What about scientists who are Hindu? Does that make Krishna more true? NO? We need evidence not anecdotal reports?
Praying? Asking and getting equals God to you? Except when the answer is "no" right? Then you say "oh the answer was no this time". So it's bound to work sometime??!?! And what about the 7 million children under 7 years old who pass away every year from childhood illness? All of those families are always praying hard?
Gods only answer prayers when the illness or situation has a chance to work out. No limbs have ever been re-grown? Caner that kills 50% of it's victims always kills 50%. If you look at the annual statistics for a cancer in the U.S. that has a 50% mortality rate, the higher amount of cases you look at the closer it will be to - 50% didn't make it. Always. So this shows no deity is saving people from terminal illness. Otherwise the mortality rates would be impossible to predict.
They are not. They are very accurate. No deity is helping. Seriously, you must know this? Things in life (especially when you are working towards a goal) tend to happen. If you pray then you count it as a "hit". Even after a few misses eventually things turn out well. Then you go "oh wow, God planned this for me all along". C'mon?
If you care about what is true you will put your beliefs to the test.
I'm sure there are good virtues and morals in the Quran, I have seen them. There are also terrible messages. Non-believers and this awful doom keeps appearing over and over. Also saying Christians and Jews are "false" among other things is a hateful message.
But it's written by people. There is no Moses and no angels. This is fiction.
joelr
Well-Known Member
Generally religion is sold as physical death isn't the end and there is an afterlife and there is a king in the sky who is always watching and he loves you. Maybe Islam presents a harsher judge figure at the end of life? Either way you don't have to face total blankness and never seeing loved ones and so on. In Christianity generally God isn't feared. You ask forgiveness and it's all good.
These are of course all stories with no evidence.
Most likely death is how it was before you were born.
muhammad_isa
Veteran Member
I realise there is a difference in belief since the Reformation.
Of course, if one is trying their best to live a righteous life, there is good reason to be optimistic.
If a person believes there is life after death, then that is what they believe.
It might be that they wish there was not. Sometimes the idea of eternal oblivion is quite appealing .. I just can't believe it is true.
Sheldon
Veteran Member
I offered a dictionary definition, if you are disagreeing with the dictionary, then you are the one deviating from what most people understand the word to mean, that is how dictionaries are compiled. My observation was based on that commonly understood definition. If you disagree with it say how and why, implying I am in error is simply wrong. So to start with you disagree with this definition then?
Miracle
noun
- an extraordinary and welcome event that is not explicable by natural or scientific laws and is therefore attributed to a divine agency.
You brought them up?? And the moon isn't fixed, it orbits the earth, did you not know this?
What does that even mean?
The moon orbits the earth, again to remotely imply it could stop moving is absurdly nonsensical, tidal flows are caused by the moons gravitational force, can you imagine what would happen if its orbit stopped. I have no idea what connection you're assuming between the sun and moon, and spears and bows, as you have offered nothing comprehensible to explain this.
That's because it is incomprehensible, I have no idea what you're assuming the connection is, and I see no measurement whatsoever?
I think you mean reading, not listening, and no amount of reading is going to make this vague jumble of words comprehensible.
Oh I know what the words mean, they just make no sense in the context you're offering them, and you have simply made the unevidenced and inexplicable claim they are somehow measurements?
You just keep repeating it, even after i have explained it means nothing to me? How on earth are figs the same as stars?
Seriously that made no sense when you first posted it, and repeating it isn't going to change that. I have no idea what it is supposed to mean, and you have failed to explain.
If you say so, it mean nothing to me sorry, can you offer nothing in the way of explanation here?
So entirely subjective then, and not remotely objective evidence.
I already know how the words sound, this adds no meaning to what you have claimed, none.
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Sheldon
Veteran Member
It isn't even a concept so far, just a jumble of seemingly unrelated and random words, and some unevidenced and unexplained bare claims about them.