Atheism: The Great Nothing!

[mickiel]

Maybe you haven't been around long enough.

Or maybe that is ALL just one large flammable straw man that YOU created so you could set fire to it.

Course there is a simple solution. Bring your god around for a chat.

Well I think your right in a sense, I have had no personal chat with God. I have been around 55 years now, and I keep considering Gods existence to myself. Its not being subtracted too, but added too. If I saw no evidence of him, I wouldnot believe for sure. It is no strawman to me that the bible is the most read book in the world, the worlds first printed book. I find that of intrest, why did it play out like that?

It speaks of Jesus existence which was recorded by Josephus, Suetonius, Thallus, Pling the Younger, the Talmud and Lucian, which I find most interesting. Biblical archaeology has been of surprising developing intrest to me, its revealing findings. Alfred Russell Wallace, the cofounder of the theory of evolution, his rebuttal of the theory I find most interesting. He saw something. And I think I see it too.

The bible was written over a span of 1500 years, which I think, as a writer myself, is simply incredible. 40 different authors who didnot compare notes, and was written on three different continents, Africa, Asia and Europe. Man thats " Other worldly", its something to it which we do not understand. 40 authors from 40 different generations, man thats incredible to me.

And I think its academic that somethingelse is out there influencing this thing.

Peace.

 

[mickiel]

Don't worry Mickiel. Not believing in God keeps alot of the world busy. Example: Steven Hawkins never could workout how the singularity could exist prior to the big bang so now astrophysisists have invented the theory of multiple universes, staged inflation, and multiple dimentions to explain it all. So now they have multiple things to concern themselves with. By not believing in creation nor intelligent design archeologists can spend their time debating their fossils and trying to make all their information fit.

Maybe atheism stimulates employment!

Well again I agree, Atheism does stimulate for sure, exactly the end results of such stimulation will be, I just don't know. As I experience Atheism in myself at times, my doubt of just not knowing, it keeps being ruled out by reality of my consciousness. I cannot see my consciousness as a " Freak of happenstance nature", and I do not consider myself as being continuious with the idiot hierarchies of speechless apes. I just can't get to that in my real being.

Are we the spawn of animals who were the spawn of fish, who were the spawn of this " Something from nothing?"

Peace.

 

[DeitySlayer]

and I do not consider myself as being continuious with the idiot hierarchies of speechless apes.

Apes are capable of emotions; sadness, anger, love and happiness. There are brain-dead or mentally disabled people who are not capable of these things. Does that place them below the 'idiot heirarchies of apes'? (Some of which can incidentally use sign-language and therefore communicate with humans)

 

[mickiel]

Apes are capable of emotions; sadness, anger, love and happiness. There are brain-dead or mentally disabled people who are not capable of these things. Does that place them below the 'idiot heirarchies of apes'? (Some of which can incidentally use sign-language and therefore communicate with humans)

Apes are not capable of forming religions, agriculture, education, transportation, science, or civilization, why you feel they are is beyond me. These realitys cannot come from apes, but they can come from your minds belief systems.

And such views are giving our great consciousness an orgin which is not great, not sensible, not a reality of reason.

Peace.

 

[Father Heathen]

Don't worry Mickiel. Not believing in God keeps alot of the world busy. Example: Steven Hawkins never could workout how the singularity could exist prior to the big bang so now astrophysisists have invented the theory of multiple universes, staged inflation, and multiple dimentions to explain it all. So now they have multiple things to concern themselves with. By not believing in creation nor intelligent design archeologists can spend their time debating their fossils and trying to make all their information fit.

Maybe atheism stimulates employment!

I don't know, but skepticism and reason has definitely stimulated scientific and technological development.

 

[mickiel]

I don't know, but skepticism and reason has definitely stimulated scientific and technological development.

And it has defintely stimulated deception and development of error as well.

Peace.

 

[PolyHedral]

Apes are not capable of forming religions, agriculture, education, transportation, science, or civilization, why you feel they are is beyond me. These realitys cannot come from apes, but they can come from your minds belief systems.

The first statement is true, but the first part of the second is totally unsupported, and probably false.

 

[DeitySlayer]

Apes are not capable of forming religions, agriculture, education, transportation, science, or civilization, why you feel they are is beyond me. These realitys cannot come from apes, but they can come from your minds belief systems.

And such views are giving our great consciousness an orgin which is not great, not sensible, not a reality of reason.

Peace.

This is what I said.

"Apes are capable of emotions; sadness, anger, love and happiness. There are brain-dead or mentally disabled people who are not capable of these things. Does that place them below the 'idiot heirarchies of apes'?"

Do you see the words religions, agriculture, education, transportation, science, or civilization anywhere in my statement?

Christianity doesn't judge people on their intelligence, I believe, but on their 'emotional' merits. Someone who follows the Ten Commandments with an IQ of 20 would still get into Heaven. Therefore, the 'value' of creatures should not be judged by their intelligence, but their capacity for emotion; if we are to take Christianity as fundamentally true.

 

[Father Heathen]

And it has defintely stimulated deception and development of error as well.

Peace.

And you think abandoning logic, wisdom and knowledge would be more fruitful?

 

[mickiel]

This is what I said.

"Apes are capable of emotions; sadness, anger, love and happiness. There are brain-dead or mentally disabled people who are not capable of these things. Does that place them below the 'idiot heirarchies of apes'?"

Do you see the words religions, agriculture, education, transportation, science, or civilization anywhere in my statement?

Christianity doesn't judge people on their intelligence, I believe, but on their 'emotional' merits. Someone who follows the Ten Commandments with an IQ of 20 would still get into Heaven. Therefore, the 'value' of creatures should not be judged by their intelligence, but their capacity for emotion; if we are to take Christianity as fundamentally true.

I do not take Christianity as true, nor do I judge them as the caretakers of truth. Emotional content in humans didnot develop from the emotions of animals, our consciousness is unique and well defined. Its not animal like, animals can only breed animals. Humans breed only other humans.

Peace.

 

[DeitySlayer]

Emotional content in humans didnot develop from the emotions of animals, our consciousness is unique and well defined.

By this definition, a mentally retarded person is not 'human' as their consciousness is not well defined. There are apes with consciousness' more well defined than severely retarded humans; that is not an insult, that is a simple fact. Chimpanzees are capable of the intelligence level of a seven year old child, a standard many mentally disabled people fall short of. Does that place apes above them in your 'hierachy'?

 

[mickiel]

By this definition, a mentally retarded person is not 'human' as their consciousness is not well defined. There are apes with consciousness' more well defined than severely retarded humans; that is not an insult, that is a simple fact. Chimpanzees are capable of the intelligence level of a seven year old child, a standard many mentally disabled people fall short of. Does that place apes above them in your 'hierachy'?

Your belief that equates apes with humans is your own, in which I do not share. To use retarded humans as an example of comparrision with humans to apes,is absurd in my view, you are skimming the bottom of reason to reach the top of reason. But that reduction is what you must do to bring your view of reality to be a view of reason. There is no road that connects us with apes , they are totally different from humans.

No ape can breed a human.

Peace.

 

[DeitySlayer]

You just dodged the point. You first said 'emotional conciousness in humans is well defined'. But that would exclude mentally retarded people from humanity. You must therefore have a baser definition of humankind, which is essentially the biological definition, in which we are very similar to apes.

 

[mickiel]

Many evolutionist have tried to argue that humans are 99% simular chemically to apes and blood precipitation test do indicate that the chimpanzee is our closet relative. Yet reguarding this we must observe the following; milk chemistry indicates that the donkey is mans closets relative. Cholestrol level test indicate that the garner snake is mans closest relative. Tear enzyme chemistry indicates that the chicken is mans closest relative.

On the basics of another type of blood chemistry test, the butter bean is mans closest relative.

Peace.

 

[Noaidi]

Many evolutionist have tried to argue that humans are 99% simular chemically to apes and blood precipitation test do indicate that the chimpanzee is our closet relative. Yet reguarding this we must observe the following; milk chemistry indicates that the donkey is mans closets relative. Cholestrol level test indicate that the garner snake is mans closest relative. Tear enzyme chemistry indicates that the chicken is mans closest relative.

On the basics of another type of blood chemistry test, the butter bean is mans closest relative.

Peace.

Similarity between humans and chimanzees is based on genome comparisons, not single, individual traits such as cholesterol or milk. The degree of similarity of the base sequences between chimps and humans is staggering.

Genome.gov | 2005 Release: New Genome Comparison Finds Chimps, Humans Very Similar at DNA Level

 

[mickiel]

Similarity between humans and chimanzees is based on genome comparisons, not single, individual traits such as cholesterol or milk. The degree of similarity of the base sequences between chimps and humans is staggering.

Genome.gov | 2005 Release: New Genome Comparison Finds Chimps, Humans Very Similar at DNA Level

The same degree exist in donkeys and the garner snake, as well as chickens.

Peace.

 

[yourhopeboundheart]

Atheism is just as interesting as Theism

as an atheist, i can tell you that no, it's not. atheism is probably one of the most boring things to ever occur, it's the LACK of belief in something. it's not even a belief. it's probably the most hum-drum component of belief i've ever heard of. not believing in lamps would be more interesting than not believing in gods.

I have not seen that occur.

i dont disagree with you. i am sure you havn't seen that occur. because your entire existence, no matter how long it's been, is a flicker on a time-line that stretches well before and after you. it occurs on a planet that is barely even relevant on any realistically humble scale. and we're talking about a process that you could NEVER survive long enough to experience from start to finish. it's like a spark not believing in an audio-book, played ten miles away, because it's never experienced one.
argument from ignorance.

Apes are not capable of forming religions, agriculture, education, transportation, science, or civilization, why you feel they are is beyond me. These realitys cannot come from apes, but they can come from your minds belief systems.

realistically, we're not even very good at any of these things. we're prototypical and therefore it makes plenty of sense that we're the only ones who are enacting these sorts of 'new' concepts in ways that are not easily related to other species enactments. and we dont even have to get into the ways in which other species DO use agriculture (ants), transportation (every moving thing on the planet, particularly parasitic organisms and plants), education (nearly all mammals, and birds like crows and ravens), science (trial and error has been used by nearly every species on earth), and civilization (pack/family groups are simply microcosms of what we consider civilization). the fact that we cant find parallels (even though we can) for religion in other species, i dont know that that is necessarily a bad thing at all, if that phenomenon could be born and die with humans i would be very pleased.

And it has defintely stimulated deception and development of error as well.

skepticism is opposed to deception and error by definition. no matter if you agree with what skeptics question or not.

Emotional content in humans didnot develop from the emotions of animals, our consciousness is unique and well defined. Its not animal like, animals can only breed animals. Humans breed only other humans.

and frogs can only birth other frogs, it's not really an argument against them being animals to say that they are a species.

Your belief that equates apes with humans is your own, in which I do not share.

actually it's the belief of plenty of people who actually take seriously what is determined through skeptical inquiry. it's really only rejected by those who are anthropocentric, and prefer to hold on to anthropocentric notions of superiority.

No ape can breed a human.

and a square is NEVER a rectangle, right?

 

[Wotan]

"No ape can breed a human. "

And this is relevant to . . .what?

 

[mickiel]

"No ape can breed a human. "

And this is relevant to . . .what?

No matter how you factor it, no matter how you imagine it,

No ape can breed a human.

Its academic deception.

Peace.

 

[DeitySlayer]

Are you implying that academics say humans evolved from apes?