Atheists: What moral grounds do you base your views on?

[AhmadSyahir]

Then start explaining



Several reasons

1) respect for other peoples freedom.
2) Nothing to really gain from going on a killing spree except a quick early death or a life sentence in Prison. Neither of those strike me as appealing in any way, shape or form.
3) It's more beneficial to help people than shoot them down



you wont enjoy life full by being a complete and utter A hole to everyone. You'll find yourself lonely very quickly.



You could look at it that way, yes. Wont disagree with you here.



Well obviously. If death is the end then there aren't any feelings or emotions after death



Again, you wouldn't feel anything. There would be no regret after death



True but you should respect other people's freedom or prepare to be ended early



Is God necessary to live morally and if so why?

First of all, what is the benefit of being good? Even bad people receive good end like other people. Evil-Powerful person has never face hardness in his life. He live and enjoy live like other good people too. He too have no regret. You will feel regret if your action punish you. But what if evil rules over good and receive no hardness and consequences along the way? Of course there will be no regret.

What if good people that doing good deed always receive hardness and suffering as long as life doesn't leave him? They will regret for being too kind.
Injustice will always surround.

Weak will always be weak and power will remain on it's throne. Life of the weak is meaningless. They will be suffer and regret along his life.

The life of those who're lucky enough to have power in his/her hand will have a meaningful life with no regret.

The idea of atheism is far from the truth.

 

[waitasec]

I have only a question to ask? What is the point of being good?

would you say humans are social creatures?
so i have 3 words
empathy:
it's the ability to understand and share the feelings of another.
social:
needing companionship and therefore best suited to live in communities...
creature:
anything living or existing

now put theses three words together and you'll see that we are empathetic social creatures, does that answer your question?

 

[Photonic]

And it is in the nature of human species to cooperate peacefully? We have been warring against each other since time eternal, based precisely on the model of furthering ourselves on the survival ladder.

I literally just explained what a zero sum game is, your argument doesn't really follow. It's akin to me dismissing a post because it contains the words "thus" or "therefore".

I don't follow, could you elaborate more? If you mean by circular that there is a circular pattern of violence over resources then yes I agree. Whether I feel that this particular outlook is a good moral gauge is something entirely else that I find debatable.

I like how you twisted my statement to mean the worst of what it possibly could.

In reality I mean that resources are circular, they can be passed around. They can be given in exchange for other resources. That is how it works.

 

[Photonic]

First of all, what is the benefit of being good? Even bad people receive good end like other people. Evil-Powerful person has never face hardness in his life. He live and enjoy live like other good people too. He too have no regret. You will feel regret if your action punish you. But what if evil rules over good and receive no hardness and consequences along the way? Of course there will be no regret.

What if good people that doing good deed always receive hardness and suffering as long as life doesn't leave him? They will regret for being too kind.
Injustice will always surround.

Weak will always be weak and power will remain on it's throne. Life of the weak is meaningless. They will be suffer and regret along his life.

The life of those who're lucky enough to have power in his/her hand will have a meaningful life with no regret.

The idea of atheism is far from the truth.

I truly feel sorry for you. Your statements imply an individual that isn't even an individual outside his religion.

 

[9Westy9]

First of all, what is the benefit of being good? Even bad people receive good end like other people. Evil-Powerful person has never face hardness in his life. He live and enjoy live like other good people too. He too have no regret. You will feel regret if your action punish you. But what if evil rules over good and receive no hardness and consequences along the way? Of course there will be no regret.

the benefit of being good is obvious for any social animals.

People don't tend to act on 'the end' they tend to act on the present

If evil rules over good you end up with a country like Libya when Gaddafi ruled. He restricted the freedom of his people until they eventually had enough and decided to overthrow him

What if good people that doing good deed always receive hardness and suffering as long as life doesn't leave him? They will regret for being too kind.
Injustice will always surround.

Will they? If they know that they've been doing good all their life then I'd say they'd die happy

Weak will always be weak and power will remain on it's throne. Life of the weak is meaningless. They will be suffer and regret along his life.

Not if the powerful do there job properly and protect the weak.

The life of those who're lucky enough to have power in his/her hand will have a meaningful life with no regret.

Meaning is what you make it. You don't need to have power to have meaning.

The idea of atheism is far from the truth.

Bold claim with nothing to back it up.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

No, there aren't any "universal" standards for morals. And as a secular, my morals are based on a consideration of the consequences of my actions.

....and would you consider that 'consideration of consequences'
as innate knowledge or ideas that stem from an inborn conscience ?

Instinct dominates the animal realm, whereas conscience plays a part in the human realm. A trained conscience can either excuse or accuse.
Thus the people of the nations will often by nature the things of the law becoming a law unto oneself.

Whereas a hardened conscience can excuse.
Like flesh seared by a branding iron becomes calloused unfeeling.
Who'd want the 'consideration of consequences' of a serial killer ?


-Romans 2vs14,15; 1st Timothy 4v2

 

[AhmadSyahir]

the benefit of being good is obvious for any social animals.

People don't tend to act on 'the end' they tend to act on the present

If evil rules over good you end up with a country like Libya when Gaddafi ruled. He restricted the freedom of his people until they eventually had enough and decided to overthrow him



Will they? If they know that they've been doing good all their life then I'd say they'd die happy



Not if the powerful do there job properly and protect the weak.



Meaning is what you make it. You don't need to have power to have meaning.



Bold claim with nothing to back it up.

It's simple.

If you done a good deed but to live a life full of misery, you're unlucky.

If you done a good deed and live a cheerful life, you're lucky.

If you done evil deed and sentenced to prison for your whole life, you're unlucky.

If you done evil deed and can enjoy your rewards, you're kind of lucky.

In the end, it's unlucky to certain people. What should these lucky think of these unlucky people? Maybe, they will think that they deserve it. Not fair..
*I'm too lazy to answer all of the atheist comment because they're many in this forum..i'll try to reply some

 

[waitasec]

....and would you consider that 'consideration of consequences'
as innate knowledge or ideas that stem from an inborn conscience ?

what are you talking about? the ability to reason?

Instinct dominates the animal realm, whereas conscience plays a part in the human realm. A trained conscience can either excuse or accuse.
Thus the people of the nations will often by nature the things of the law becoming a law unto oneself.

all social animals have this ability.

 

[waitasec]

It's simple.

If you done a good deed but to live a life full of misery, you're unlucky.

If you done a good deed and live a cheerful life, you're lucky.

If you done evil deed and sentenced to prison for your whole life, you're unlucky.

If you done evil deed and can enjoy your rewards, you're kind of lucky.

In the end, it's unlucky to certain people. What should these lucky think of these unlucky people? Maybe, they will think that they deserve it. Not fair..

i'm dizzy...
:faint:

 

[9Westy9]

It's simple.

If you done a good deed but to live a life full of misery, you're unlucky.

If you done a good deed and live a cheerful life, you're lucky.

If you done evil deed and sentenced to prison for your whole life, you're unlucky.

If you done evil deed and can enjoy your rewards, you're kind of lucky.

In the end, it's unlucky to certain people. What should these lucky think of these unlucky people? Maybe, they will think that they deserve it. Not fair..

the first and last ones aren't fair. It's why we have laws to stop bad people

 

[AhmadSyahir]

the first and last ones aren't fair. It's why we have laws to stop bad people

But human law itself is unfair..Do you really think that poor beggar can afford to file a law suits? When you're weak, it's hard to live according to human law. It has always been unfair for weaker person.

 

[glyphkenn]

I'm not questioning whether you have morals or not, to avoid any misunderstanding. What I'm asking is, is there any universal standard for morals, in your opinion? And if there isn't, what grounds are your morals based upon?

Atheist or whatever our moral should be based on the same thing. Life and the continuation of it. The universe is tied together to produce a few planets capable of producing and sustaining complex life.

 

[glyphkenn]

Morals based on any thing less than life and the preservation of life. Always breakdown into chaos .

 

[Dan4reason]

The increasing of disbelief in God has resulted chaos. I have my reasons for saying this.

Why you should afraid of death if you will only gone for a long sleep? So, atheist is not afraid of death. Then, lets have some fun. Do as you like. Even if you die on your journey, there's nothing to regret. If you're a killer, you'll be send on a long sleep as a punishment. If you're a gangster, you'll be extra of it because you have nothing to afraid of. You will only gone for a long sleep. After all of our doing, no matter how evil you're, you will only be sleep peacefully like other people do.

Why should we afraid of being annoying to others and to hurt others if we will only go for a long sleep after we died like many people do? Why should we follow the rule created by mankind if we can break it? We have nothing to lose. We can satisfy our wild nature and enjoy life "fully" by not losing anything.

Be a bad guy or good guy. Both are the same. Good guy will kill bad guy and send them for a long sleep. Then, good guy will sleep naturally. You just needed to choose your side. Both are the same. Both will sleep well after all Bad and Good doing. Whether your life is full or empty, we'll will just forget about all this thing. It will never affect you after your life. If your life is interesting, keep it up. If your life is hard as a poor beggar, then just commit suicide and forget all of this life.

Satisfy about your life? Sure you are. But only when you still alive. If you have die, even satisfy can't describe you. No more feel. It's only like you're not even born onto this world.

Regret about your life? Sure you are. But only when you still alive. It doesn't feel anything in your sleep. Memories is deleted. You're free more then you had ever feel because this freedom doesn't leave any feel on you.

What you need to do is choosing a side and play your roles. How will you end up? It doesn't matter. You'll end up unborn.

I don't get it. When mankind have no humanity in their heart, God have given them guidance to be more kind and gentle. But when mankind learn from the guidance, they dump God because they feel that they're humane on their own.

I know, secular Europe is such a horrible place, with such a high crime rate 1/10 a high as America's. The Middle East is where you want to be, right?

 

[Me Myself]

Either way the view of some theists that i cannot be moral if i don't believe in their god is complete unfounded, ignorant, arrogant faecal matter of a bull.

Actully you literaly can't follow christian moralityif you don't believe in God.

The very frst tenet is t love God. This means that according to your logic, if morality was something outward like this laws and christians think that God (the mightiest of the pack) created morals, then you would literaly be going against the first and more important law given by the mightiest of all pack leades, and as such being the most immoral you can be in a way.

Now, all tha is only if you think loving God is an important rule.

While I would believe such, let's say I think you can fullfill it even by being an atheist, if you as a theist define "God" as love and inteligence and recognise the love of an atheist for both (given that the atheist indeed love this two thngs). But that is a little more esoteric or profound than what many christians and theists will be able to be abided to when making judgements of character.

 

[glyphkenn]

But human law itself is unfair..Do you really think that poor beggar can afford to file a law suits? When you're weak, it's hard to live according to human law. It has always been unfair for weaker person.

Humans are now misguided . For so long we've been dasing our laws on preserving religions , cultures , isms after isms. Life is what the universe says counts.

 

[9Westy9]

But human law itself is unfair..Do you really think that poor beggar can afford to file a law suits? When you're weak, it's hard to live according to human law. It has always been unfair for weaker person.

I never said the world was fair. It should be but ultimately isn't

 

[McBell]

Not fair..

what is your basis for comparison?

 

[Looncall]

First of all, what is the benefit of being good? Even bad people receive good end like other people. Evil-Powerful person has never face hardness in his life. He live and enjoy live like other good people too. He too have no regret. You will feel regret if your action punish you. But what if evil rules over good and receive no hardness and consequences along the way? Of course there will be no regret.

What if good people that doing good deed always receive hardness and suffering as long as life doesn't leave him? They will regret for being too kind.
Injustice will always surround.

Weak will always be weak and power will remain on it's throne. Life of the weak is meaningless. They will be suffer and regret along his life.

The life of those who're lucky enough to have power in his/her hand will have a meaningful life with no regret.

The idea of atheism is far from the truth.

If this life is all we have, we are more likely to try to do something about evils than if we are taught to value submission in hopes of an afterlife. You have hold of the wrong end of the stick.

In any case, the evils you list tell us nothing about whether there is/are god(s).

 

[McBell]

I am truly afraid if people like you ever become atheist for whatever reason, you would simply go out and murder people. Not because you have no morals, but because you have it set in stone in your mind what you believe those morals to BE.

People who are good only in fear of punish and hope for reward are the scariest people of all.