Atheists: WOW proof this Book is from God.

[~Amin~]

I built the heaven with power and it is i,
who am expanding it. Qur'an51,47.
As for the theory of the extension or << groth>> of the universe,
astronomers agree that at the farthest end a telescope can reach in
space, certain signs indicate some regular movements of outer nebulae,
on this basis they say that the universe is not motionless, but gets larger and larger
as a soap bubble or a baloon, while the material bodies it contains keep a
constant volume.

Now if this is accurate(and i advise you to check it up) isnt it amazing
to say the least how can anyone know that 1500years ago?
dont yoou think this may be an indication its from God?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Now if this is accurate(and i advise you to check it up) isnt it amazing
to say the least how can anyone know that 1500years ago?
dont yoou think this may be an indication its from God?

If the Qu'ran were from God, it would be accurate in every way, right?

One major scientific error in the Qur'an can be seen in the following verses:

And he followed a road; Till, when he reached the setting-place of the sun, he found it setting in a muddy spring, and found a people thereabout. We said: O Dhu'l-Qarneyn! Either punish or show them kindness. (Qur'an 18:85-86)​

This is a major scientific blunder in the Qur'an. A man walked until he reached the setting place of the sun, and saw it setting in a muddy spring. Modern science has taught us that the earth revolves around the sun. The above excerpt from the Qur'an seems to state that it is the sun that moves, as well as sets on earth! If the sun were to touch the surface of the earth, everything would be incinerated, and all life would die.

(Source)

Now, I don't pretend to know how to read Arabic; Amin, is that passage an accurate translation of the noted verses of the Qu'ran? If so, should we conclude that the author of the Qu'ran believed that when the sun set, it came to rest somewhere on the surface of the Earth?

 

[~Amin~]

If the Qu'ran were from God, it would be accurate in every way, right?

Yes i know it is and im prepared to take on any alegations against
the book of God InshAllah(if God so Wills).

Now, I don't pretend to know how to read Arabic; Amin, is that passage an accurate translation of the noted verses of the Qu'ran? If so, should we conclude that the author of the Qu'ran believed that when the sun set, it came to rest somewhere on the surface of the Earth?

Firstly you cant read the Qur'an the way you read a newspaper ie face value.
This is the answer.
Terming the Atlantic Ocean a muddy spring indicates that
Dhu'l-Qarnayn say that the huge ocean as a spring due to
the distance. But because the Qur'an sees everything from
close to, it did not seewhat Dhu'l- Qarnayn saw, which was
a sort of illusion. Indeed , since the Qur'an comes from the heavens and looks to
them , it sees the earth sometimrs as an arena, sometimes as a palace,
sometimes as a cradle, and sometimes as a page. Thus its calling the
vast misty, vaporous Atlantic Ocean a spring shows its
lofty sublimity.
Source Muslim scholar Said Nursi.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Firstly you cant read the Qur'an the way you read a newspaper ie face value.

Convenient.

This is the answer.
Terming the Atlantic Ocean a muddy spring indicates that
Dhu'l-Qarnayn say that the huge ocean as a spring due to
the distance. But because the Qur'an sees everything from
close to, it did not seewhat Dhu'l- Qarnayn saw, which was
a sort of illusion. Indeed , since the Qur'an comes from the heavens and looks to
them , it sees the earth sometimrs as an arena, sometimes as a palace,
sometimes as a cradle, and sometimes as a page. Thus its calling the
vast misty, vaporous Atlantic Ocean a spring shows its
lofty sublimity.
Source Muslim scholar Said Nursi.

So... the vantage point of the Qu'ran, i.e. the Heavens, is so high that the Atlantic Ocean looks so small as to seem as insignificant as a muddy spring, yet the Heavens are low enough that the sun appeared to set in the Atlantic Ocean? This seems inconsistent.

At any point where the sun could appear to set into the ocean, the ocean must, by the requirements of logic, stretch out to the horizon.

 

[~Amin~]

Convenient.
So... the vantage point of the Qu'ran, i.e. the Heavens, is so high that the Atlantic Ocean looks so small as to seem as insignificant as a muddy spring, yet the Heavens are low enough that the sun appeared to set in the Atlantic Ocean? This seems inconsistent.
At any point where the sun could appear to set into the ocean, the ocean must, by the requirements of logic, stretch out to the horizon.

ts so easy to mis understand each other by words on the computer,
if you go back over the answer ill pray for you to understand.

 

[~Amin~]

What do you think about this ONE?
Blessed is He who has placed in the heaven
BIG stars, and has placed therein a great lamp
(sun), and a moon giving light. Qur'an 25,61.
It is only in our recent times we have found out how enormous
the stars are how did Muhammad know this?
and isnt it very accurate?

 

[camanintx]

What do you think about this ONE?
Blessed is He who has placed in the heaven
BIG stars, and has placed therein a great lamp
(sun), and a moon giving light. Qur'an 25,61.
It is only in our recent times we have found out how enormous
the stars are how did Muhammad know this?
and isnt it very accurate?

Which translation are you using? None of the three translations I found use the word "big".

YUSUFALI: Blessed is He Who made constellations in the skies, and placed therein a Lamp and a Moon giving light;
PICKTHAL: Blessed be He Who hath placed in the heaven mansions of the stars, and hath placed therein a great lamp and a moon giving light!
SHAKIR: Blessed is He Who made the constellations in the heavens and made therein a lamp and a shining moon.

They also talk about the moon "giving" light when in fact we know that the moon "reflects" light. Granted, you can interpret "giving" to mean that the moon gives back the light it gets from the sun, but that just shows how open to interpretation religious books are.

 

[Papersock]

Whats your thoughts?:angel2:

Seems like a scientific interpritation after the fact, to me.

 

[~Amin~]

Which translation are you using? None of the three translations I found use the word "big".

Dr Muhammad Mushin Khan. you may check it up the word BIG is there,

They also talk about the moon "giving" light when in fact we know that the moon "reflects" light. Granted, you can interpret "giving" to mean that the moon gives back the light it gets from the sun, but that just shows how open to interpretation religious books are.

True some verses are but not the foundation The most important things are
not open for interpretation other issues are were people get involved
in technical points.

 

[Smoke]

If so, should we conclude that the author of the Qu'ran believed that when the sun set, it came to rest somewhere on the surface of the Earth?

Not exactly. According to the hadith:

The Prophet asked me at sunset, "Do you know where the sun goes (at the time of sunset)?" I replied, "Allah and His Apostle know better." He said, "It goes (i.e. travels) till it prostrates Itself underneath the Throne and takes the permission to rise again ..."​

 

[lillitruthseeker]

This is the most ridiculous thing I ever read too, a 3rd grader could come up with more convincing arguments than that -- and I thought for a fleeting moment this was about World of Warcraft LOL -- I site this post for misguided use of the word WOW

 

[~Amin~]

This is the most ridiculous thing I ever read too, a 3rd grader could come up with more convincing arguments than that --

Can you share with us what you feel is proof for what you believe?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Can you share with us what you feel is proof for what you believe?

As if it's an either-or proposition where the only options are what she believes now and complete acceptance of the Qu'ran? :sarcastic

 

[~Amin~]

As if it's an either-or proposition where the only options are what she believes now and complete acceptance of the Qu'ran? :sarcastic

No it was said that the evidence is deficient and i respect her
for the opinion, but im curious whats her proof for her belief, in a
nice way.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

No it was said that the evidence is deficient and i respect her
for the opinion, but im curious whats her proof for her belief, in a
nice way.

Ah... okay. It sounded like you were setting up an argument based on the Tu Quoque fallacy.

 

[~Amin~]

Ah... okay. It sounded like you were setting up an argument based on the Tu Quoque fallacy.

You know how many times ive been misunderstood?
i must be quite bad a typing.

 

[~Amin~]

Ah... okay. It sounded like you were setting up an argument based on the Tu Quoque fallacy.

You know how many times ive been
misunderstood ? i must be pretty bad
at typing.

 

[~Amin~]

Which translation are you using? None of the three translations I found use the word "big".

If thats not enough what about this one.
Then i swear by the setting of the stars.
And indeed, it is an oath-if you could
know-great. Qur'an56,75,76.
Dont you think this is also indicating the
greatness of the stars.

 

[camanintx]

If thats not enough what about this one.
Then i swear by the setting of the stars.
And indeed, it is an oath-if you could
know-great. Qur'an56,75,76.
Dont you think this is also indicating the
greatness of the stars.

The question would be, are they talking about the greatness of each individual star or the greatness of stars in general? I have no doubt that someone looking up at a starry night hundreds of years before any telescope would think that the vast expanse of stars were greater than anything else in the sky. I know I do.

 

[~Amin~]

The question would be, are they talking about the greatness of each individual star or the greatness of stars in general?

I think both because, muslims believe it is a miracle its addressing 2 things at
once is not new for a muslim.off course this may seem strange to some but not
so, for the believers.

I have no doubt that someone looking up at a starry night hundreds of years before any telescope would think that the vast expanse of stars were greater than anything else in the sky. I know I do.

Fair thinking, but i don't believe he could off known there so big when they
appear so small from were we are.