Birth of Jesus in summer, according to Qur'an

[Muffled]

20111126.2140

Was Jesus born in winter—in December as what the Western churches believe or in January as what the Orthodox churches believe? Was Jesus born in summer as what is stated in the Qur’an?

A spirit, a holy spirit, THE Holy Spirit, told us that Jesus was born on May 23. A spring date. I first heard this date in 1983. When we connected to the Internet in 1999, that is 16 years later, I asked biblical scholars and calendar experts whether there is any ring of truth in this. No one believed. Some even laughed and said that I am crazy. So I embarked on my studies.

In 2003, I was able to prove that the crucifixion date of August 17 that He revealed which I also first heard in 1983, is true and correct. The year is 1 BC. Then I checked His birth date. In 2006, I was able to prove that it is also true and correct. The year—33 BC. Jesus was 32 solar years old when He died. You may check the studies that I made at http://aristean.org/crucifyidx.htm and http://aristean.org/birthmay23.htm. Please raise your questions and I will try to answer them.

Any spirit giving information contrary to the Bible has to be a false spirit and not The Holy Spirit.

 

[Nabeel Akhalwaya Motala]

The Quran doesn't say that he was born in summer. U assume this because it says ripe dates. Remember that Allah (SWT) is capable of anything and can produce ripe dates on the planet Pluto if He wanted to. We shouldn't be concerned about which season Jesus (AS) was born in, but rather the message that he brought. To worship the One God and to not ascribe any partners unto Him, which is the very basis of Islamic teaching.

 

[Muffled]

The Quran doesn't say that he was born in summer. U assume this because it says ripe dates. Remember that Allah (SWT) is capable of anything and can produce ripe dates on the planet Pluto if He wanted to. We shouldn't be concerned about which season Jesus (AS) was born in, but rather the message that he brought. To worship the One God and to not ascribe any partners unto Him, which is the very basis of Islamic teaching.

I once saw an astrological chart for the birth of Jesus. It was remakably accurate.

First Capricorn (begins somewhere around Dec 21) is the sign of fame and shame, Success and failure, wealth and poverty. Jesus as "The man of sorrows" as Isaiah phrased it had the ultimate fame and the ultimate shame on the cross. Jesus was a man of poverty, traveling around with the clothes on his back and living off donations and yet had the ability to be wealthy because He was able to produce money out of a fishes mouth. Does He need bread? He can multiply it and even turn stones into bread.

John the Baptist was a Cancer which is a water sign. It is significant that water played an integral part in his ministry.

 

[peacecrusader888]

20111201.0005

@Pegg

sorry you'll have to forgive my ignorance, but i've never heard of the new Aristean Perpetual Calendar and how is the year 'O' even counted as a year??? its not a number!

I think its best though to stick to the calendars in use during the time that Jesus lived if you want to get a more accurate date. Besides that, you should also stick to the scriptures because that is the record written by those who were actually there.

You may google for “Aristean calendar” and you will read more about it.

You are using BCE and CE. Don’t you know that 1 BC is year 0 in your use of BCE and CE? So 2 BC is 1 BCE.

Don’t you think that the Holy Spirit who we (plural) talk to is none other than the spirit of Jesus Christ? Hence, He was present some 2000 years ago.

but where do you get that specific date from? Why 20 'BCJ' and what the heck is BCJ anyway

BCJ means Before Crucifixion of Jesus in the Aristean calendar where year 0 is when Jesus was crucified and died. 20 BCJ is equivelent to 21 BC with BC is Before Christ with the assumption that Jesus was born in 1 BC.

Why do you think Herod died in 33 BC???
Most historians place his death between 4BC - 1CE... what is the basis for 33BC??

Why I say Herod died in 33 BC is because Jesus was born on May 23, 33 BC. Herod the Great actually died on Av 2, 3728 equivalent to July 13, 33 BC. You read http://aristean.org/wp008.htm titled “Wnen did King Herod the Great die?”

 

[Nabeel Akhalwaya Motala]

I'm not saying that he wasn't born in Summer. I'm saying that you can't say the Quran says it's Summer cause of the words "ripe dates". Allah (SWT) is capable of anything and can produce whatever, whenever!

 

[peacecrusader888]

The Quran doesn't say that he was born in summer. U assume this because it says ripe dates. Remember that Allah (SWT) is capable of anything and can produce ripe dates on the planet Pluto if He wanted to. We shouldn't be concerned about which season Jesus (AS) was born in, but rather the message that he brought. To worship the One God and to not ascribe any partners unto Him, which is the very basis of Islamic teaching.

20111201.0040

@Nabeel Akhalwaya Motala

Yes, I assume that the Qur’an say the Jesus was born in summer because it is during that time when dates are ripe. Do you know then when Jesus was born?

The Qur’an denies that Jesus was ever crucified. Do you believe that?

 

[Nabeel Akhalwaya Motala]

Most ancient and advanced nations, such as Babylon, Egypt, Persia, Greece, Roman and England, to name a few, believe December 25th was a solemn day and celebrated it. This celebration on December 25 was associated with the worship of the sun and the winter solstice. Hence I say that the bible was changed by man and corrupted by man. I don't know when Jesus (AS) was born and will not bear false witness about him and his life cause I fear God.

Allah (SWT) says in the Quran that Jesus (AS) was not crucified and yes I believe that.

 

[peacecrusader888]

Creating new calendars to try to make fictitious stories seem more plausible doesn't actually make it so.

20111201.0120

@dyanaprajna2011

FYI, the Aristean calendar was conceived in 1992. The crucifixion date of August 17, 1 BC was proven to be true and correct only in 2003. So it is not as you claim that a calendar was created to make fictitious stories more plausible. Do you think the birth of Jesus is a fictitious story? Do you deny that Jesus every existed?

 

[peacecrusader888]

Most ancient and advanced nations, such as Babylon, Egypt, Persia, Greece, Roman and England, to name a few, believe December 25th was a solemn day and celebrated it. This celebration on December 25 was associated with the worship of the sun and the winter solstice. Hence I say that the bible was changed by man and corrupted by man. I don't know when Jesus (AS) was born and will not bear false witness about him and his life cause I fear God.

Allah (SWT) says in the Quran that Jesus (AS) was not crucified and yes I believe that.

20111201.0135

@Nabeel Akhalwaya Motala

We may have to create a new thread regarding the alleged tampering of the Holy Bible. It is not about the birth of Jesus anymore. What should be its name? You decide and open the thread.

 

[dyanaprajna2011]

20111201.0120

@dyanaprajna2011

FYI, the Aristean calendar was conceived in 1992. The crucifixion date of August 17, 1 BC was proven to be true and correct only in 2003. So it is not as you claim that a calendar was created to make fictitious stories more plausible. Do you think the birth of Jesus is a fictitious story? Do you deny that Jesus every existed?

As a Buddhist, it matters not to me whether Jesus existed or not. I find some of his teachings as found in the New Testament inspiring, but, if he even existed at all, he was just a man, a wisdom teacher, nothing more. I believe, if he existed, that later stories were added about him which raised him from a mere human teacher to an incarnation of his god, which he himself would have denied. But, as there is no real historical proof of his existence, the answer would be no, I do not believe he ever really existed.

 

[outhouse]

lets get some facts out.


Historical Jesus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Birth

See also: Nativity of Jesus

Jesus was probably born in the last years before Herod's reign ended in 4 BCE,[29][30] in the Galilean village of Nazareth.[31][32][33][34] Geza Vermes views the different accounts of Jesus' birth given in the Gospel of Luke and the Gospel of Matthew as "pious fictions".[35] E. P. Sanders describes them as "the clearest cases of invention in the Gospels".[36] Raymond Brown notes that "it is unlikely that either account is completely historical",[37] and suggests that the account in Matthew is based on an earlier narrative patterned on traditions about the birth of Moses.[38] While the infancy narratives are considered problematic by critical scholars, particularly because they are laced with theology and are indebted to precursor texts, it has been suggested that they do contain some historical information about Jesus, such as when he was born and the names of his parents.[39][40]
This first Herod, an Idumaean whom the Roman Senate elected King of the Jews[41] over Idumea, Galilee, Judea, Samaria and neighboring lands, ruled from 37 to 4 BCE.[42] Upon Herod's death, the Romans divided up his kingdom between his sons, and Herod Antipas ruled Galilee but not Judea (which became part of Iudaea province after Herod Archelaus was deposed in 6 CE), while Jesus was still a boy

 

[peacecrusader888]

As a Buddhist, it matters not to me whether Jesus existed or not. I find some of his teachings as found in the New Testament inspiring, but, if he even existed at all, he was just a man, a wisdom teacher, nothing more. I believe, if he existed, that later stories were added about him which raised him from a mere human teacher to an incarnation of his god, which he himself would have denied. But, as there is no real historical proof of his existence, the answer would be no, I do not believe he ever really existed.

20111201.0905

@dyanaprajna2011

Four male persons wrote about Him. One is not even His apostle. He is Luke. Can you fool four people to write on someone who they did not know about? How many male witnesses should you have to believe that He existed? That is why Jesus said in John 20:29, “Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.”

FYI, there was no New Testament before. The children of the descendants of the apostles sifted through the notes of their fathers and compiled to write the stories. They were not eyewitnesses of the events that is why there is the perceived discrepancy. That is why we have the Holy Spirit to clarify to us the truth.

Revelation 2:7, 11, 17, 29; 3:6, 13, 22 state repeatedly, “He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.” Who do you think should I believe—the Spirit or my fellow human beings?

 

[Pegg]

Why I say Herod died in 33 BC is because Jesus was born on May 23, 33 BC. Herod the Great actually died on Av 2, 3728 equivalent to July 13, 33 BC. You read http://aristean.org/wp008.htm titled “Wnen did King Herod the Great die?”

Yeah ok then. My patients just dropped to year zero, i'm going for a ride on my bike now.

 

[peacecrusader888]

lets get some facts out.


Historical Jesus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Birth

See also: Nativity of Jesus

Jesus was probably born in the last years before Herod's reign ended in 4 BCE,[29][30] in the Galilean village of Nazareth.[31][32][33][34] Geza Vermes views the different accounts of Jesus' birth given in the Gospel of Luke and the Gospel of Matthew as "pious fictions".[35] E. P. Sanders describes them as "the clearest cases of invention in the Gospels".[36] Raymond Brown notes that "it is unlikely that either account is completely historical",[37] and suggests that the account in Matthew is based on an earlier narrative patterned on traditions about the birth of Moses.[38] While the infancy narratives are considered problematic by critical scholars, particularly because they are laced with theology and are indebted to precursor texts, it has been suggested that they do contain some historical information about Jesus, such as when he was born and the names of his parents.[39][40]
This first Herod, an Idumaean whom the Roman Senate elected King of the Jews[41] over Idumea, Galilee, Judea, Samaria and neighboring lands, ruled from 37 to 4 BCE.[42] Upon Herod's death, the Romans divided up his kingdom between his sons, and Herod Antipas ruled Galilee but not Judea (which became part of Iudaea province after Herod Archelaus was deposed in 6 CE), while Jesus was still a boy

20111201.0935

@outhouse

You rely too much on Wikipedia. Who do you think wrote Wikipedia? Who is Geza Vermes? Who is E. P. Sanders? Who is Raymond Brown?

FYI, Jesus was not born “in the Galilean village of Nazareth”. He was born in Bethlehem. He was born in the last year (not years) before Herod’s reign ended, not in 4 BCE though but in 32 BCE or 33 BC.

 

[outhouse]

20111201.0935

@outhouse

You rely too much on Wikipedia. Who do you think wrote Wikipedia? Who is Geza Vermes? Who is E. P. Sanders? Who is Raymond Brown?

FYI, Jesus was not born “in the Galilean village of Nazareth”. He was born in Bethlehem. He was born in the last year (not years) before Herod’s reign ended, not in 4 BCE though but in 32 BCE or 33 BC.

If you cannot handle the truths within wiki you are free to challeneg the information. It has to be backed and sourced or your personal fantasy wil be deleted.


Wiki is a wonderful source as long as you know much of the information before hand, you dont

 

[outhouse]

Who do you think should I believe—the Spirit or my fellow human beings?

You believe the person under a white sheet, NOT any spirit

 

[dyanaprajna2011]

20111201.0905

@dyanaprajna2011

Four male persons wrote about Him. One is not even His apostle. He is Luke. Can you fool four people to write on someone who they did not know about? How many male witnesses should you have to believe that He existed? That is why Jesus said in John 20:29, “Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.”

FYI, there was no New Testament before. The children of the descendants of the apostles sifted through the notes of their fathers and compiled to write the stories. They were not eyewitnesses of the events that is why there is the perceived discrepancy. That is why we have the Holy Spirit to clarify to us the truth.

Revelation 2:7, 11, 17, 29; 3:6, 13, 22 state repeatedly, “He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.” Who do you think should I believe—the Spirit or my fellow human beings?

There's no evidence to support the idea that any of the gospel accounts were written by eyewitnesses of Jesus. There's no reason to accept their validity when they are full of errors and contradictions. And to mention Luke, he never said he wrote under divine inspiration, but because everyone else was writing about Jesus, so he thought it would be good to do so as well. Is it possible for four people to write about someone who never existed and start a religion based on those writings? You tell me. You reject the Quran, the Vedas, the Buddhist scriptures, the Taoist scriptures, etc. Your rejection of those is the same reason why I reject the Bible.

 

[peacecrusader888]

You believe the person under a white sheet, NOT any spirit

20111201.1410

@outhouse

Do you know who that woman under the white bed sheet is? Yes, she is a woman, a blind woman since aged two. Her name is Ka Apaz or Mrs. Liwayway Paz Vergel de Dios. I firmly believe she is one of the two women in Matthew 24:41 and Luke 17:35. She is one woman left here on earth. The one taken is the Blessed Virgin Mary who Jesus took to Heaven, body and soul.

The first physical body in which the spirit resided here on earth is Reneliniyindi of Egypt. Then Reneliniyindi died. Her spirit transferred to another human being, which we call reincarnation. This was repeated over and over until now wherein the spirit is residing in the body of Ka Apaz. It is the 177th reincarnation.

The spirit does not die. It just resides in the physical body which is just soil, inanimate. The physical body just moves when the spirit is in the body.

You did not mention when the Holy Spirit is conducting mass. Why the body of Ka Apaz collapses and falls to the floor when a spirit (her spirit or that of the Holy Spirit) leaves her body is because the physical body moves only when a spirit goes into it. This is what makes a dead person in a coffin different from a living person—the spirit or the living soul.

 

[outhouse]

I firmly believe she is

your putting your faith against knowledge, that can be very dangerous.

Ka Apaz. It is the 177th reincarnation.

you only have faith for this my friend.

The spirit does not die.

you do not know that

This is what makes a dead person in a coffin different from a living person—the spirit or the living soul.

You are wrong.

your woman has a constant pulse of her heart despite what you think

A dead person has none and thats why they are dead

 

[mohammed_beiruti]

The Telegraph posted on 9-dec-2008 this related Article:

Jesus was born in June', astronomers claim

Astronomers have calculated that Christmas should be in June, by charting the appearance of the 'Christmas star' which the Bible says led the three Wise Men to Jesus.

They found that a bright star which appeared over Bethlehem 2,000 years ago pinpointed the date of Christ's birth as June 17 rather than December 25.
The researchers claim the 'Christmas star' was most likely a magnificent conjunction of the planets Venus and Jupiter, which were so close together they would have shone unusually brightly as a single "beacon of light" which appeared suddenly.
If the team is correct, it would mean Jesus was a Gemini, not a Capricorn as previously believed.
Australian astronomer Dave Reneke used complex computer software to chart the exact positions of all celestial bodies and map the night sky as it would have appeared over the Holy Land more than 2,000 years ago.
It revealed a spectacular astronomical event around the time of Jesus's birth.

'Jesus was born in June', astronomers claim - Telegraph

though, I don't think that was an accurate calculation for Jesus Birth, Because "the Bright star" is something related to Phoenix Mythology.