But you said you were okay with abortion...

[Alceste]

Weird hypothetical situation?
A situation where a woman changes her mind about abortion is weird?

And what do you mean by being okay with this situation?

A situation where a woman changes her mind about abortion isn't weird. It's the norm. Women who think they would never do it find themselves pregnant and do it. Women who have no problem with it find themselves pregnant and don't do it. Any man who believes a woman will never change her mind on the subject when it's suddenly affects her, rather than being an abstract, impersonal concept, is a complete fool. What's weird is your argument that type of false statements that are almost always made by both parties during any seduction attempt should be legally binding.

 

[Alceste]

It would be along the lines of:

1) If she makes past a certain mark of income, the child won't receive child support anymore. The woman will fully pay for the expenses.
2) Once the child completes 18 years old, no more child support will be given and the woman will have to give back all the ammount received to support the child, monthly, or, if possible, in a single time, accordingly readjusted ( if needed ).

Where is this independent income of the mother's supposed to be coming from, if she is the sole guardian of a young child who needs care 24/7?

 

[Koldo]

If she decides to have the baby then the promise not to have it has already been ignored . But I agree, they should find a solution that works for both of them. And for the child. Parents dont always get along well enough to do that, though, which is very unfortunate.

It has been broken.
What consequence should she face for doing so while at the time keeping in mind the well-being of the child?

 

[Alceste]

It has been broken.
What consequence should she face for doing so while at the time keeping in mind the well-being of the child?

Raising a child.

Jeez. What else do you propose? You keep implying that some kind of punishment should be exacted, beyond the complete sacrifice of her own hopes and dreams for next 18 to 21 years of her life, if not forever. That's not enough of a punishment for a momentary slip-of-the-lip, in your view?

 

[Koldo]

A situation where a woman changes her mind about abortion isn't weird. It's the norm. Women who think they would never do it find themselves pregnant and do it. Women who have no problem with it find themselves pregnant and don't do it.

Good thing you agree with me there is nothing weird about a woman changing her mind then.

Any man who believes a woman will never change her mind on the subject when it's suddenly affects her, rather than being an abstract, impersonal concept, is a complete fool.

Why do you think that a person who expects another to keep her/his word is a fool?

What's weird is your argument that type of false statements that are almost always made by both parties during any seduction attempt should be legally binding.

What's weird about it?

 

[Koldo]

Where is this independent income of the mother's supposed to be coming from, if she is the sole guardian of a young child who needs care 24/7?

Work?

 

[MysticSang'ha]

Work?

Are you at all aware of what it really takes to raise a child?

 

[Koldo]

Raising a child.

Jeez. What else do you propose? You keep implying that some kind of punishment should be exacted, beyond the complete sacrifice of her own hopes and dreams for next 18 to 21 years of her life, if not forever. That's not enough of a punishment for a momentary slip-of-the-lip, in your view?

When you don't keep your word after you make an agreement with someone, and the other part is financially harmed, you ought to, at very least, restitute the loss you caused.

 

[Koldo]

Are you at all aware of what it really takes to raise a child?

Yes. :yes:

 

[Alceste]

Good thing you agree with me there is nothing weird about a woman changing her mind then.

Why do you think that a person who expects another to keep her/his word is a fool?

Because I've dated people, had lots of casual sex and several long term relationships. People say all kinds of things in the first three months of a relationship that later turn out to be untrue. People get carried away. There are hormones involved. We might as well consider ourselves and our sexual partners to be under the influence of a drug that impedes our judgment until several months into a relationship.

What's weird about it?

Your suggestion that you should tape all your conversations during a seduction for one. Your belief that people who are trying to have sex with each other are acting rationally, for another. Your elevation of a toss-away opinion on abortion from a woman who has never been pregnant to a legally binding, unbreakable vow for another. It's just a ridiculous scenario.

But, if you want all your courtship promises to be legally binding, all you need to do is write a standard casual sex contract and bring all your dates (who must be sober) before a lawyer and two witnesses to have it signed. Go nuts!

 

[MysticSang'ha]

Yes. :yes:

Good. Then enlighten the members here of what it takes to raise a child from birth to adulthood, and how just getting a job is the one and only answer. opcorn:

 

[Alceste]

When you don't keep your word after you make an agreement with someone, and the other part is financially harmed, you ought to, at very least, restitute the loss you caused.

The mum: "I never promised that". There. Problem solved. If that bothers you, write up a contract.

 

[Willamena]

When you don't keep your word after you make an agreement with someone, and the other part is financially harmed, you ought to, at very least, restitute the loss you caused.

How do you expect the baby to do that?

 

[Koldo]

Because I've dated people, had lots of casual sex and several long term relationships. People say all kinds of things in the first three months of a relationship that later turn out to be untrue. People get carried away. There are hormones involved. We might as well consider ourselves and our sexual partners to be under the influence of a drug that impedes our judgment until several months into a relationship.

I am not like this at all.

Your suggestion that you should tape all your conversations during a seduction for one. Your belief that people who are trying to have sex with each other are acting rationally, for another. Your elevation of a toss-away opinion on abortion from a woman who has never been pregnant to a legally binding, unbreakable vow for another. It's just a ridiculous scenario.

But, if you want all your courtship promises to be legally binding, all you need to do is write a standard casual sex contract and bring all your dates (who must be sober) before a lawyer and two witnesses to have it signed. Go nuts!

1) I never said you should tape all your conversations during a seduction.
2) People are acting rationally when trying to have sex with each other.
3) Ridiculous in your opinion, perhaps.
4) This is not about me.

 

[Koldo]

Good. Then enlighten the members here of what it takes to raise a child from birth to adulthood, and how just getting a job is the one and only answer. opcorn:

When did i mention that getting a job is the one and only answer as to how to raise a child?

 

[Koldo]

The mum: "I never promised that". There. Problem solved. If that bothers you, write up a contract.

In this case, Ana says she did promise that.

 

[Koldo]

How do you expect the baby to do that?

As far as i am aware, the baby made no agreements.

 

[Willamena]

As far as i am aware, the baby made no agreements.

I know, I was making a point.

You're asking the mother to make an additional payment, in addition to the child support she pays. Both parents pay the child, so who is left to "restitute the loss" but the child?

 

[Alceste]

In this case, Ana says she did promise that.

So why didn't the guy get it in writing with the advice of a lawyer and two witnesses to ensure that it would be a legally binding agreement?

Verbal agreements have very little standing in court. In addition to the problem of faulty memory, people may verbally agree to things that turn out to be illegal, hence the need for consultation with a lawyer.

 

[Koldo]

I know, I was making a point.

You're asking the mother to make an additional payment, in addition to the child support she pays. Both parents pay the child, so who is left to "restitute the loss" but the child?

It's the mother's action that caused the financial loss.
Therefore, it is the mother that has to restitute it.