I mean a world without risk that suffering of some of his creation becomes possible.
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Can God create a rock he cannot lift? YES.
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I mean a world without risk that suffering of some of his creation becomes possible.
The next world is about journeying to God, the rewards improve in quality and closeness, and they are increased in intensity, but this does not mean amount. By multiplying I mean in the speed they travel to God.
The rock that God cannot life is a metaphor.
It has everything to do with it. If God could've created Jinn/Angels and made sure they do not become arrogant without trial, he would have. Then maybe no need of even human creation and trials. We would all be light/smokeless fire type beings worshiping God. But he can't control how his creation want to be freely, and so they became arrogant, and God out a favor to them, created humanity, to try them by putting his authorities and representatives among humans and that they seek rank with God by interceding and helping believers of humans.
Tiberius
Well-Known Member
You still have to explain why any world where life can have meaning must also have the risk of suffering.
Tiberius
Well-Known Member
In other words, you are saying that there are some things that God can not do.
If that's the case, why should I call him God?
I already did.
God means worthy of worship. God cannot make square triangles, and free-will cannot be forced. Its just the way it is.
Tiberius
Well-Known Member
Which post was that again?
Tiberius
Well-Known Member
And what is it about God that makes him worthy of worship?
Three components. Side ways he has infinite glories and beauties. Upwards he is Highest in all of them, each of them, and is ultimate oneness of all of them and each of them, without division. Then his ****** personality is shockingly beautiful when you get use to it.
I was going to tell you the long post, but how about you read this sermon: Sermon 192: Praise be to Allah who wears the apparel of Honour and Dignity… | Nahjul Balagha Part 1, The Sermons | Al-Islam.org
It has that explanation.
Tiberius
Well-Known Member
And it has a lot of other stuff as well.
Can you condense your point into a few sentences?
Tiberius
Well-Known Member
Yeah, okay.
You do realise that just telling me he has these things doesn't convince me that he has them, right?
1. Angels became arrogant, so God created Adam and humans to humble them, he could have made it obvious they were superior nature by making Adam of light brighter then Angels, but then it would be meaningless trial and reward cannot be given. The Angels became high only through passing the trial (except Iblis).
2. God could have made it after that Prophets cannot be doubted, everyone submit to them and that they are invulnerable to death but reward to those who submit would be meaningless and good and evil would not exist,, and he could have made them perform their powers in a way no one would doubt.
3. He tries arrogant with people who seem like nothing in their eyes, just as he did with Pharaoh with Moses and Aaron, who seemed poor and insignificant.
4. The luxurious see themselves as superior to poor in same respect.
5. Arrogance from Iblis leads to wars, havoc, and disruption of peace.
6. The test is harder like this, but so is the reward greater. Without this intense trial, the reward would be insignificant.
Repeated point for emphasis, Imam Ali (a) says good and evil and all the meaning of his words would not be possible if God made it too easy for creation to obey him and believe.
Many other things, but those are most relevant.
You were not asking for proof of God, but what makes him worthy of worship.
These thousand and one titles to God, that might interest you: Duaa Jawshan Kabeer - Ramadan - Duas.org
Tiberius
Well-Known Member
Sounds like all these are just problems of the system God created.
Sure but its still the best system. The faults in the system now are due to sins and evil on part of creation.
Tiberius
Well-Known Member
Yeah, okay. THAT is the best God could do. Okay.
It looks worse of course, because what has happened in history. If Mohammad's (s) nation remained steadfast and held on to the rope of God after his death, everything would be fine now.
Tiberius
Well-Known Member
Ah yes, the "if onlies"...