Can good people go to hell?

[James Lyon]

It really depends on what knowledge base you put your "faith" in. Though from what I see as the christian interpretation is trial by conscience, as failure to adhere to a set of moral and social boundary's locks you into a eternal burn. This actually fits with karmic laws as in if you commit "sin" or its true root meaning, ignorance. You will have to keep learning that lesson until you learn and if it take eternity to do so that is you failing your path. In this Heaven is our eternal progression and soul growth upward into the light. The term Hyades more accurately describes the Hell we are taught through Christianity. It is were souls go to lye down, this is surrendering your spirit in giving up. In Norse, Hell is the place every soul goes for judgement before moving on.

 

[onceagainonce]

Repentance and being born again are realities not of this world order. They are introduced into the world by the Holy Ghost. As a result, eternal realities, such as hell and mankind being corrupt, perverse and God's view that there is none good, no, not one, are unavoidable.
Who in their right mind would enter into eternity assuming there is no hell and live obvious to the law of sin and death which is all over the place?
It takes an act of God Almighty to deliver a soul from hell.
Just because you don't believe in a certain thing does not effect the thing itself.

 

[uncung]

Circular logic. Assuming the conclusion in the premises. Hardly a proof of anything, with the possible exception of suboptimal logical skills

Ciao

- viole

what circular logic do you mean? God created you, there is no a circular logic in this notion. we can say man created BMW, Mercedes.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

It really depends on what knowledge base you put your "faith" in. Though from what I see as the christian interpretation is trial by conscience, as failure to adhere to a set of moral and social boundary's locks you into a eternal burn. This actually fits with karmic laws as in if you commit "sin" or its true root meaning, ignorance. You will have to keep learning that lesson until you learn and if it take eternity to do so that is you failing your path. In this Heaven is our eternal progression and soul growth upward into the light. The term Hyades more accurately describes the Hell we are taught through Christianity. It is were souls go to lye down, this is surrendering your spirit in giving up. In Norse, Hell is the place every soul goes for judgement before moving on.

Good that you mention the Norse hell ( non-biblical hell ) that teaches an immortal soul.
That unbiblical hell is often taught as being Scripture but is Not the Bible's hell or grave.
The Bible's hell is simply mankind stone-cold grave for the sleeping dead.
Jesus taught unconscious 'sleep in death' - John 11:12-14 - and so do the old Hebrew Scriptures - Psalms 115:17; Psalms 146:4; Daniel 12:2; Daniel 12:13; Ecclesiastes 9:5
So, while the dead Jesus was in biblical hell (grave), then the dead Jesus was Not conscious while he was dead.
The Bible's soul is Not immortal because the soul that sins dies according to Ezekiel 18:4,20, and the soul can be destroyed according to Acts of the Apostles 3:23.
If the biblical soul was death proof (immortal) then there would be No need for a resurrection. What is alive can't be resurrected - John 5:28

What happened to father Adam at his death according to Genesis 3:19 is that Adam simply ' returned ' to the dust of the ground.
A person can Not ' return ' to a place he never was before. So, Adam simply went from non-life, to life, and returned back to non-life.
As a foreclosed house does Not move or go away anywhere but just goes back to the hands of the owner, our life's spirit is in God's hands, and when Jesus resurrects the dead out of biblical hell - Revelation 1:18 - then the resurrected ones will once again have life's spirit as Adam had when God breathed the breath of life into life-less Adam - Genesis 2:7
Rejoice, rejoice for there ' is going to be ' a resurrection......... - Acts of the Apostles 24:15

 

[uncung]

Isn't that called 'argument from ignorance,' or 'argument from silence?" claiming that if you can't prove that something does not exist, then this is proof that it does?

Sorry...but no. One cannot prove a negative, but that doesn't mean anything. You can't prove that I don't have a windmill in my front yard. That doesn't mean that I do.

But I can prove heaven is for real. Oppositely you can't disprove it.

 

[uncung]

You can? If you can, you are the first person I have EVER met who could do so.
Don't get me wrong, sir: I happen to have great faith that there not only is a God, but that the truth about Him is found in those beliefs I hold regarding Him.
However, my faith and belief are not empirical proof and I don't pretend that they are.

I would be very interested to see your proof.

Yes I can, God created you, it is the proof.

 

[uncung]

This is the second time I have seen you claim this.

I would be very interested in seeing your proof.

My proof is you. You are the proof of God existence, because you are created by God.

 

[Rapture Era]

Are you willing to take the chance the Hindus are right and you're praying to the wrong God?

By your logic, known as Pascal's Wager, you should be praying to every God ever known to man...just in case!

First, to answer your question YES! I am willing to stake my eternal destiny on my faith in Jesus Christ for my eternal salvation! If everything that Jesus said is a bunch of nonsense, if the Bible is a lie then what is my fate? If you are wrong and everything that Jesus said is true, and the Bible is the true word of God, what is your fate? When I asked are you willing to take that chance, if you fully believe in whatever it is you place your trust, when you die, you will find out if you made the right choice. But whatever that choice was at the time of your death, if you chose the wrong belief system, you can't say wait! I change my mind now! Nope, you are going to suffer the consequences for ever and ever and ever and ever, it will never end! All I'm saying, is, are you absolutely sure with no doubt at all that what you believe is true? Only you can answer that question. God has done his part. He has told us what our condition is through sin and where that will lead us, He has paid the penalty of that sin for us through Jesus' death, and He is giving us the choice to accept his free gift of eternal life in heaven. It's pretty simple. Do you accept or not? That's the bottom line.

 

[roger1440]

So me and my friend were talking about religions. And he said asked me do I respect the 10 commandments and listed them. I answered yes to all. I do respect them. Then, he asked do I help other people. I answered Yes. He asked me what do I do. I said: Today I helped my brother with picking up 30 min of his trash so when he come home he doesn't have to. I also cleaned my mom's room as a surprise. altogether about 2 h. I then asked "What is hell?". He explained it and I asked who goes to hell. He said: Non-Christians. So I respect the commandmetns and am good to people (In my opinion) and I do think Jesus did miracles, but he is not the ONLY way to god, and I would go to hell. Is that correct? Just wandering, I don't really belive in hell

So according to your friend “Non-Christians” go to Hell. The next obvious question would be, what is a Christian. Your friend would probably say something like “A Christian believes what the Bible says about Jesus”. Oddly, nowhere in the Bible does it say a Christian must believe in the Bible. It actually says the opposite.

 

[James Lyon]

Good that you mention the Norse hell ( non-biblical hell ) that teaches an immortal soul.
That unbiblical hell is often taught as being Scripture but is Not the Bible's hell or grave.
The Bible's hell is simply mankind stone-cold grave for the sleeping dead.
Jesus taught unconscious 'sleep in death' - John 11:12-14 - and so do the old Hebrew Scriptures - Psalms 115:17; Psalms 146:4; Daniel 12:2; Daniel 12:13; Ecclesiastes 9:5
So, while the dead Jesus was in biblical hell (grave), then the dead Jesus was Not conscious while he was dead.
The Bible's soul is Not immortal because the soul that sins dies according to Ezekiel 18:4,20, and the soul can be destroyed according to Acts of the Apostles 3:23.
If the biblical soul was death proof (immortal) then there would be No need for a resurrection. What is alive can't be resurrected - John 5:28

What happened to father Adam at his death according to Genesis 3:19 is that Adam simply ' returned ' to the dust of the ground.
A person can Not ' return ' to a place he never was before. So, Adam simply went from non-life, to life, and returned back to non-life.
As a foreclosed house does Not move or go away anywhere but just goes back to the hands of the owner, our life's spirit is in God's hands, and when Jesus resurrects the dead out of biblical hell - Revelation 1:18 - then the resurrected ones will once again have life's spirit as Adam had when God breathed the breath of life into life-less Adam - Genesis 2:7
Rejoice, rejoice for there ' is going to be ' a resurrection......... - Acts of the Apostles 24:15

So here we get to the belief of immortal soul vs not immortal soul. If "god" which is in its own a word I find shallow was willfully in control of all in omniscience then soul itself is merely a reflection of an idea in his mind. In this our physical form is merely a construction of atoms forming around his idea and letting the thought run its own course. For this we are a projection of the will of the most high and the soul is him experiencing himself as he plays out his idea "plan". So here Hell reflects the idea of not being in "his" fore thought and not being part of the plan at any one point, and also grants resurrection as a position of "his" will. And thus soul is immortal because it is god.

 

[James Lyon]

Well, if you read John 3:16-18 you will find out who will be saved and who will not.

Following commandments isn't enough. You need to do something to rid yourself of sin entirely. Only Jesus can do that.

Lucifer was the right hand "Son" cast out on to the earth. Lucifer was the son, Christ. The morning star/ Star of the morning. Believe or you are Judged because you Judged. And he was Murdered by those he came to teach and Demonized by ignorance "sin".

 

[Daniel108]

How do you know sin is really for real and not something made up?

How do you know that sin is not real, and believing otherwise is not leading you astray?

Finding out that breaking the laws of God (sinning) results in dire consequences is one way to learn the truth. Isn't it better to have faith in a higher power, and trust in the commandments and covenants God has asked us to follow?

 

[James Lyon]

what circular logic do you mean? God created you, there is no a circular logic in this notion. we can say man created BMW, Mercedes.

The idea that "god" created us is a notion and only a notion. If you look at it literally, he engineered the DNA like a master Geneticist and made a being, in "their" likeness, this makes him like us, a species that is born and dies. So in that what happens when we become obsolete like an old car, on the Judgement that Humans are to ignorant a being to maintain, they have destroyed the garden they were given dominion over and murder in his man and over pierces of the ground. What a repungent thing man is. even the concept of turning from sin has become ignorant to Jesus sacrifice. The fact here is if "god" as you speak of created man, he failed. We are self destructive and self absorbed and corrupt even through the religions cores, the false prophets the rule the churches and governments will be the first to be tossed in the lake of fire.

 

[uncung]

The idea that "god" created us is a notion and only a notion. If you look at it literally, he engineered the DNA like a master Geneticist and made a being, in "their" likeness, this makes him like us, a species that is born and dies. So in that what happens when we become obsolete like an old car, on the Judgement that Humans are to ignorant a being to maintain, they have destroyed the garden they were given dominion over and murder in his man and over pierces of the ground. What a repungent thing man is. even the concept of turning from sin has become ignorant to Jesus sacrifice. The fact here is if "god" as you speak of created man, he failed. We are self destructive and self absorbed and corrupt even through the religions cores, the false prophets the rule the churches and governments will be the first to be tossed in the lake of fire.

sshh.. seem you don't realize you speak with a muslim.

 

[rusra02]

I understand that it is your view that the Bible doesn't teach this and you have supported your argument rather well with your chosen passages but there are many others who would refute your POV using passages of their own Rusra02. Whether or not you agree is almost beside the point as the Bible does, indeed, teach that there is one faith and those who don't adhere to that faith will never achieve Nirvana, enlightenment, heaven.. pick your term. And also, people are told in the Bible that certain things will result in death and hell. Revelations 21; 8. Matthew 13; 50 and 25; 46. 2nd Peter 2; 4 and so on. These passages clearly indicate that those who don't live up to what God demands will end up in hell. There is no doubt in the reading. How then, do you justify that?

The Scriptures mentioning the wicked "weeds" being thrown into a fiery furnace does not imply everlasting torture, but rather destruction. (Matthew 13:50) Matthew 25:46 says; "These [wicked] will depart into everlasting cutting-off, but the righteous ones into everlasting life." Thus the wicked are cut off in death. 2 Peter 2:4 discusses God's punishment of the disobedient angels who sinned, and does not speak of everlasting torture in hellfire.

 

[dianaiad]

Yes I can, God created you, it is the proof.

That is quite the most circular argument I have ever heard.

Please remember: I AM a theist...but dang, man, that's a really bad argument.

 

[dianaiad]

But I can prove heaven is for real. Oppositely you can't disprove it.

You can? I would love to see that proof. Remember; I happen to believe in heaven (or more than one, whichever) so I'm actually on your side here. Please, do, give me the proof you have.

 

[dianaiad]

Good that you mention the Norse hell ( non-biblical hell ) that teaches an immortal soul.
That unbiblical hell is often taught as being Scripture but is Not the Bible's hell or grave.
The Bible's hell is simply mankind stone-cold grave for the sleeping dead.
Jesus taught unconscious 'sleep in death' - John 11:12-14 - and so do the old Hebrew Scriptures - Psalms 115:17; Psalms 146:4; Daniel 12:2; Daniel 12:13; Ecclesiastes 9:5
So, while the dead Jesus was in biblical hell (grave), then the dead Jesus was Not conscious while he was dead.
The Bible's soul is Not immortal because the soul that sins dies according to Ezekiel 18:4,20, and the soul can be destroyed according to Acts of the Apostles 3:23.
If the biblical soul was death proof (immortal) then there would be No need for a resurrection. What is alive can't be resurrected - John 5:28

What happened to father Adam at his death according to Genesis 3:19 is that Adam simply ' returned ' to the dust of the ground.
A person can Not ' return ' to a place he never was before. So, Adam simply went from non-life, to life, and returned back to non-life.
As a foreclosed house does Not move or go away anywhere but just goes back to the hands of the owner, our life's spirit is in God's hands, and when Jesus resurrects the dead out of biblical hell - Revelation 1:18 - then the resurrected ones will once again have life's spirit as Adam had when God breathed the breath of life into life-less Adam - Genesis 2:7
Rejoice, rejoice for there ' is going to be ' a resurrection......... - Acts of the Apostles 24:15

Jesus 'slept?" How do you explain 1 Peter 3:18-20? That's pretty amazing sleepwalking...not only for Him, but for those to whom He preached.




<biblia:bibleverse theme="header" resource="nkjv" width="500" reference="1 Peter 3:18–20"></biblia:bibleverse> <script src=https://assets.bibliacdn.com/api/logos.biblia.js></script><script>logos.biblia.init();</script>

 

[dianaiad]

My proof is you. You are the proof of God existence, because you are created by God.

Oh, my.

That is beautiful
.
God exists because
I do and I exist because
God created me.

I think that is quite possibly the best example of the fallacy of circular reasoning I have ever encountered. It beats the one usually used when defining that particular fallacy, namely:

God exists because the bible says He does
The Bible is true because
God wrote it.

This is even more true if you replace 'bible' with "the Quran," because unlike with the bible, it is my understanding that Muslims actually do believe that God wrote it directly.

Sometimes I have to wonder what my fellow theists are thinking...or if they do. C'mon, uncung...you MUST have a better reason for believing in Him than this!

Don't rest your faith in Him on things that can be attacked here.

 

[dianaiad]

First, to answer your question YES! I am willing to stake my eternal destiny on my faith in Jesus Christ for my eternal salvation! If everything that Jesus said is a bunch of nonsense, if the Bible is a lie then what is my fate? If you are wrong and everything that Jesus said is true, and the Bible is the true word of God, what is your fate?

Which interpretation of it, Rapture Era?

I too believe that the bible contains the word of God, and I do believe in Jesus Christ as my Savior and Redeemer....but I'll lay odds (and it is against my religion to gamble...which should tell you that I don't think I'm gambling when I 'lay odds') that if you are any form of evangelical Christian, that you absolutely do not think that I am a Christian, that you consign most people who don't agree with your specific interpretation of biblical 'truth' to hell.....including, perhaps, Catholics, Orthodoxy and a whole bunch of other people.

yet all of THEM are 'staking their eternal destinies' upon their personal beliefs regarding Jesus Christ.

When I asked are you willing to take that chance, if you fully believe in whatever it is you place your trust, when you die, you will find out if you made the right choice. But whatever that choice was at the time of your death, if you chose the wrong belief system, you can't say wait! I change my mind now!

So you believe that God will condemn to eternal hell everybody who doesn't choose the right belief system, whether or not they ever got a chance to LEARN about the right belief system, or whether or not those who belong to the 'right' one were not responsible enough to teach it, or who acted in a manner that turned prospective believers away in disgust?

Do you truly believe that God is that unfair, and that capricious?

Nope, you are going to suffer the consequences for ever and ever and ever and ever, it will never end! All I'm saying, is, are you absolutely sure with no doubt at all that what you believe is true? Only you can answer that question. God has done his part. He has told us what our condition is through sin and where that will lead us, He has paid the penalty of that sin for us through Jesus' death, and He is giving us the choice to accept his free gift of eternal life in heaven. It's pretty simple. Do you accept or not? That's the bottom line.

Well, it's not up to you to determine that, thank the Lord.