Can someone explain the Trinity please...

[Kolibri]

Another reason to understand that infants could not be baptized is that the only kind of water baptism supported by the Bible is complete immersion.
In addition, cultural anthropology/history collaborates this. I am unaware of anyone that practices complete water immersion on infants.

On this subject the New Catholic Encyclopedia (1967, Vol. II, p. 56) states: “It is evident that Baptism in the early Church was by immersion.” Larousse du XXe Siècle, Paris, 1928, says: “The first Christians received baptism by immersion everywhere where water was found.”

 

[sojourner]

Culture doesn't dictate doctrine. God does. We don't need to go outside the word of God to know His will for us.

God "dictates" nothing. Everything God "says" is filtered through a cultural lens. Therefore, culture very much determines doctrine. The church has always "gone outside" the biblical texts to determine God's will. The possible baptism of small children in the Acts time frame wasn't likely a doctrinal issue, anyway -- it would have been more of a cultural issue.

 

[sojourner]

Another reason to understand that infants could not be baptized is that the only kind of water baptism supported by the Bible is complete immersion.
In addition, cultural anthropology/history collaborates this. I am unaware of anyone that practices complete water immersion on infants.

On this subject the New Catholic Encyclopedia (1967, Vol. II, p. 56) states: “It is evident that Baptism in the early Church was by immersion.” Larousse du XXe Siècle, Paris, 1928, says: “The first Christians received baptism by immersion everywhere where water was found.”

Actually, infants do very well in submersion. Haven't you ever heard of "water babies?"

 

[katiemygirl]

God "dictates" nothing. Everything God "says" is filtered through a cultural lens. Therefore, culture very much determines doctrine. The church has always "gone outside" the biblical texts to determine God's will. The possible baptism of small children in the Acts time frame wasn't likely a doctrinal issue, anyway -- it would have been more of a cultural issue.

You said it correctly. The Roman Catholic Organization has always gone outside the Bible. God's will doesn't seem to be at the top of their list of priorities. This is why they are a false religion, right along with the JW and Mormon religions.

 

[sojourner]

You said it correctly. The Roman Catholic Organization has always gone outside the Bible. God's will doesn't seem to be at the top of their list of priorities. This is why they are a false religion, right along with the JW and Mormon religions.

We're not talking about the RCC. We're talking about the church before denominationalism -- you know: the early church. the bible wasn't completed until about the year 450 C.E. That means that there were 425 years when the church didn't have a bible -- the whole NT was, at that point, outside the bible. God's will is at the top of their list of priorities -- and always has been. But God's will isn't transmitted exclusively through the bible -- and never has been! Do you think that Isaiah or Jeremiah or Ezekiel discerned God's will through scripture? I think not. Your obsession with the bible is over the top. The heresy of Sola Scriptura didn't come about for over 1500 years of the church's existence.

 

[katiemygirl]

We're not talking about the RCC. We're talking about the church before denominationalism -- you know: the early church. the bible wasn't completed until about the year 450 C.E. That means that there were 425 years when the church didn't have a bible -- the whole NT was, at that point, outside the bible. God's will is at the top of their list of priorities -- and always has been. But God's will isn't transmitted exclusively through the bible -- and never has been! Do you think that Isaiah or Jeremiah or Ezekiel discerned God's will through scripture? I think not. Your obsession with the bible is over the top. The heresy of Sola Scriptura didn't come about for over 1500 years of the church's existence.

The Roman catholic organization is NOT the Lord's church. It is a denomination. It barely resembles the NT church. Your church was not around during the first century.

Paul's letters and other NT writings were being read to christians in congregations as soon as they could get them into their hands. They didn't need to be compiled by the catholics into what we know as the New Testament for people to hear the words spoken by inspired men.

There hasn't been an inspired human being since the apostle John died. Anyone who claims inspiration or new revelations today is a heretic.

God spoke directly to men like Jeremiah and Ezekiel. God does not speak directly to men today. He speaks to us through His Son and through the Bible.

All of the writers of the NT had the OT Scriptures available to them. There are many quotes from the OT found in the NT.

You bet my obsession with God's word is over the top! I thank God it is. I will never put my faith in the wisdom of men. Ever!

I can't believe anyone could suggest man's way is better than God's way. No wonder Christendom is such a mess with all kinds of denominations. Instead of trusting the Lord, people prefer listening to men. Very very sad!

I'll stick to the teachings of the NT church, and the teachings of Jesus and His apostles.

 

[sojourner]

The Roman catholic organization is NOT the Lord's church.

Of course it is; it is part of the whole body of Christ that is the church.

It barely resembles the NT church.

There is no church body today that "resembles the NT church" in the way you imply. The church is a living organism and, as such, grows and changes over time, according to its environment -- its cultural environment. However, the RCC -- as with all parts of the one church -- does resemble the NT church, in that it claims that Jesus is its head, it accepts Jesus as God's instrument of our salvation, and it continues "in the apostles' teaching, in the breaking of bread, and the prayers."

Your church was not around during the first century.

"My church?" What "church" do you think that might be?? I've made it abundantly clear on this forum that I am not a Christian. Nonetheless, no bodies, existing as they do today, were "around" during the first century. It's all new. As it should be.

Paul's letters and other NT writings were being read to christians in congregations as soon as they could get them into their hands.

Uh huh. But they weren't scripture. In that time, "scripture" was understood to be the Hebrew texts. These were nothing more than men writing letters.

There hasn't been an inspired human being since the apostle John died.

Really! So, the people who put your bible together weren't inspired? The people who, in the 1500s, decided to remove some of the texts from your bible weren't inspired? Really?! So, you're claiming, then, that your bible is patently not the inspired word of God.

God does not speak directly to men today.

How do you know? Can you point to a specific biblical passage that explicitly makes that claim? Or is this merely "the heresy of modern men?"

He speaks to us through His Son and through the Bible.

Since the church is the body of Christ, one can, then, expect that speaking "through [God's] Son" includes speaking through the church (which is that Son's body).

You bet my obsession with God's word is over the top! I thank God it is. I will never put my faith in the wisdom of men. Ever!

Then you cannot trust any English translation of the bible, nor any compilation of the bible, since all translations and compilations (including the KJV and whatever else you may hold dear) were done by "uninspired," "heretical" men. It was the wisdom of these "uninspired" and "heretical" men that give you the bible you have on your shelf. The best you can do is to obtain the oldest manuscripts we have (which are in Greek -- all caps, no word separations, no punctuation), and even they were copied by "uninspired" and "heretical" men. If you refuse to trust in the "wisdom of men," then you're sunk, so far as "God's word" is concerned.

I can't believe anyone could suggest man's way is better than God's way.

No one's making that suggestion -- except for you...

No wonder Christendom is such a mess with all kinds of denominations.

Diversity is a good and necessary thing, from a natural standpoint. Diversity is how the world remains viable. It's also how the church remains viable.

Instead of trusting the Lord, people prefer listening to men.

Hmmm... the Faithful have always listened to those through whom God has spoken. (Remember the prophets?)

I'll stick to the teachings of the NT church, and the teachings of Jesus and His apostles.

You don't have those teachings, except through the developing, changing church, which is made up of ... men. To quote a recent "pundit," it's:

Very very sad!

for you.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I was talking to a Lutheran Pastor the other day and he said God provided the greatest gift when he offered himself up as Jesus on the cross. But from what I read in the Bible, when Jesus was on the cross, he spoke to God in heaven. How then can he be God at the same time? Please explain. Thanks

Simple: Jesus can't be God.
Gospel writer John wrote at Revelation 1:5; 3:14 that Jesus is the beginning of the creation by God. God had No beginning according to Psalm 90:2. So, only God was before the beginning. Jesus was Not before the beginning as God was before the beginning.

Gospel writer John explains at John 1:18 that No man has seen God at any time.
People saw Jesus, and lived to tell about Jesus.- 1st John 4:12; Exodus 33:20

 

[Unification]

I was talking to a Lutheran Pastor the other day and he said God provided the greatest gift when he offered himself up as Jesus on the cross. But from what I read in the Bible, when Jesus was on the cross, he spoke to God in heaven. How then can he be God at the same time? Please explain. Thanks

There is no explaining garbage or something created by man's carnal mind.

God is unity, no divide, love, and peace. . And the furthest from any religi

I was talking to a Lutheran Pastor the other day and he said God provided the greatest gift when he offered himself up as Jesus on the cross. But from what I read in the Bible, when Jesus was on the cross, he spoke to God in heaven. How then can he be God at the same time? Please explain. Thanks

the trinity is just an evil way of man's carnal mind trying to explain God, just like every other doctrine. Blind leading the blind. The natural trying to explain things spiritual, which will always fail and is no truth.
As always, it takes

I was talking to a Lutheran Pastor the other day and he said God provided the greatest gift when he offered himself up as Jesus on the cross. But from what I read in the Bible, when Jesus was on the cross, he spoke to God in heaven. How then can he be God at the same time? Please explain. Thanks

the trinity is just an evil way of man's carnal mind trying to explain God, just like every other doctrine. Blind leading the blind. The natural trying to explain things spiritual, which will always fail and is no truth.
As always, it takes the Spirit to teach things written by the Spirit.
When the kingdom of God has truly come upon an individual, he leaves religion, he is taught unity, equalness, the elimination of any and all divide, common ground amongst humans, genuine love and purity, and peace. Complete reconstruction of his/her conditioned and trained mind to the spiritual mind. Taught by the Spirit within his/her body. Taught the one and only truth.
The concept of God being a physical, individual man that came in the flesh is craziness. Now the truth of God being IN and residing in every humans flesh is beautiful. There is a grave difference between "having" faith and being "in" faith. The spiritual man knows and experiences God. Knows the truth. Gives and surrenders his life for true life.
There is one God, the Father, all Spirit, the energy, light, and perfect, pure, divine constant that holds everything together.
There is one Son, the Lord, all Spirit, the life, light, and blood in every human. Not a white haired bearded man residing in the skies.
Every human has a spirit and human body, that the spirit and life and blood resides in. Every human has heavenly places and earthly places.

Every individual that has ever had the breath of life, has one God, one Lord, one spirit, and one human body. The spirit and blood in every human is THE TRUTH and THE LIFE in every being.

Laws of nature, laws of God are visible evidence all around us.
How are we connected to that source of energy/ source of light? Easily, we all have that same source of energy/source of light WITHIN and INSIDE of us.
It's called LIFE.

Father to Son/Son to Father/energy to energy/light to light/life to life/love to love/etc.

How can we know God and experience God? Only way is WITHIN and INSIDE of us. The truth(spirit) and life(blood) within us all.

Our conditioned and controlled and brainwashed minds are taught by conditioned and controlled and brainwashed minds.
To look externally and outwardly and literally and historically instead of something that is INSIDE and WITHIN us all, and the ONLY access to know the true and one God where any and the only transformation can take place.
Our natural and conditioned minds look at scripture written by the Spirit of God and interpret that in natural and earthly ways, belittling God.
Earthly marriage, slavery, females being in subjection to males, God killing children, God coming back to physically conquer and destroy humans, God punishing his own creation to eternal torture and burning, incest, physical land on Earth being holy, initial sin and everyone being punished for a few humans' mistake, physical abuse, a literal snake and Satan that is to blame for everything, and not ourselves, doing vain outward works, the list goes on and on and is endless. It's all wrong. Couldn't be further from the truth.

All scripture is spiritual and is occurring internally inside the human body. Being spiritual isn't anything external, it isn't of vain works, it isn't going to a church building, it isn't seeing things naturally, literally, earthly, and historically.

We look naturally, externally, literally, and historically and condemn ourselves and create divide. Mankind teaching mankind (adultery) instead the spirit teaching mankind.

We are all beasts(flesh) and false prophets(natural-minded) and Satan(self-ego-reputation) until discovering the ultimate truth.

By every lie and falsity we speak, we are condemning ourselves. Taming the tongue isn't to stop cussing, taming the tongue is to stop speaking lies and falsity of God. Do not speak until spoken to by the Spirit and know without an inkling of doubt that it is true.

We reap what we sow. Good and evil.

Every genuine and pure act of love we show another, we are showing it to God. Every evil and vain act we show to another we are showing it to God. Our thoughts are dissected, our desires are known. There is no hiding because the spirit in us is listening.

We must eliminate the I and me and us and we and realize that apart from God , (the spirit residing inside of us) it is impossible to do any good. Fear the Lord. Be brought low, to humbleness, to poor, decrease you and your mind and increase the spirit/life/light/energy within you. Shut off the conditioned mind and what we think that we know because that is falsity and fails and harms others even if it is meant with good intent. It's still deception and lies. Creates fear, divide.

While everyone is arguing over the silliest things, my ego vs your ego, my intelligence vs your intelligence, my religion vs your religion, my image and imagination of a created God that I made in my own mind and heart vs your image and imagination of a created God that you made in your heart and mind, etc.... it all still comes back to the same conclusion.... Condemnation.

Man's will vs Gods will.
Man's carnal and false imagination vs God's will and truth.

Scripture: the destruction of our carnal, natural, outward, vain, false, desirous, self gratification, ego, pride, reputation, evil, fleshly, inhumane ways into a spiritual being of truth, love, unity, and peace.
Spiritual Union between God and mankind.
Divine marriage of spirit and body.
The human body is a mere vessel carrying out God's will. Only, the vast majority are carrying out their own will in their vessels. Most are self-deceived by thinking they are doing God's will.

We all could survive in this world and sin, not being completely consumed by the all pure, all Spirit, Father God because of a sacrifice before the foundations of it existed.


The truth is the one and only thing that can unite us all. The universal truth.
We all have the same life in us (spirit), we all have the same world to live in, we all breathe and die. We all have blood, bones, flesh, a heart, a brain, a mind, a conscious, a soul.
If we all have one God and the same Creator.... Wouldn't there be only ONE truth?

The scholar of the mind will always conflict with the prophet taught by the Spirit.

The LORD(Father) said unto my Lord(Son-Messiah-the Christ) sit thou at my right hand until I make thine enemies(sin in the human body) thy footstool. Light/life source to my light/life source.
The SPIRIT said to my Spirit.
Spirit/light/energy inside all of mankind is the only access to the Father.

Animal sacrifices have nothing to do with literal animal sacrifices. The spiritual truth is that the sacrifice and mercy was to be of the human carnality, the flesh/the beast, the deceived mind, the animalistic desires and lusts inside the body.

We are all physically alive and able to exist and sin without consumption because of the blood.
We are also able to be cleansed and made new through the sacrifice of our beastly/carnal ways and sprinkled by that same blood inside of us internally.

The human body is the wife in which the spirit-the husband drives.

We are either led by the Spirit or led by ourselves.

Endless translations and different languages have left us arguing over the exact particular name of this spirit and life and light within us. Jesus, Yeshua, Joshua.... Makes no difference.
We are all in a state of confusion and lack of truth because we rely on ourselves and other humans to teach us rather than meditating on the Spirit. We build our own man empires and towers to God leaving us in a state of Babel and Babylon and confusion.

Different authors inspired by the Spirit to write over long periods of time have used different words, metaphors, in their own language, in their own testimony of the spirit/light revealed to them in their minds and hearts. . And then translated many, many times by more men. Their own testimony of the inner destruction of themselves and sin by the Lord within and their transformation into the new spiritual man.
The divine spiritual Union of husband(spirit) and wife(human body)

Union of Father, Son, and body. (Holy Spirit/Ghost.)

The bible is not the Word of God. It contains words spoken of God. There are many beautiful inspired writings not in the Bible. Paul's writings are not inspired. They are not universal. He was a man that saw the light and wrote letters to particular buildings and giving his opinion a few times on things. Trying to explain the inner/spiritual things and mysteries of God which were revealed to him, and tried passing that along to the carnal and natural minded.

The Word of God comes speaking and experiencing and transforming and is no lie because it is only one truth and Spirit. It is the light and life. Claiming a book and writings to be the only access to God is blasphemous.

Nobody needs this book. Anyone can look within and be taught by the Spirit and light within. The end result will always be the same for the spiritual man. Fearing the Lord, Love, true peace and beauty, humbleness, unity, and equality, no religion, life, truth.... Spiritual energy flowing in harmonious rhythm and beauty. Always giving thanks and praise. And all written on the heart and mind internally. Not on paper and black ink.

The spokesman for the Father has always been the Son who is the literal life and blood inside of all beings representing the Father. Only source of access to the Father is inside of us. Light source to light source. Life source to life source. Spirit to spirit. LORD saying to my Lord.

We simply do underestimate the power of God and His sovereignty. Look at the physical Earth for instance, the country of Israel is practically dead smack in the middle, with the 12 tribes. The Capitol being Jerusalem. We look up and we see the skies/the heavens.
Now look within the human body spiritually.... We have the Earth as our physical body/our dust, we have Israel as our brain, the 12 cranial nerves camped around the brain, we have Jerusalem as our heart, and we have the tabernacle as the heavenly places inside of us where Zion dwells.
We have the Jewish literal history and the divide of those tribes into the South and North kingdoms as well as having the divide inside of our bodies as the spirit and flesh wrestle within against each other. The same common purpose: uniting both kingdoms so there is no divide. (Marriage of spirit and body.)
God showing mankind natural things in order for the truth to resurrect within. We all know about Judah.

The natural/outward man becoming the spiritual/inner man.

The old heaven and earth passing away and the new heaven and earth created.

The old man of self left behind, the child of God created.

The death of the evil seed child and The growth of the good, saving seed growing and resurrecting within us.

Sin and death defeated by the light shining and destroying the darkness within.

 

[sojourner]

There is no explaining garbage or something created by man's carnal mind.

God is unity, no divide, love, and peace. . And the furthest from any religi

the trinity is just an evil way of man's carnal mind trying to explain God, just like every other doctrine. Blind leading the blind. The natural trying to explain things spiritual, which will always fail and is no truth.
As always, it takes


the trinity is just an evil way of man's carnal mind trying to explain God, just like every other doctrine. Blind leading the blind. The natural trying to explain things spiritual, which will always fail and is no truth.
As always, it takes the Spirit to teach things written by the Spirit.
When the kingdom of God has truly come upon an individual, he leaves religion, he is taught unity, equalness, the elimination of any and all divide, common ground amongst humans, genuine love and purity, and peace. Complete reconstruction of his/her conditioned and trained mind to the spiritual mind. Taught by the Spirit within his/her body. Taught the one and only truth.
The concept of God being a physical, individual man that came in the flesh is craziness. Now the truth of God being IN and residing in every humans flesh is beautiful. There is a grave difference between "having" faith and being "in" faith. The spiritual man knows and experiences God. Knows the truth. Gives and surrenders his life for true life.
There is one God, the Father, all Spirit, the energy, light, and perfect, pure, divine constant that holds everything together.
There is one Son, the Lord, all Spirit, the life, light, and blood in every human. Not a white haired bearded man residing in the skies.
Every human has a spirit and human body, that the spirit and life and blood resides in. Every human has heavenly places and earthly places.

Every individual that has ever had the breath of life, has one God, one Lord, one spirit, and one human body. The spirit and blood in every human is THE TRUTH and THE LIFE in every being.

Laws of nature, laws of God are visible evidence all around us.
How are we connected to that source of energy/ source of light? Easily, we all have that same source of energy/source of light WITHIN and INSIDE of us.
It's called LIFE.

Father to Son/Son to Father/energy to energy/light to light/life to life/love to love/etc.

How can we know God and experience God? Only way is WITHIN and INSIDE of us. The truth(spirit) and life(blood) within us all.

Our conditioned and controlled and brainwashed minds are taught by conditioned and controlled and brainwashed minds.
To look externally and outwardly and literally and historically instead of something that is INSIDE and WITHIN us all, and the ONLY access to know the true and one God where any and the only transformation can take place.
Our natural and conditioned minds look at scripture written by the Spirit of God and interpret that in natural and earthly ways, belittling God.
Earthly marriage, slavery, females being in subjection to males, God killing children, God coming back to physically conquer and destroy humans, God punishing his own creation to eternal torture and burning, incest, physical land on Earth being holy, initial sin and everyone being punished for a few humans' mistake, physical abuse, a literal snake and Satan that is to blame for everything, and not ourselves, doing vain outward works, the list goes on and on and is endless. It's all wrong. Couldn't be further from the truth.

All scripture is spiritual and is occurring internally inside the human body. Being spiritual isn't anything external, it isn't of vain works, it isn't going to a church building, it isn't seeing things naturally, literally, earthly, and historically.

We look naturally, externally, literally, and historically and condemn ourselves and create divide. Mankind teaching mankind (adultery) instead the spirit teaching mankind.

We are all beasts(flesh) and false prophets(natural-minded) and Satan(self-ego-reputation) until discovering the ultimate truth.

By every lie and falsity we speak, we are condemning ourselves. Taming the tongue isn't to stop cussing, taming the tongue is to stop speaking lies and falsity of God. Do not speak until spoken to by the Spirit and know without an inkling of doubt that it is true.

We reap what we sow. Good and evil.

Every genuine and pure act of love we show another, we are showing it to God. Every evil and vain act we show to another we are showing it to God. Our thoughts are dissected, our desires are known. There is no hiding because the spirit in us is listening.

We must eliminate the I and me and us and we and realize that apart from God , (the spirit residing inside of us) it is impossible to do any good. Fear the Lord. Be brought low, to humbleness, to poor, decrease you and your mind and increase the spirit/life/light/energy within you. Shut off the conditioned mind and what we think that we know because that is falsity and fails and harms others even if it is meant with good intent. It's still deception and lies. Creates fear, divide.

While everyone is arguing over the silliest things, my ego vs your ego, my intelligence vs your intelligence, my religion vs your religion, my image and imagination of a created God that I made in my own mind and heart vs your image and imagination of a created God that you made in your heart and mind, etc.... it all still comes back to the same conclusion.... Condemnation.

Man's will vs Gods will.
Man's carnal and false imagination vs God's will and truth.

Scripture: the destruction of our carnal, natural, outward, vain, false, desirous, self gratification, ego, pride, reputation, evil, fleshly, inhumane ways into a spiritual being of truth, love, unity, and peace.
Spiritual Union between God and mankind.
Divine marriage of spirit and body.
The human body is a mere vessel carrying out God's will. Only, the vast majority are carrying out their own will in their vessels. Most are self-deceived by thinking they are doing God's will.

We all could survive in this world and sin, not being completely consumed by the all pure, all Spirit, Father God because of a sacrifice before the foundations of it existed.


The truth is the one and only thing that can unite us all. The universal truth.
We all have the same life in us (spirit), we all have the same world to live in, we all breathe and die. We all have blood, bones, flesh, a heart, a brain, a mind, a conscious, a soul.
If we all have one God and the same Creator.... Wouldn't there be only ONE truth?

The scholar of the mind will always conflict with the prophet taught by the Spirit.

The LORD(Father) said unto my Lord(Son-Messiah-the Christ) sit thou at my right hand until I make thine enemies(sin in the human body) thy footstool. Light/life source to my light/life source.
The SPIRIT said to my Spirit.
Spirit/light/energy inside all of mankind is the only access to the Father.

Animal sacrifices have nothing to do with literal animal sacrifices. The spiritual truth is that the sacrifice and mercy was to be of the human carnality, the flesh/the beast, the deceived mind, the animalistic desires and lusts inside the body.

We are all physically alive and able to exist and sin without consumption because of the blood.
We are also able to be cleansed and made new through the sacrifice of our beastly/carnal ways and sprinkled by that same blood inside of us internally.

The human body is the wife in which the spirit-the husband drives.

We are either led by the Spirit or led by ourselves.

Endless translations and different languages have left us arguing over the exact particular name of this spirit and life and light within us. Jesus, Yeshua, Joshua.... Makes no difference.
We are all in a state of confusion and lack of truth because we rely on ourselves and other humans to teach us rather than meditating on the Spirit. We build our own man empires and towers to God leaving us in a state of Babel and Babylon and confusion.

Different authors inspired by the Spirit to write over long periods of time have used different words, metaphors, in their own language, in their own testimony of the spirit/light revealed to them in their minds and hearts. . And then translated many, many times by more men. Their own testimony of the inner destruction of themselves and sin by the Lord within and their transformation into the new spiritual man.
The divine spiritual Union of husband(spirit) and wife(human body)

Union of Father, Son, and body. (Holy Spirit/Ghost.)

The bible is not the Word of God. It contains words spoken of God. There are many beautiful inspired writings not in the Bible. Paul's writings are not inspired. They are not universal. He was a man that saw the light and wrote letters to particular buildings and giving his opinion a few times on things. Trying to explain the inner/spiritual things and mysteries of God which were revealed to him, and tried passing that along to the carnal and natural minded.

The Word of God comes speaking and experiencing and transforming and is no lie because it is only one truth and Spirit. It is the light and life. Claiming a book and writings to be the only access to God is blasphemous.

Nobody needs this book. Anyone can look within and be taught by the Spirit and light within. The end result will always be the same for the spiritual man. Fearing the Lord, Love, true peace and beauty, humbleness, unity, and equality, no religion, life, truth.... Spiritual energy flowing in harmonious rhythm and beauty. Always giving thanks and praise. And all written on the heart and mind internally. Not on paper and black ink.

The spokesman for the Father has always been the Son who is the literal life and blood inside of all beings representing the Father. Only source of access to the Father is inside of us. Light source to light source. Life source to life source. Spirit to spirit. LORD saying to my Lord.

We simply do underestimate the power of God and His sovereignty. Look at the physical Earth for instance, the country of Israel is practically dead smack in the middle, with the 12 tribes. The Capitol being Jerusalem. We look up and we see the skies/the heavens.
Now look within the human body spiritually.... We have the Earth as our physical body/our dust, we have Israel as our brain, the 12 cranial nerves camped around the brain, we have Jerusalem as our heart, and we have the tabernacle as the heavenly places inside of us where Zion dwells.
We have the Jewish literal history and the divide of those tribes into the South and North kingdoms as well as having the divide inside of our bodies as the spirit and flesh wrestle within against each other. The same common purpose: uniting both kingdoms so there is no divide. (Marriage of spirit and body.)
God showing mankind natural things in order for the truth to resurrect within. We all know about Judah.

The natural/outward man becoming the spiritual/inner man.

The old heaven and earth passing away and the new heaven and earth created.

The old man of self left behind, the child of God created.

The death of the evil seed child and The growth of the good, saving seed growing and resurrecting within us.

Sin and death defeated by the light shining and destroying the darkness within.

Well, this is certainly all over the place. Suffice to say that the doctrine of the Trinity represents a valid theological construction for God's nature. I've not seen one solitary, valid rebuttal that isn't based on either a misunderstanding of the doctrine, or on some other untenable position of understanding of the nature of God.

 

[cataway]

try as all have tried , no one has yet come up with any true to scripture reason to hold to the trinity . if any thing, it only shows how ridicules the trinity is .

 

[Unification]

Well, this is certainly all over the place. Suffice to say that the doctrine of the Trinity represents a valid theological construction for God's nature. I've not seen one solitary, valid rebuttal that isn't based on either a misunderstanding of the doctrine, or on some other untenable position of understanding of the nature of God.

You're holding on, friend. It's okay to let go. I was a doctrine believer too for awhile. Spirit isn't theology. The worst thing holding a man/woman back is their own intelligence and education.

 

[katiemygirl]

Simple: Jesus can't be God.
Gospel writer John wrote at Revelation 1:5; 3:14 that Jesus is the beginning of the creation by God. God had No beginning according to Psalm 90:2. So, only God was before the beginning. Jesus was Not before the beginning as God was before the beginning.

Gospel writer John explains at John 1:18 that No man has seen God at any time.
People saw Jesus, and lived to tell about Jesus.- 1st John 4:12; Exodus 33:20

In the beginning WAS the word, and the word WAS with God, and the word WAS God. John 1:1

And the word became flesh. John 1:14

Unless you want to start adding to or changing the original language of these verses, they say what they say. You can let man's arguments convince you that the verses say something different. It's your choice. As for me, I'll stick with what these verses say both in the Greek and the English languages. The word WAS God!

Genesis 18. YHWH came in the form of a man. He appeared and spoke to Abraham.

Obviously, there has to be more to understanding the verse which says no man can see God and live. Abraham did see God, and he lived! Imho, no man can see God in all of His glory and live. Maybe that's what the verse means. I don't know. All I know is people saw Jesus who is God and lived. Abraham saw God in the form of a man and he lived. This fact cannot be denied.

What people saw was the human Jesus. They weren't looking at the God Jesus. That's how I see it anyway.

But no matter how you cut it, the word was with God in the beginning and the word was God.

 

[katiemygirl]

You're holding on, friend. It's okay to let go. I was a doctrine believer too for awhile. Spirit isn't theology. The worst thing holding a man/woman back is their own intelligence and education.

It is very very hard to let go of beliefs you've held to your entire life. None of us likes being wrong. I held tightly to false doctrine for years before turning it all over to my heavenly Father. He showed me the truth in His word. It is there for all of us who are willing to let go of pride and open our hearts to Him. Never again will I follow the teachings of men.

 

[katiemygirl]

try as all have tried , no one has yet come up with any true to scripture reason to hold to the trinity . if any thing, it only shows how ridicules the trinity is .

And try as you may, you have been unable to disprove it. The Bible clearly states the word was God. I would say it is the JW's and other anti trinitarians who look ridiculous. Look at the lengths they have had to go to in order to deny Jesus is God. They even had to come up with their own corrupt NWT in order to support their false religion.

 

[katiemygirl]

Well, this is certainly all over the place. Suffice to say that the doctrine of the Trinity represents a valid theological construction for God's nature. I've not seen one solitary, valid rebuttal that isn't based on either a misunderstanding of the doctrine, or on some other untenable position of understanding of the nature of God.

On this point we agree!

 

[sojourner]

You're holding on, friend. It's okay to let go. I was a doctrine believer too for awhile. Spirit isn't theology. The worst thing holding a man/woman back is their own intelligence and education.

Please don't try to give me spiritual counsel. It is neither solicited nor necessary. I'm not "holding on" to anything. I'm merely saying (to reiterate) that I've never seen a valid argument against the doctrine; the doctrine is a valid theological construction for the nature of God. There are other just as valid constructions. In the end, we have to remember that they're all just that: constructions -- not the thing (God) itself.

 

[sojourner]

try as all have tried , no one has yet come up with any true to scripture reason to hold to the trinity . if any thing, it only shows how ridicules the trinity is .

I disagree. There is much very good scriptural support for the doctrine.

 

[sojourner]

On this point we agree!

Finally!

 

[Unification]

Please don't try to give me spiritual counsel. It is neither solicited nor necessary. I'm not "holding on" to anything. I'm merely saying (to reiterate) that I've never seen a valid argument against the doctrine; the doctrine is a valid theological construction for the nature of God. There are other just as valid constructions. In the end, we have to remember that they're all just that: constructions -- not the thing (God) itself.

• In pain shall you bring forth children, woman, and you shall turn to your husband and he shall rule over you. And do you not know that you are Eve? God’s sentence hangs still over all your sex and His punishment weighs down upon you. You are the devil’s gateway; you are she who first violated the forbidden tree and broke the law of God. It was you who coaxed your way around him whom the devil had not the force to attack. With what ease you shattered that image of God: Man! Because of the death you merited, even the Son of God had to die… Woman, you are the gate to hell. –Tertullian, “the father of Latin Christianity” (c160-225): On the Apparel of Women, chapter 1

There is one reason. A man with hatred toward women. many other quotes too. Carnal mind doctrine.

The main reason is that nobody knows what was truly sacrificed for them.

To put ones faith on a doctrine written by someone who clearly was of the carnal mind as the foundation of your faith which is unexplainable as opposed to trusting in the Lord, and knowing God, I would say is silly. " the Father of Latin Christianity" may be others' foundation and father, but I decline.

There are many, glowing holes in this doctrine, written by a man. Folks are just naive and jump in with the crowd, and are reluctant to search out a matter in the Lord, because they don't know just how close He is to us and don't know how to because they are in confusion as to what they are really worshipping.