Different teachings in what way? From the Law of Moses to by faith alone? Do you think, you, as a Gentile or a Jew, could please God by following some part of the Law of Moses? I don’t think so because, “All who rely on observing the law are under a curse, for it is written: “Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.” –Galatians 3:10.
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Christ Has returned, what should have we looked for?
we went through with this already or it was asked and answered already. Here we go again: The Lord Jesus specifically said that it was the “FATHER” who will give the “COMFORTER/HOLY SPIRIT” to the disciples and if you read it in Acts 2:1-4 you will see that this “COMFORTER/HOLY SPIRIT” came upon them that believed in the Lord Jesus. This “ANOTHER/THE SAME/ALLOS COMFORTER/HOLY SPIRIT”, i.e., the same as the Lord Jesus, and NOT Baha’u’llah, will come from the “FATHER” not hundreds of years later but on Pentecost.
The meaning of “Arrogant” is: having or revealing an exaggerated sense of one's own importance or abilities.
You wanna see what or who is arrogant here?
This according to Tony is Bahaullah:
"...To Israel He was neither more nor less than the incarnation of the “Everlasting Father,” the “Lord of Hosts” come down “with ten thousands of saints”;
to Christendom Christ returned “in the glory of the Father,”
to Shí’ah Islám the return of the Imám Husayn;
to Sunní Islám the descent of the “Spirit of God” (Jesus Christ);
to the Zoroastrians the promised Sháh-Bahrám;
to the Hindus the reincarnation of Krishna;
to the Buddhists the fifth Buddha...."
This is arrogance claiming to be all these without any proof at all.
Twisted to mean like this one?
"New religion"? No wonder why you are so confused; kept changing them.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used against you in this forum.
Yes, it does says "ALL" means NOT some but "ALL", meaning there is only ONE CHRIST, and that is, The Lord Jesus Christ.
Bahaullah could write anything he wants but that does not mean he is the Christ that would come. NOT in the Bible meaning if it's NOT in the Bible then it's fake as in FAKE NEWS.Show me anything corrupt or evil that Baha'u'llah wrote or did.
I can show you a helluva lot of corrupt and evil fruit that came from Christianity. That was not the fault of Jesus though...
We have the Bible to prove it, what you have is a plagiarized [made in china] version of Christ return.
CG Didymus
Veteran Member
That's the problem. The NT has the name "Jesus" implied or maybe even stated as the one returning. They say things like when the "Lord" returns, or use the word "Christ", the "Lamb", the "Lion of Judah" and so on. For Christians, all these other names and titles refer to Jesus. And sorry, but it does seem like Baha'is have to turn and twist things to make them refer to their prophet. Plus, I mentioned this a few times, the very next coming of "Christ", "The Anointed One" would have been Muhammad. And I really don't see adequate prophecies that point to Muhammad.
CG Didymus
Veteran Member
No, he was much younger then. God mellowed out after that. Look at how many guys change after they become fathers.
CG Didymus
Veteran Member
Do the teachings of the various religions in any way contradict each other? My answer is "Yes". What's the Baha'i answer? Men changed the original teachings? Or, what if men made up the original teachings and other men changed them by adding on and embellishing?
CG Didymus
Veteran Member
Still from Adrian's post 13009 in the Great Beings thread:
Revelation 13:3-4
And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
***The Umayyads were overthrown by the Abbasids in 749 AD. The destruction of the Umayyads seemed total. However, one of the Umayyads, 'Abd al-Rahman, known as "The Falcon of the Quraysh," managed to escape to Andalusia (Spain) where he set up another Umayyad dynasty that lasted for 300 years. Thus Andalusia was the wounded head that healed. (The wounded head is still part of the Ummayads)
Revelation 13:11
And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
***The second beast was the 'Abbasid dynasty. The Abbasid dynasty came to power by conquest on the ruins (earth) of the Umayyad Empire. Its rulers gradually became Turkish beginning about 840 AD.
Revelation 13:3-18
3 One of the heads of the beast seemed to have had a fatal wound, but the fatal wound had been healed. The whole world was filled with wonder and followed the beast.
4 People worshiped the dragon because he had given authority to the beast, and they also worshiped the beast and asked, “Who is like the beast? Who can wage war against it?”
5 The beast was given a mouth to utter proud words and blasphemies and to exercise its authority for forty-two months.
6 It opened its mouth to blaspheme God, and to slander his name and his dwelling place and those who live in heaven.
7 It was given power to wage war against God’s holy people and to conquer them. And it was given authority over every tribe, people, language and nation.
8 All inhabitants of the earth will worship the beast—all whose names have not been written in the Lamb’s book of life, the Lamb who was slain from the creation of the world.
9 Whoever has ears, let them hear.
10 “If anyone is to go into captivity, into captivity they will go. If anyone is to be killed with the sword, with the sword they will be killed.”This calls for patient endurance and faithfulness on the part of God’s people.
11 Then I saw a second beast, coming out of the earth. It had two horns like a lamb, but it spoke like a dragon.
12 It exercised all the authority of the first beast on its behalf, and made the earth and its inhabitants worship the first beast, whose fatal wound had been healed.
13 And it performed great signs, even causing fire to come down from heaven to the earth in full view of the people.
14 Because of the signs it was given power to perform on behalf of the first beast, it deceived the inhabitants of the earth. It ordered them to set up an image in honor of the beast who was wounded by the sword and yet lived.
15 The second beast was given power to give breath to the image of the first beast, so that the image could speak and cause all who refused to worship the image to be killed.
16 It also forced all people, great and small, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hands or on their foreheads,
17 so that they could not buy or sell unless they had the mark, which is the name of the beast or the number of its name.
18 This calls for wisdom. Let the person who has insight calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man. That number is 666.
How do you get the interpretation of the Ummayads, and Abbasids out of all this? Your prophecies fulfilled doesn't add up. If the second beast is the Abbasids, then how do you get 666 AD as the correct interpretation of verse 18? The Abbasids didn't come into power until way later when they conquered the Ummayads? And when did this 'Abd al-Rahman ever have authority over all the people as mentioned in verse 7? Sorry, it don't work, none of it does.
I offer the same advice as per the quote above.
Baha'u'llah, Abdul'baha and Shoghi Effendi have given explanations.
You have to determine if Baha'u'llah tells the Truth. If you find He does, then the explanations are correct and we can use them for further thought.
Regards Tony
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In case you have not read it, here is the full explanation by Abdul'baha.
Bahá'í Reference Library - Some Answered Questions, Pages 45-61
This is the unsealed meaning of these verses. You can have no better understanding than this explanation as this answer is from God, as it was given by Abdul'baha who was given authority from Baha'u'llah to give interpretation of all scripture.
Regards Tony
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Based upon the Bible, there is a helluva lot of proof: William Sears, Thief in the Night
Christianity is not the sole owner of the Bible.
The Baha’i Faith does not have any preachers. We investigate truth on an individual basis.
Baha’is do not have any doctrines.
We just have the Original Writings of Baha’u’llah.. By contrast, all you have of what Jesus said is oral tradition, hearsay.The only doctrines that are twisted are the Christian doctrines.
Baha’u’llah was the return of Christ. You cannot change that by posting on a forum. It’s been done.
“We, in truth, have sent Him Whom We aided with the Holy Spirit (Jesus Christ) that He may announce unto you this Light that hath shone forth from the horizon of the will of your Lord, the Most Exalted, the All-Glorious, and Whose signs have been revealed in the West. Set your faces towards Him (Bahá’u’lláh) on this Day which God hath exalted above all other days, and whereon the All-Merciful hath shed the splendour of His effulgent glory upon all who are in heaven and all who are on earth.”
Proclamation of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 18
“This is, truly, that which the Spirit of God (Jesus Christ) hath announced, when He came with truth unto you, He with Whom the Jewish doctors disputed, till at last they perpetrated what hath made the Holy Spirit to lament, and the tears of them that have near access to God to flow….”
Proclamation of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 19
“For what thou hast done, thy kingdom shall be thrown into confusion, and thine empire shall pass from thine hands, as a punishment for that which thou hast wrought. Then wilt thou know how thou hast plainly erred. Commotions shall seize all the people in that land, unless thou arisest to help this Cause, and followest Him Who is the Spirit of God (Jesus Christ) in this, the Straight Path.”
Proclamation of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 20-21
“The Word which the Son concealed is made manifest. It hath been sent down in the form of the human temple in this day. Blessed be the Lord Who is the Father! He, verily, is come unto the nations in His most great majesty. Turn your faces towards Him, O concourse of the righteous… This is the day whereon the Rock (Peter) crieth out and shouteth, and celebrateth the praise of its Lord, the All-Possessing, the Most High, saying: ‘Lo! The Father is come, and that which ye were promised in the Kingdom is fulfilled!…’”
Proclamation of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 84-85
“Ye make mention of Me, and know Me not. Ye call upon Me, and are heedless of My Revelation…. O people of the Gospel! They who were not in the Kingdom have now entered it, whilst We behold you, in this day, tarrying at the gate. Rend the veils asunder by the power of your Lord, the Almighty, the All-Bounteous, and enter, then, in My name My Kingdom. Thus biddeth you He Who desireth for you everlasting life…”
Proclamation of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 91
“WE, verily, have come for your sakes, and have borne the misfortunes of the world for your salvation. Flee ye the One Who hath sacrificed His life that ye may be quickened? Fear God, O followers of the Spirit (Jesus), and walk not in the footsteps of every divine that hath gone far astray… Open the doors of your hearts. He Who is the Spirit (Jesus) verily, standeth before them.”
Proclamation of Bahá’u’lláh, p, 92
“O CONCOURSE of priests! Leave the bells, and come forth, then, from your churches. It behoveth you, in this day, to proclaim aloud the Most Great Name among the nations. Prefer ye to be silent, whilst every stone and every tree shouteth aloud: ‘The Lord is come in His great glory!’” \
Proclamation of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 94
“O kings of Christendom! Heard ye not the saying of Jesus, the Spirit of God, “I go away, and come again unto you”? Wherefore, then, did ye fail, when He did come again unto you in the clouds of heaven, to draw nigh unto Him, that ye might behold His face, and be of them that attained His Presence? In another passage He saith: “When He, the Spirit of Truth, is come, He will guide you into all truth. And yet, behold how, when He did bring the truth, ye refused to turn your faces towards Him, and persisted in disporting yourselves with your pastimes and fancies. Ye welcomed Him not, neither did ye seek His Presence, that ye might hear the verses of God from His own mouth, and partake of the manifold wisdom of the Almighty, the All-Glorious, the All-Wise.”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 246
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
“From the beginning of the world until the present time each ‘Manifestation’ 1 sent from God has been opposed by an embodiment of the ‘Powers of Darkness’.
This dark power has always endeavoured to extinguish the light. Tyranny has ever sought to overcome justice. Ignorance has persistently tried to trample knowledge underfoot. This has, from the earliest ages, been the method of the material world.
In the time of Moses, Pharaoh set himself to prevent the Mosaic Light being spread abroad.
In the day of Christ, Annas and Caiaphas inflamed the Jewish people against Him and the learned doctors of Israel joined together to resist His Power. All sorts of calumnies were circulated against Him. The Scribes and Pharisees conspired to make the people believe Him to be a liar, an apostate, and a blasphemer. They spread these slanders throughout the whole Eastern world against Christ, and caused Him to be condemned to a shameful death!
In the case of Muhammad also, the learned doctors of His day determined to extinguish the light of His influence. They tried by the power of the sword to prevent the spread of His teaching.
In spite of all their efforts the Sun of Truth shone forth from the horizon. In every case the army of light vanquished the powers of darkness on the battlefield of the world, and the radiance of the Divine Teaching illumined the earth. Those who accepted the Teaching and worked for the Cause of God became luminous stars in the sky of humanity.
Now, in our own day, history repeats itself.
Those who would have men believe that religion is their own private property once more bring their efforts to bear against the Sun of Truth: they resist the Command of God; they invent calumnies, not having arguments against it, neither proofs. They attack with masked faces, not daring to come forth into the light of day.
Our methods are different, we do not attack, neither calumniate; we do not wish to dispute with them; we bring forth proofs and arguments; we invite them to confute our statements. They cannot answer us, but instead, they write all they can think of against the Divine Messenger, Bahá’u’lláh.
Do not let your hearts be troubled by these defamatory writings! Obey the words of Bahá’u’lláh and answer them not. Rejoice, rather, that even these falsehoods will result in the spread of the truth. When these slanders appear inquiries are made, and those who inquire are led into a knowledge of the Faith………………….
This is the result of the slanderer’s work: to be the cause of guiding men to a discovery of the truth.
We know that all the falsehoods spread about Christ and His apostles and all the books written against Him, only led the people to inquire into His doctrine; then, having seen the beauty and inhaled the fragrance, they walked evermore amidst the roses and the fruits of that celestial garden.
Therefore, I say unto you, spread the Divine Truth with all your might that men’s intelligence may become enlightened; this is the best answer to those who slander. I do not wish to speak of those people nor to say anything ill of them—only to tell you that slander is of no importance!
Clouds may veil the sun, but, be they never so dense, his rays will penetrate! Nothing can prevent the radiance of the sun descending to warm and vivify the Divine Garden.
Nothing can prevent the fall of the rain from Heaven.
Nothing can prevent the fulfilment of the Word of God!
Therefore when you see books and papers written against the Revelation, be not distressed, but take comfort in the assurance that the cause will thereby gain strength.
No one casts stones at a tree without fruit. No one tries to extinguish a lamp without light! ………….
And I say unto you that no calumny is able to prevail against the Light of God; it can only result in causing it to be more universally recognized. If a cause were of no significance, who would take the trouble to work against it!
But always the greater the cause the more do enemies arise in larger and larger numbers to attempt its overthrow! The brighter the light the darker the shadow! Our part it is to act in accordance with the teaching of Bahá’u’lláh in humility and firm steadfastness.”
Paris Talks, pp. 102-106
They opened threads up for conversation. One cannot discredit something that is true.
It already has. Jesus is not going to return, EVER. It is about time people were told the truth. They deserve to know.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
But you do not have Jesus walking the earth again, and you never will.
Of course, since you have the Bible, you should know that:
John 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.
John 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.
John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.
John 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
There is enough evidence to sink a ship.
Jesus was not God in the flesh. God cannot become a man. That was a false doctrine invented by the Church. Time will tell. In the future everyone will know who Baha’u’llah was, I mean everybody. It won’t be like Christianity who after over 2000 years still only has 33% of the world population.
Baha’u’llah did not need the Bible to substantiate Himself. He received His Own Revelation from God.Baha’is do not even refer to the Bible unless we are talking to Christians because they won’t talk any other language. Baha’is were formerly from all the world religions; Hindus, Buddhists, Zoroastrians, Jews, Muslims, and only some Baha’is came from Christian backgrounds.
Baha’u’llah fulfilled all the prophecies of all the major religions, who were waiting for their Promised One to come:
“Each of the world's major religions contains Messianic prophecies.
Christianity, Judaism, Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism, the Zoroastrian religion and even the Native American religions all foretell the coming of a Promised One. Each of the Founders of these great religions either promised to personally return himself, to send another like himself or in some instances.... the Founder promised to do both.......
or centuries, people from all over the world have been hoping and praying that they will be the generation which will witness the appearance of their Promised One. Not many have considered the possibility that these prophecies from the various religions might actually all be foretelling the exact same event.
Members of the Baha'i Faith believe that in the middle of the last century these prophecies actually were fulfilled and that the Promised One truly did appear.
Baha'u'llah, the Prophet founder of the Baha'i Faith, claims to be the Promised One whose coming was explicitly foretold, not only in the Old and the New Testaments.... but also in the prophecies of the Hindu, Buddhist, Zoroastrian, Islamic and other religions.
If Baha'u'llah truly is the Promised One then His appearance is one of the greatest events of human history. Are Baha'u'llah's claim true? How can we know for certain? Just take a look at some of the proofs and prophecies... and then decide for yourself.”
Prophecy Fulfilled Webpage
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Sorry, but you are wrong. Baha’u’llah was the Comforter/Spirit of truth. This is one of the biggest mistakes Christians ever made because it resulted in a misinterpretation of John 14, 15 and 16. The Holy Spirit did come upon those who believed in Jesus at Pentecost, but it came upon Baha’u’llah later. God is not limited in how many times He can send the Holy Spirit. There is no shortage.
Arrogance does not apply to Manifestations of God because they are not ordinary men. They speak for God, so they have to speak with great authority. Jesus also did this.
There is enough evidence to sink a ship. You just cannot SEE IT because you are blinded by your misinterpretation of the Bible. I have been down this road many times before with other Christians. It is always the same…. “the Bible says…” What is arrogant is to insist only you know how to interpret the Bible correctly. Baha’is do not NEED the Bible. We have the Writings of Baha’u’llah. Those and what Baha’u’llah DID on His mission are the greatest proof of who He was. We only refer the Bible because Christians won’t LOOK at anything else.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
There is only one man called Jesus Christ but there is more than one Christ Spirit.
More misinterpretation of the Bible…
Famous last words…. “it’s not in the Bible.” The return of Jesus in the Person of Baha’u’llah is all throughout the Bible, OT and NT:Trailblazer said: Show me anything corrupt or evil that Baha'u'llah wrote or did.
I can show you a helluva lot of corrupt and evil fruit that came from Christianity. That was not the fault of Jesus though...
Bahaullah could write anything he wants but that does not mean he is the Christ that would come. NOT in the Bible meaning if it's NOT in the Bible then it's fake as in FAKE NEWS.
William Sears, Thief in the Night
Besides that, you just denigrated all scriptures of all the other religions that are not based upon the Bible by calling them FAKE; Hindus, Buddhists, Muslims, etc. are all fake to you… That is Christian arrogance.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Your MISINTERPRETATION of the Bible does not prove anything… The Bible proves that Baha’u’llah was the return of Christ and it does a darn good job: William Sears, Thief in the Night
Good luck trying to disprove all those prophecies.
All you have is a “hope” that Jesus will return someday. It might make you feel all warm and fuzzy on a cold winter night but that is all it will do.