Christ is not some "hippy"

[Guitar's Cry]

Hence the phrase, "God fearing Christian".

"God fearing Christians" are really just scared of their own shadow, don't you think?

 

[doppelganger]

"God fearing Christians" are really just scared of the own shadow, don't you think?

And their parents' shadow.

 

[lilithu]

Hence the phrase, "God fearing Christian".

And what a sad phrase it is.

I much prefer "God loving" myself.

 

[Jordan St. Francis]

"God fearing Christians" are really just scared of their own shadow, don't you think?

I think that's foolish, as Scripture says, "fear of the Lord is the root of wisdom". The OP is not wholly off the biblical message. I think he's responding to a real tendency within, especially, liberal Christianity to forget the reality of impending judgement.

There are false and distorted ways to fear God, but if we approach God forgetting not only our finitude, but especially our sinfullness, the image of man becomes distorted by pride and we find ourselves retracing the error of Babel. Fear of the Lord is a virtue which underscores the truth of a human nature that is intrinsically corrupt, a fear which, at the same time, is absolutely neccessary in order to acquire the real awe commanded by the mystery of grace and God's over-abundant mercy.

 

[lilithu]

I think that's foolish, as Scripture says, "fear of the Lord is the root of wisdom".

I'd like to know what the Hebrew word is here that gets translated into "fear" and whether it means the same thing as "fear" does in modern English.

I think he's responding to a real tendency within, especially, liberal Christianity to forget the reality of impending judgement.

Is it a tendency to forget? Or an outright rejection?

Granted that I do not consider myself to be Christian, but my spiritual ancestors were. And both the Unitarians and the Universalists rejected the notion that anyone was going to "eternal damnation." No just God would punish a finite creature with infinite damnation. The doctrine is illogical.

 

[Jordan St. Francis]

Is it a tendency to forget? Or an outright rejection?

Either or, to forget or to reject it is to do violence to the Christian message, whose hope is illuminated only when it is set beside the doctrine of sin and its final rooting out of the earth. The judgment of God means both the total goodness of God and the real freedom of humanity.

But the day of the Lord will come like a thief. The heavens will disappear with a roar; the elements will be destroyed by fire, and the earth and everything in it will be laid bare.[a] 11Since everything will be destroyed in this way, what kind of people ought you to be? You ought to live holy and godly lives 12as you look forward to the day of God and speed its coming.[b]That day will bring about the destruction of the heavens by fire, and the elements will melt in the heat.
2 Peter 3

Beyond the question of what damnation consists of (whether it is eternal or a snuffing out of one's existence), it is a very visible New Testament theme.

Christ is coming back "on the clouds of heaven" to rule as king, but first to act as judge where he will separate the sheep from the goats, where the "beggars, prostitutes and tax collectors" will enter the Kingdom of God before many who expect to be first and many will be left out in the cold where there will be "weeping and gnashing of teeth".

It is certainly not an occasion for self righteousness, but if Christians forget that this world is passing away, then they are forgetting the Gospel. Neither can we be under the illusion that we do not have the power to make choices of a final consequence- it is possible to reject God and so completely lose out on his grace.

The Church has always understood itself to be the "community of the last days". It bears the message of the end of history, the idea of Christ's Second Coming and the subsequent judgment is essential to Christianity. But judgment also means justice- it means the rooting out of evil and the reception of a new heaven and new earth where "righteousness is at home". So it is also a cause for hope, this is why the author of Revelation prays "come Lord Jesus".

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I don't see why I should worship a god who should be feared either. If I should be afraid of God, then why should I kneel before him? IMO, it's better to stand against fear and not cower.

I'd like to know what the Hebrew word is here that gets translated into "fear" and whether it means the same thing as "fear" does in modern English.

While I do not know the original word, I do know it is closer to meaning "respect" than "fear." If the translation was more accurate, it certainly would make the OT God seem more friendly. Not much friendlier, but when you have that much blood on your hands, any start is a good one.

 

[Quagmire]

The OP brought up Mark 10. I just want to point out something about the rest of this passage;

10:34"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35 For I have come to turn
" 'a man against his father,
a daughter against her mother,
a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law -
36a man's enemies will be the members of his own household.'[d

This is exactly what happened during the Peace Movement of the 60's, as well as the Civil Rights movement and the Enviromental Movement--basically everything the Hippies were involved in.

Jesus was a hippy any way you look at it.

In an culture rooted in denial the truth is indeed a sword (it cuts through the you know what).

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Jesus was a hippy any way you look at it.

How could you pose like this and not be a hippy?

 

[Quagmire]

How could you pose like this and not be a hippy?

I always thought that his right hand looks like it's passing the *cough* *cough*

 

[tomspug]

Go read John 3:17, then get back to me about this whole "Christ came to judge" idea...

 

[lilithu]

O my Lord, if I worship Thee from fear of Hell, burn me in Hell, and if I worship Thee in hope of Paradise, exclude me thence, but if I worship Thee for Thine own sake withhold not from me Thine eternal beauty.

I've probably quoted this prayer 20 times now on RF and yet it continues to be relevant, thread after thread.

I absolutely reject your God of fear. Not only is that an incredibly sad way to live but it's illogical to think that God wants a bunch of followers who only "love" due to fear of punishment (or hope of reward). That is not love. Christian, Jew, or Muslim, there have always been those who worship out of fear AND there have always been those who know better.

 

[Jordan St. Francis]

I think this prayer rings true as to what a Christian attitude should be, even if it contains a little hyperbole. Fear of the Lord, in the Christian and Jewish (and therefore probably Islamic) sense does not mean that our relationship with God should be founded on fear of hell.

Fear of the Lord means we have a proper sense of who and what we are before God- that we are finite and created and most of all that we are sinners. It is because we know that we are stained by sin that the touch of his grace is seen as so very gracious. It is because we have realized that we are down in the pit of ourselves that we now know to look up towards Him who rescues us.

Fear of the Lord does not mean an obsession with damnation, it means founding the relationship between a person and God upon humility and gratitude. It is approaching God with the proper disposition:

...When Simon Peter saw this, he fell at Jesus' knees and said, "Go away from me, Lord; I am a sinful man!"
...Then Jesus said to Simon, "Don't be afraid; from now on you will catch men." So they pulled their boats up on shore, left everything and followed him.

Luke Chapter 5

 

[Guitar's Cry]

I think that's foolish, as Scripture says, "fear of the Lord is the root of wisdom". The OP is not wholly off the biblical message. I think he's responding to a real tendency within, especially, liberal Christianity to forget the reality of impending judgement.

There are false and distorted ways to fear God, but if we approach God forgetting not only our finitude, but especially our sinfullness, the image of man becomes distorted by pride and we find ourselves retracing the error of Babel. Fear of the Lord is a virtue which underscores the truth of a human nature that is intrinsically corrupt, a fear which, at the same time, is absolutely neccessary in order to acquire the real awe commanded by the mystery of grace and God's over-abundant mercy.

Sorry, you may have misunderstood me. The shadow metaphor was meant to imply what a person's relationship with God reflects about them.

A person's view of God could represent how they experience reality; a loving God may imply a desire for peace. A frightful God may imply a desire for justice. A "God-fearing" Christian is afraid of their own shadow because it reflects their inner world.

 

[FFH]

Originally Posted by SolaScriptura
Christ says to judge someone, but not to do so as a hypocrite, he still tells you to judge however.

Where?

Lev. 19: 15
Ye shall do no unrighteousness in judgement: thou shalt not respect the person of the poor, nor honour the person of the mighty: but in righteousness shalt thou judge thy neighbour.

John 7: 24
Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.

 

[FFH]

Matt. 10: 36
And a man’s foes shall be they of his own household.

 

[Reverend Rick]

Since when did it become out of style to be God fearing?

 

[Guitar's Cry]

Since when did it become out of style to be God fearing?

Since the 60s.

 

[lilithu]

Since when did it become out of style to be God fearing?

Since the 60s.

1860s. :angel2:

 

[blackout]

Y'shua was a societal rebel.

A TRUE hippie.