Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
Love exists but it is not a being. Machines exist but are not beings. The wind exists but it has no preferences. I see your logic doesn't work if you are cold and tired. Thanks for talking to me.
If you had not insulted me I might have given you a frubal.
ok, i'll play
Evidence that Jesus did not celebrate his birth is seen from the fact that the gospels do not tell us his age. When the gospels begin, they say "Jesus was 'about the age of" but we dont get a definite age. If the jews back then were celebratiing birthdays, then we'd surely know how old Jesus actually was.
But secondly, all the customs and religious practices that Jesus participated in are laid out in the mosaic law. Not one of those customs are for birthday celebrations. Why? Because the Isrealites were told that they were not to participate in the religious customs of the nations around them.
EG, Exodus 34:11 Pay attention to what I am commanding you today. Here I am driving out from before you the Am′or·ites, the Ca′naan·ites, the Hit′tites, the Per′iz·zites, the Hi′vites, and the Jeb′u·sites. 12 Be careful that you do not make a covenant with the inhabitants of the land to which you are going, or it may prove to be a snare among you. 13 But you are to pull down their altars, you are to shatter their sacred pillars, and their sacred poles you are to cut down. 14 You must not bow down to another god, for Jehovah is known for requiring exclusive devotion. Yes, he is a God who requires exclusive devotion. 15 Be careful not to make a covenant with the inhabitants of the land, because when they prostitute themselves to their gods and sacrifice to their gods, someone will invite you and you will eat from his sacrifice.
The birthday was a pagan religious ceremony. Thats its history. And all such pagan religious customs were forbidden to Isreal
The passage you have quoted speaks about the other gods and idolatrous practices of the inhabitants in the land where God was sending the children of Israel and He warned them not to make a covenant with them. Instead of becoming involved in their idolatry the Israelites were to tear down the altars, shatter the sacred pillars, and cut down the sacred poles. It directly addresses the worship of false gods and idols. It says nothing about birthdays and is not about birthdays at all.
I think it is bad biblical interpretation to make a doctrine based on silence in the scriptures or by misusing verses to support such teachings when the passage(s) are about an entirely different subject and it is a very dangerous way for an organization to make rules which impact the lives of its members. God gave over 600 detailed laws under the Mosaic Covenant, if birthdays were wrong and to be forbidden it seems this would have been included.
I don't see any biblical support for the teaching against birthdays, but instead believe the prohibition of the Watchtower against celebrating birthdays as one way of isolating its members from non-JW family, friends and others in general.
All pagan religions are, are taking the footprints, hints and signs that God places within creation and within the heart of man (ex. the beauty and diversity of creation, the beauty that is the gift of life, the yearning for the divine, conscience, reason, the intuitive knowledge that there is life after death and a judging of the dead [the Zoroastrians were even the first ones to postulate the resurrection of the dead, the Last Judgement, the Messiah and the World to Come, even before the Jews]), taking all these God-given intuitions and signs, and trying to make sense of them by ourselves. Oftentimes they were sincere in their efforts but were simply misguided, and at other times, were misled by demons.
I guess I just don't see either God wanting to micro-manage our lives and I definitely don't see the Bible as a tool for doing so. Those scriptures don't refer to the celebration of birthdays, per se, but they certainly do seem to imply to me that God is displeased by our judging one another on matters such as food, drink, celebrations, etc. I personally believe God's focus is far more on the spirit of the law than on the letter of the law. I have no problem whatsoever with JWs not celebrating birthdays. As a matter of fact, if their collective consciences tell them this is something they shouldn't be doing, then I admire them for their convictions. I'd just appreciate the same respect given to my choices in return. The Bible spells out certain commandments so specifically that it's next to impossible to interpret them in a variety of ways. The celebration of birthdays is a matter that I believe should best be left to one's own conscience. I find all of the intended guilt-trips and name-calling being directed at non-JWs on this thread to be pretty darned disgusting. This is what I think Savagewind's scriptural examples were all about.
I did not claim to not know demons exist. I think demonic power does not come from beings possesing personality. Personality is needed for preferences as in love and hate. Something with no personality cannot love or hate. I do not believe in satan as a personality as many people do. I am not aware of scripture that says "the person of Satan". Are you? Is Satan a person who is able to love or to hate? I do not think so. Do you?
So what's JW worship look like? From what I've seen, JW services basically consist of a few songs, opening prayer, and most of the time is spent on a Bible study, then maybe a song or two and a prayer to close out. Do the JW's do anything else to worship God as a community?
There's more than just marriage that can be found in the pagan pre-Christian religions. There's also giving sacrifice and repentance, reading and contemplation of scriptures, being selfless and loving, being just, helping the oppressed, seeking righteousness, protecting others, seeking harmony between oneself, the world and the divine, worshipping the divine, meditation and clearing one's mind, practicing discernment, meditation, obeying and respecting and taking care of one's elders, offering prayers and communing with the divine, worshipping and glorifying the divine, recognizing the beauty in creation, acknowledging and accepting the will of the divine in unforeseen circumstances, submitting oneself to the divine, standing vigil in prayer, fasting...
Galatians 2:16 know that a person is not justified by the works of the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law, because by the works of the law no one will be justified.
