Commandments by Christ.

[sojourner]

sigh, God's love is divine, but it is not unconditional. What scripture ever claimed God's love to be unconditional?

Divine Love - Liahona Feb. 2003 - liahona

I Cor. 13: Love does not insist on its own way...

 

[Flat Earth Kyle]

I Cor. 13: Love does not insist on its own way...

What part of that said God's love is unconditional?
I got the message on Charity...

What part of Matthew 22:1-14 shows the unconditional love of God?

1 And Jesus answered and spake unto them again by parables, and said,
2 The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made a marriage for his son,
3 And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come.
4 Again, he sent forth other servants, saying, Tell them which are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriage.
5 But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise:
6 And the remnant took his servants, and entreated them spitefully, and slew them.
7 But when the king heard thereof, he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city.
8 Then saith he to his servants, The wedding is ready, but they which were bidden were not worthy.
9 Go ye therefore into the highways, and as many as ye shall find, bid to the marriage.
10 So those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together all as many as they found, both bad and good: and the wedding was furnished with guests.
11 ¶And when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man which had not on a wedding garment:
12 And he saith unto him, Friend, how camest thou in hither not having a wedding garment? And he was speechless.
13 Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
14 For many are called, but few are chosen.

 

[sojourner]

What part of that said God's love is unconditional?
I got the message on Charity...

What part of Matthew 22:1-14 shows the unconditional love of God?

1 And Jesus answered and spake unto them again by parables, and said,
2 The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made a marriage for his son,
3 And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come.
4 Again, he sent forth other servants, saying, Tell them which are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriage.
5 But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise:
6 And the remnant took his servants, and entreated them spitefully, and slew them.
7 But when the king heard thereof, he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city.
8 Then saith he to his servants, The wedding is ready, but they which were bidden were not worthy.
9 Go ye therefore into the highways, and as many as ye shall find, bid to the marriage.
10 So those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together all as many as they found, both bad and good: and the wedding was furnished with guests.
11 ¶And when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man which had not on a wedding garment:
12 And he saith unto him, Friend, how camest thou in hither not having a wedding garment? And he was speechless.
13 Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
14 For many are called, but few are chosen.

"Love insisting on its own way" is like saying, "I love you if..." It's placing a condition upon which love is extended.

In your second example, unconditional love was extended by the king in inviting all to come. That love was not returned when the one showed up unprepared to enter into the offered relationship.

Love is a reciprocal relationship.

 

[Flat Earth Kyle]

"Love insisting on its own way" is like saying, "I love you if..." It's placing a condition upon which love is extended.

In your second example, unconditional love was extended by the king in inviting all to come. That love was not returned when the one showed up unprepared to enter into the offered relationship.

Love is a reciprocal relationship.

It was offered, but when it did not meet the "expectations" bad guys get destroyed and the guy not being properly dressed gets cast out into outer darkness... Those sound like some pretty serious expectations and consequences.

 

[Flat Earth Kyle]

What exactly is a commandment? An expectation.

 

[sojourner]

It was offered, but when it did not meet the "expectations" bad guys get destroyed and the guy not being properly dressed gets cast out into outer darkness... Those sound like some pretty serious expectations and consequences.

the guy didn't show up to participate in the relationship. he showed up to mooch. That's not returning love for love. When he decides to participate, he'll get back in.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

So we have named a few commandments... now what?

Keep them.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

Let me repeat, Jesus commands us to listen to the Pharisees.

Let me me repeat, us or the Jewish people?

 

[Shermana]

Let me me repeat, us or the Jewish people?

The Jewish people were his audience, so does this mean then that all of Jesus's other commandments are only for the Jewish people?

How do you pick and choose which commandments and teachings do not apply to you non Jews?

 

[Flat Earth Kyle]

Keep them.

Well yeah I know that, but was that your only point you were trying to make?
Not saying it is a bad one. It is hard to keep a commandment you don't acknowledge as a commandment.

 

[Shermana]

Well yeah I know that, but was that your only point you were trying to make?
Not saying it is a bad one. It is hard to keep a commandment you don't acknowledge as a commandment.

Or a commandment that's acknowledged as only for the Jews. I wonder how they decide which ones are for Jews alone and which ones are for everyone.

 

[Flat Earth Kyle]

Or a commandment that's acknowledged as only for the Jews. I wonder how they decide which ones are for Jews alone and which ones are for everyone.

Are you claiming that the non-violence commandment was meant only for the Jews?

 

[Shermana]

Are you claiming that the non-violence commandment was meant only for the Jews?

Not at all. I'm claiming that I brought up that Jesus commanded his listeners to listen and obey everything the Pharisees said since they sat in the Seat of Moses, just to avoid their hypocritical disobedience to their own teachings and their insincere hearts. This was then rebutted as a "commandment only for the Jews".

So accordingly, as you mention, one could ask this person how he determines that the non-violent-reaction commandment is meant for everyone and just for his all-Jewish audience either.

This "only for the Jews" rebuttal is quite a common reply to asking about teachings of Jesus, but it seems to be quite arbitrary and without any clear definition as to what is proscribed for Jews alone and what is not. It's a nice way to pick and choose what is convenient, but without any actual structure.

 

[Flat Earth Kyle]

Not at all. I'm claiming that I brought up that Jesus commanded his listeners to listen and obey everything the Pharisees said since they sat in the Seat of Moses, just to avoid their hypocritical disobedience to their own teachings and their insincere hearts. This was then rebutted as a "commandment only for the Jews".

So accordingly, as you mention, one could ask this person how he determines that the non-violent-reaction commandment is meant for everyone and just for his all-Jewish audience either.

This "only for the Jews" rebuttal is quite a common reply to asking about teachings of Jesus, but it seems to be quite arbitrary and without any clear definition as to what is proscribed for Jews alone and what is not. It's a nice way to pick and choose what is convenient, but without any actual structure.

So your question here is, who was Jesus's audience, was he speaking to and commanding only the jews or was he intending his sermon on the mount to be taught and followed by all humanity forever?

 

[Shermana]

So your question here is, who was Jesus's audience, was he speaking to and commanding only the jews or was he intending his sermon on the mount to be taught and followed by all humanity forever?

Yes, that's technically my question, but it's a rhetorical question since I don't believe it ONLY applies to Jews and not gentiles, which is why I was rebutting that statement. I do believe that it was meant to be followed by whatever humanity decided to accept that he was The Messiah and would thus adapt to become a convert to the House of Israel, of whom Jesus came alone for.

So on one hand, Jesus DID say that he only came for the "Lost Sheep of the House of Israel", and many gentile Christians if not nearly all believe that they are now part of this "Lost sheep of the House of Israel", yet they believe there are different rules for them than the Israelite "House of Israel". Doesn't make sense, which is why they use Paul and not Jesus to explain their ideas, but that's for another thread since this is only about the commandments of Jesus.

You'd be surprised just how many Christians use this reasoning to get out of any inconvenient teaching of Jesus, that it was "just for the Jews", and if that one doesn't work, that any teaching they don't like was "Nailed to the cross".

 

[Flat Earth Kyle]

It is quite unfortunate isn't it.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

The Jewish people were his audience, so does this mean then that all of Jesus's other commandments are only for the Jewish people?

How do you pick and choose which commandments and teachings do not apply to you non Jews?

When Jesus speaks to a Jewish audience about Jewish Law while that Law is in effect then I suppose it's fairly specific.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

Well yeah I know that, but was that your only point you were trying to make?
Not saying it is a bad one. It is hard to keep a commandment you don't acknowledge as a commandment.

I stated along the way that this is directed at those who feel that only the statements by Jesus are important and who believe we should follow the Law. I'm looking to see how those people justify it from the sayings attributed to Him.

 

[Shermana]

When Jesus speaks to a Jewish audience about Jewish Law while that Law is in effect then I suppose it's fairly specific.

So in that case, the entire Sermon on the Mount is only for Jews too, since he's clarifying aspects of the Mosaic Law?

I wonder how you interpret "I have only come for the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel".

 

[Flat Earth Kyle]

So in that case, the entire Sermon on the Mount is only for Jews too, since he's clarifying aspects of the Mosaic Law?

I wonder how you interpret "I have only come for the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel".

what about, "Other sheep I have which are not of this fold, them also I must bring and they shall hear my voice and there shall be one fold and one shepherd."