Common ground.

[Spirit of Light]

I generally get along pretty well with the atheists on this forum. The majority of my friends are also atheists.

My secret to success is that I really don't give a damn whether or not they believe in my gods. I have absolutely no interest in converting them. I also don't believe that being an atheist makes somebody stupid, immoral or deceived.

If an atheist is willing to treat me the same way, we're probably not going to have an issue as far as religion goes.

That is a wise reply

 

[Spirit of Light]

Yes, but your version is not the only one. That is where it ends. My version is also not the only one. So how do we compromise?

Of course my version is not the only one. The version i lookibg for is for me.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Of course my version is not the only one. The version i lookibg for is for me.

Yes, and you still act according to that one in regards to other humans. I do the same for my version. That is where it gets tricky. Not how we as individuals act in regards to ourselves, but how we act towards the other.

 

[Spirit of Light]

Yes, and you still act according to that one in regards to other humans. I do the same for my version. That is where it gets tricky. Not how we as individuals act in regards to ourselves, but how we act towards the other.

So there will not be a common ground then

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

So there will not be a common ground then

No, there is if we can compromise on a set of agreed common rules. That is what common ground is. It is a social construct.
Not your rules or my rules. The rules we agree on.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Thanks. She’s such a wonderful person so reconciliatory never confrontational. We joke that now she has been in my prison for 44 years!

That is East, loverofhumanity.

 

[HonestJoe]

Because I want the "fight" between faith believers and Atheists to end. I want people to live in peace and harmony

There is actually very little conflict between atheists and religious believers. Most religious conflict is between people of different faiths.

On forums like this, we're a tiny proportion of the wider population and such discussions tend to attract an unfortunate proportion of extremists and trolls (of all positions and beliefs). The discussions here aren't at all representative of what happens in the real world, even for most of us, let alone anyone else.

In the vast majority of places and situations, people of different religion's or beliefs, and certainly general non-believers, get on perfectly well. Much of the time, you'll have no idea what beliefs people you interact with on a daily basis even hold. And as you said yourself, it is the committed believers for whom their faith is the primary focus of their lives and so it is they who bring it in to those secular interactions and thus create potential conflict.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Example. Russia needs to see Ukrainians as fellow human beings not Ukrainians.

US too needs to see Russia as Russians and not as a enemy of their grouping, NATO. NATO could have been scaled down and Russia added to G-7.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Then I can leave RF for Good. God is a part of me, that's why I am in RF

That is the root cause of problems. You cannot leave God. If you cannot leave talking about God and his messages, then we atheist cannot stop asking you for evidence of your God and his messengers. That is known as 'status-quo'. Back to where we started.

 

[Heyo]

US too needs to see Russia as Russians and not as a enemy of their grouping, NATO. NATO could have been scaled down and Russia added to G-7.

G-7 was once G-8. And then Russia annexed Crimea.

 

[Aupmanyav]

.. but I think until the conscience of the world has been stirred enough nothing much will be done apart from verbal condemnations.

What will stir that? Kitab-i-Aqdas?

And finally we all agree to the rules of the site and the right of the mods to enforce the rules.

Ah, the militia!

Because words are evil, even truthful ones.

And there is no hurt equal to those caused by truthful words.

So how do we compromise?

Perhaps by saying that we really do not know other than what we have heard; for example, that so-and-so was a so-and-so of God.

 

[PureX]

How can believers and atheists find common ground to be able to say.

You know, I see you as a human being, no matter if you believe in a religion or not.
I want to know you as a person, but if you believe or not, that is your private choice.

I can love you for just being you.

All it takes is the willingness to make that choice.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

There is actually very little conflict between atheists and religious believers. Most religious conflict is between people of different faiths.

On forums like this, we're a tiny proportion of the wider population and such discussions tend to attract an unfortunate proportion of extremists and trolls (of all positions and beliefs). The discussions here aren't at all representative of what happens in the real world, even for most of us, let alone anyone else.

In the vast majority of places and situations, people of different religion's or beliefs, and certainly general non-believers, get on perfectly well. Much of the time, you'll have no idea what beliefs people you interact with on a daily basis even hold. And as you said yourself, it is the committed believers for whom their faith is the primary focus of their lives and so it is they who bring it in to those secular interactions and thus create potential conflict.

Well, all conflicts are about different worldviews and religious people are not the only ones with worldviews.

 

[Spirit of Light]

That is the root cause of problems. You cannot leave God. If you cannot leave talking about God and his messages, then we atheist cannot stop asking you for evidence of your God and his messengers. That is known as 'status-quo'. Back to where we started.

If I could prove God exists it would not be a belief or faith anymore

 

[HonestJoe]

Well, all conflicts are about different worldviews and religious people are not the only ones with worldviews.

Sure, but atheism doesn't describe a worldview, it's just an individual belief. It can form part of loads of different worldviews (even religious-based ones) but even then, it's rarely the core basis. Most conflict in this context isn't even about fundamental beliefs but about the religious actions and practices based upon them (after all, a lot of religious conflict is between people with very similar underlying beliefs and is based on details of interpretation or practice).

The point is that religious based conflicts are typically between different religions people rather than people of a religion and general non-believers. We can all be involved in conflicts on other socio-political bases too, but that is somewhat distinct from the OP point.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Sure, but atheism doesn't describe a worldview, it's just an individual belief. It can form part of loads of different worldviews (even religious-based ones) but even then, it's rarely the core basis. Most conflict in this context isn't even about fundamental beliefs but about the religious actions and practices based upon them (after all, a lot of religious conflict is between people with very similar underlying beliefs and is based on details of interpretation or practice).

The point is that religious based conflicts are typically between different religions people rather than people of a religion and general non-believers. We can all be involved in conflicts on other socio-political bases too, but that is somewhat distinct from the OP point.

Yeah, most atheists in effect fight over reason, logic and evidence, but that is not one worldview but many different ones.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

If I could prove God exists it would not be a belief or faith anymore

Yeah, and if I could prove that God doesn't exist...

But neither have been for over 2400+ years we have been at that.
So the common is not about God nor no God. That is where it gets tricky.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

How can believers and atheists find common ground to be able to say.

You know, I see you as a human being, no matter if you believe in a religion or not.
I want to know you as a person, but if you believe or not, that is your private choice.

I can love you for just being you.

Easily. Some of the people I'm absolutely closest to in the world are religious. Despite that, they treat others well.
And I'm a dirty heathen, but despite that treat people well.

And we recognise that in each other, support each other, trust each other and laugh together. It's exactly as complicated as you want to make it.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

You are probably right about that, since in modern society most people are more concerned about material things and physical pleasures.

Way to turn a statement of shared humanity into a slap for the secular world there...

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

You are probably right about that, since in modern society most people are more concerned about material things and physical pleasures.

Yeah, you judge other humans. Now please evidence as that is not about your opinion. It is about the fact how other people live.