Comparing the Bible to the Qur'an.

[stevecanuck]

I would say that religion as religion is not the problem ...

That is exactly what the vast majority of the Western world does not understand about Islam. It IS very much the problem. The phrase "Those Who Can Make You Believe Absurdities Can Make You Commit Atrocities" must have been coined by someone who had just read the Qur'an.

 

[stevecanuck]

Most of the Quran is reflective philosophy. Even in the stories, the way it does, it says it but then philosophically reflects over the issue.

There is not one shred of philosophy in the Qur'an (my opinion - feel free to disagree).

It does not have all the detailed stories of the Bible,

But it does refer to them dozens of times.

but if it did, and that was it's style, it would be mostly copy paste with some corrections right? Then we would never hear the end of it of how it copied the Bible.

Much of the Meccan surahs are a rehash of the OT. How many times do we really need to hear about Moses? It wasn't until Mohamed went to Yathrib that the Qur'an began to reshape Islam into a warrior religion.

 

[stevecanuck]

I believe I am saying the news is real to us now while the books are not but the Bible reflects current reality better than the Qu'ran.

The Qur'an is responsible for creating much of current reality. Every single woman who is forced to wear a tent - every terrorist action 'in the cause of Allah' occurs because of that book.

 

[Link]

There is not one shred of philosophy in the Qur'an (my opinion - feel free to disagree).

This is why you don't understand. It's primarily guiding philisophically.

 

[Dimi95]

That is exactly what the vast majority of the Western world does not understand about Islam. It IS very much the problem. The phrase "Those Who Can Make You Believe Absurdities Can Make You Commit Atrocities" must have been coined by someone who had just read the Qur'an.

It could be , but that's why it is so challenged from the West.

From People that are not that majority and understand some things.

We talk about cultural differences..

The opportunity to speak freally , we question things more widely.
They are limited when we speak on that matter.

That's why sometimes the reasonable for them is unreasonable.

 

[stevecanuck]

This is why you don't understand. It's primarily guiding philisophically.

Your opinion.

I understand Islam's us-vs-them philosophy all too well.

 

[ChristineM]

Because when there are more with similar values at least, the chance to opose is greater.

More chance of massacre.

Why is the nessecity to think something is inferior when it's good?

Good to you may not be good to someone else. For example, i find some of the teaching's of Christianity to not be good.

What do we actaully seek?

A comfortable life doing the best we can

 

[Dimi95]

More chance of massacre.




Good to you may not be good to someone else. For example, i find some of the teaching's of Christianity to not be good.



A comfortable life doing the best we can

Yes , but we chose that or submission.
You will allow yourself to live in dictatorship?
I will always chose to opose the bad , no matter the circumstences.
Will that make me naive ? Yes , probobly , but it won't change my honesty and what i stand for..

I can use the same argument , but it won't have the same meaning,because i will firstly try to agree , then to disagree.
Is the bad so bad , that you forget all the good?


Me to.

 

[ChristineM]

Yes , but we chose that or submission.
You will allow yourself to live in dictatorship?
I will always chose to opose the bad , no matter the circumstences.
Will that make me naive ? Yes , probobly , but it won't change my honesty and what i stand for..

I can use the same argument , but it won't have the same meaning,because i will firstly try to agree , then to disagree.
Is the bad so bad , that you forget all the good?


Me to.

There are always other avenues.
I moved from England, one of the reasons was i didn't like the way the politics was following the American right.

Again, the goid for you may not be the good for someone else. You cannot impose your version of good on everyone else, that in itself is dictator policy.

 

[Dimi95]

Again, the goid for you may not be the good for someone else. You cannot impose your version of good on everyone else, that in itself is dictator policy.

But you miss the fact that i can use the same argument as equal.

 

[ChristineM]

But you miss the fact that i can use the same argument as equal.

Equal what? Equal meaning your argument is equal to another person's argument? Consider you and me. Your arguments are not in any way equal to mine, hence the reason we are having this discussion.

 

[Dimi95]

Equal what? Equal meaning your argument is equal to another person's argument? Consider you and me. Your arguments are not in any way equal to mine, hence the reason we are having this discussion.

You put my argument above yours , and i did not , i see it as reasonable, and i am using what you said to defend my stand but not against you.So we are equal 50%-50%

 

[ChristineM]

You put my argument above yours , and i did not , i see it as reasonable, and i am using what you said to defend my stand but not against you.So we are equal 50%-50%

Actually you did put yours about mine, you continue to believe your as i continue to believe mine.

Had you gone for equality your argument would have changed to meet mine in the middle.

 

[Dimi95]

Actually you did put yours about mine, you continue to believe your as i continue to believe mine.

Had you gone for equality your argument would have changed to meet mine in the middle.

But i accept it , i don't know why are you so insisting on that.

I accept that something is not good , but i also accept that something is good.
I face Reality..

You are consistent on attacking me , and i am consistent on defending.
But i see your attack reasonable , and you won't see mine the same.
I try more to agree,then to disagree.

 

[Dimi95]

So why not meet in the middle?

 

[ChristineM]

But i accept it , i don't know why are you so insisting on that.

I accept that something is not good , but i also accept that something is good.
I face Reality..

You are consistent on attacking me , and i am consistent on defending.
But i see your attack reasonable , and you won't see mine the same.
I try more to agree,then to disagree.

So you accept that the bible is extremely violent?

You accept the bible can be used to teach hatred against non believers?

You accept that your version of good won't work against dictators?

You accept that other people may not agree with you on that you think is good?

Yet you in no way change your position to accept these arguments. You simply say you accept them.

Of course i accept that you have your arguments. I cannot however agree with them because i know they cannot work for me.

 

[Dimi95]

So you accept that the bible is extremely violent?

You accept the bible can be used to teach hatred against non believers?

You accept that your version of good won't work against dictators?

You accept that other people may not agree with you on that you think is good?

Yet you in no way change your position to accept these arguments. You simply say you accept them.

Of course i accept that you have your arguments. I cannot however agree with them because i know they cannot work for me.

You are so consistent on proving me wrong , you take my words and you use my words to prove your understanding of the Book.
And my answers have nothing in common with your questions , because i see the Book differently , and i told you so..
And How does the Book reflect on people , it has to do with perosnal understanding.

Again, the good for you may not be the good for someone else. You cannot impose your version of good on everyone else, that in itself is dictator policy.

I agree that people seek for the violent , when the Book with it's crucial message , doesn't say so.

I accept that the Bible should be used as wisdom to gain the trust of "non-belivers"

I Accept that my version of good will be something , and that is better then nothing.

And that is totally fine , that's why we are discussing it like normal people , i tried but you refused so i steped back.
I respect your view , but please respect mine also.

I mean no harm with what i understand and what i try to tell.
Did i say something that you would assume that?
You won't see that violent in me , no metter how long you seek.

 

[Muffled]

Right, which would make such a person an unbeliever.

I believe that is false. I believe what God approves of me to believe. That makes me a believer in God and He is the one who counts.

 

[Aupmanyav]

IMHO, from Torah to Bible to Quran to Kitab-i-Aqdas to Barahin-i-Ahmadiyya are a natural progression.

 

[Muffled]

The Qur'an is responsible for creating much of current reality. Every single woman who is forced to wear a tent - every terrorist action 'in the cause of Allah' occurs because of that book.

I believe neither of those come from the Qu'ran.
Eph 5:16 making the best use of the time, because the days are evil.