Cops catch 'em, Courts jail 'em Obama turns 'em loose!

[Mindmaster]

Legalization will take the money out of drugs.
No more gang wars. No more robberies. Use the taxpayers money that gets freed up on treatment programs and fighting violence.

This is easy.
Tom

No, there will be plenty of robberies. Drug addicts have to take more and more to get their fix because they get a tolerance to the chemical. It will always be the case that they eventually exceed their income. We should spend all the money we waste on losers to give away free guns and ammo to everyone over the age of 18. I bet that'll stop some violence.

 

[columbus]

O.M.G.!!!
What is a "no victim" criminal"?

40 years ago I regularly bought a quarter pound of pot, divided it into smaller quantities, and sold it to my friends for enough profit to finance my own use.

I've since realized that I was helping finance drug gangs in Mexico. But I was not victimizing anybody. It is called Capitalism.
Tom

 

[suncowiam]

I used to believe that drug use should be legalized but after hearing an argument from Ann Coulter of all folks, I agree on her points. Some people can use drugs responsibly. I'm one of those folks. Others that get addicted and become destructive... Well, who ends up paying for their salvation and have to repair the damage done? I and other responsible citizens? Nope, not me. I'll vote for legal drug use as long as folks pay for their own recovery and damage if the worst happens.

 

[Mindmaster]

Strawman and a whole 'nuther issue for another post.

If you choose to start another thread could you include just what makes
ethanol a poison?

I think that whole comment is missing the point as well. I don't think use is the problem, I think lack of self-control is the real problem. You can hit a doobie, drink a bottle of whiskey, or even take something like cocaine once or twice in great periods and it's not going to rule your life. People who can handle it should be able to live however they want. But, we need to stop wasting resources on idiots!

 

[Demonslayer]

No, but they made that choice.

So an abuser of alcohol isn't human refuse and shouldn't be locked in jail.

But an abuser of cocaine is human refuse and should be locked in jail.

Can you explain why?

 

[Demonslayer]

Some people can use drugs responsibly. I'm one of those folks. Others that get addicted and become destructive.

But by this logic we should outlaw alcohol and tobacco. Are you in favor of that?

This is what I'm trying to point out. Nearly every medical study shows alcohol and tobacco are far worse for the human body than marijuana. Yet we throw people who sell pot in jail and give big tips to people who sell alcohol.

Why?

 

[Mindmaster]

So an abuser of alcohol isn't human refuse and shouldn't be locked in jail.

But an abuser of cocaine is human refuse and should be locked in jail.

Can you explain why?

I didn't say anything about jail, bullets are far cheaper.

I also didn't draw distinctions between the chemical addicts. They're all addicts, they're all equally worthless to society and humanity as a whole. Doesn't matter if it is crack or whisky to me.

I feel people who can control themselves should be able to live as they want, they don't need government oversight.

 

[columbus]

Strawman and a whole 'nuther issue for another post.

No, alcohol is not a strawman. It is a lesson.
Back in Prohibition days alcohol was artificially expensive and resulted in criminal gangs using violence to protect their profits and users committing crimes.
Not so much today because it is legal and regulated.
Tom

 

[Demonslayer]

Strawman and a whole 'nuther issue for another post.

If you choose to start another thread could you include just what makes
ethanol a poison?

Why is it a strawman? Alcohol is a drug. Tobacco (nicotine) is a drug. Both do undeniable damage to the body, both cause cancer. Why celebrate those and villainize things like marijuana and mushrooms?

 

[Demonslayer]

I didn't say anything about jail, bullets are far cheaper.

The OP was about letting drug addicts out of jail, I assumed by your post that you were not in favor of that action. Maybe I should be fair and back up a step...are you in favor of, or against, Obama's actions as described in the OP?

I also didn't draw distinctions between the chemical addicts. They're all addicts, they're all equally worthless to society and humanity as a whole.

You did draw distictions. In post #8 I asked you if you thought alcoholics are human refuse and in post #19 you said "No, but they made that choice." This is obviously different from your assertion in post #5 where you call drug addicts human refuse.

So the question is, why is a jittery coke addict "human refuse" and not an stinking alcoholic?

 

[Mindmaster]

Why is it a strawman? Alcohol is a drug. Tobacco (nicotine) is a drug. Both do undeniable damage to the body, both cause cancer. Why celebrate those and villainize things like marijuana and mushrooms?

Your argument is consuming itself. You are trying to draw distinctions then taking it to a hyperbole. Tobacco being legal exactly proves the point anyway, as the legality drives down the price and makes it so people won't go through trouble to get it sourced.

There are people who are mentally addicted to pot and shrooms as well. Pot is pretty damn deceptive, but basically it can just completely make you worthless to anyone else. Anyway, the toxicity and harmfulness always go hand in hand with how much exposure you receive. Pot can be safe if you are rarely taking it, and so can shrooms. If you are doing these substances in lieu of living a real life, you're an addict regardless. Welcome to the garbage bin of humanity.

 

[von bek]

If drugs were to be legalized, you would not have armed gangs enriching themselves by having a monopoly on the trade. If you rob a liquor store, the owners will not hire a gang of psychopaths to kick in your door, execute your entire family, and retrieve their property. They don't have to do that because their product is legal, which means that they are probably insured and they are able to contact the police. If you rob a crack dealer, he has no such legal recourse to recuperate his lost property. He is either going to take the loss or respond with violence to reclaim his money.

 

[Demonslayer]

Pot can be safe if you are rarely taking it, and so can shrooms.

And so can alcohol. So why throw pot users in jail and celebrate alcohol users as Johnny Fun Time celebratory people?

 

[Demonslayer]

Simplify the question. Why should pot be illegal and alcohol legal?

 

[Mindmaster]

And so can alcohol. So why throw pot users in jail and celebrate alcohol users as Johnny Fun Time celebratory people?

It comes down to the fact that drunk people are more entertaining... They sing, and try to dance... Pot users just empty your fridge or fall asleep.

 

[Demonslayer]

It comes down to the fact that drunk people are more entertaining... They sing, and try to dance... Pot users just empty your fridge or fall asleep.

LOL! OK I can't argue with this, it's too funny.

 

[freethinker44]

I used to believe that drug use should be legalized but after hearing an argument from Ann Coulter of all folks, I agree on her points. Some people can use drugs responsibly. I'm one of those folks. Others that get addicted and become destructive... Well, who ends up paying for their salvation and have to repair the damage done? I and other responsible citizens? Nope, not me. I'll vote for legal drug use as long as folks pay for their own recovery and damage if the worst happens.

You know we pay for people to go to prison right?
And treatment costs less than incarceration, so the argument that it shouldn't be legalized because we shouldn't have to pay for their recovery is silly.
If you were truly worried about paying for other people's addictions you would support legalization or rehabilitation instead of imprisonment.

 

[jeager106]

No, but they made that choice. I say ignore them, they want to disappear into the bottle. Your wish can be granted. Just expect to have a few more holes when you go a robbin' because no one is gonna hire you for a job.

Ha! Do some googling and learn how many employed people are alcoholic and how
much treatment costs insurance.
I personally know a guy who has been to THIRTY rehabs.
Yup, THIRTY.
Who pays for that? He works for G.M and has FREE insurance that the G.M
consumer pays for.
He's been at G.M 29 years. One wonders how many days of those years he actually
worked?
I worked eight years for G.M and know the cost of absenteeism, did a paper
on that for college.

What about the huge increase in people addicted to illegal drugs?
Ignore that? Cocaine use is epidemic in the U.S.
More laws? More prisons? Decriminalize illegal drug use?
Frankly I just don't know.
Decriminalizing drugs like cocaine and heroine WILL lower the number of
users in jail. But will that stop illegal hard drug use?
I kinda doubt that.

 

[leibowde84]

Someone please explain to me what a non violent drug offender is?
The drug crimes prosecuted in the federal courts are always violent, and I mean that literally. When you distribute a substance that you know is poison to another person that is a violent act. Period. End of story. Moreover, the connection between guns and drugs is beyond dispute. Not every purveyor of drugs uses or carries a gun, but the world where they operate organizes around one thing and one thing only, guns. Still further, whole neighborhoods that were once rich, vibrant and nurturing are now literal war zones because of drugs. In large swaths of America, functional families are no more because of drugs. Like global warming, these are inconvenient truths.
https://wednesdaywiththedecentlypro...is-no-such-thing-as-a-non-violent-drug-crime/

Maybe my opinions are skewed from serving over 22 years as a cop in a drug ridden
small city?
Just because Crips and Bloods from Detroit moved into our town and murder
rate went up.
Local drug lords were flat blown off park benches in the low income part of town by Detroit
drug gangs.
We never caught even one actor. They'd drive into town, make the hit, drive right
back to Detroit and disappear.
Perhaps I'm opinionated because a crack head/dealer broke my back and disabled me
permanently?
Maybe because I've seen horrific crimes committed by those under the influence
of crack cocaine?
How about a black youth run through with a GOLF SHAFT!
Well legalize the stuff then and let our youth poison themselves.
Ever see what happens to a decent young lady turned onto coke?
Ever deal with her when she's hopelessly condemned to a short, suffering, life
due to aids she got prostituting herself for drugs?
Have you ever found a dead young person in a back alley from a drug over dose?
I could go on and on and on but it will only make me sicker from my p.t.s.d.
I know first hand from "been there done that".
I was in rehab earlier this year and just about the ONLY patient addicted only to alcohol.
Nearly all were in for crack/coke/heroin addiction. A LOT on heroin.
Young men and women from otherwise good solid homes.
Sons and daughters of upper middle class families of good reputations.
Addiction knows no bounds.

I was actu

I just feel drug addicts are human refuse. We need to spend our time making things better for the people who make life better instead of devoting time to the pity party. I don't feel that users and abusers are the same people either. They choose to become losers by continuing to engaging in activities that they know are going to make them worthless. I have no sympathy whatsoever, unless the drug was forced upon them against their will.

Screw jail, screw treatment, just ignore them. They're ignoring everyone else, the selfish little gits.

This might be the most ignorant thing I've ever read. Addiction is a disease, just like alcoholism. Crack a book.

 

[jeager106]

You know we pay for people to go to prison right?
And treatment costs less than incarceration, so the argument that it shouldn't be legalized because we shouldn't have to pay for their recovery is silly.
If you were truly worried about paying for other people's addictions you would support legalization or rehabilitation instead of imprisonment.

TREATMENT COSTS A LOT MORE THAN JAIL!

Post some info that dug rehab costs less than jail per day?

When we average only the facilities with on-site detox (26 out of 32), the average price is $27,399.

^^ for 28 days.

The fee to cover the average cost of incarceration for Federal inmates in Fiscal Year 2013 was $29,291.25 ($80.25 per day).

Cost of a 28 day rehab is about $357 bucks per DAY.

Rehab costs a lot more than jail but rehab is usually only 28 days.

I got out of rehab months ago and am doing well but consider I am in A.A.
meetings at least 5 evenings a week.
I never did drugs. Alcohol.
Untreated alcohol withdrawal kills 25% of those suffering.
Heroin withdrawal kills no one. They just think they are going to die.
I was in intensive care for 5 days. Damn near killed me.
Average inpatient intensive care is 2 to 3 days.
I was really sick.
I have very good insurance but must co pay per month.
It's worth it.