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Death

S-word

Well-Known Member
Jesus, according to John (11:11), believed the dead sleep.

Yes, many time Jesus quotes from the words of Isaiah the prophet who said in chapter 57: 1; "Good people die, and no one understands or even cares. But when they (Good people) die, no calamity can hurt them. Those who lead good lives, Let's repeat that, those who live good lives find peace and rest in death."

Undoubtedly, Jeus believed that his very good friend Lazarus was a good person and had entered into the state of rest in the bosom of Abraham which is reserved for the spirits of good people who fall asleep in righteousness, unlike the state that the unrighteous rich man entered into as spoken of by Jesus in Luke 16: 20-25.
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
S-word-

Matthew wrote us (13:34) that when addressing the peoples (including religious leaders) Jesus would only speak in illustrations or parables.

At Luke (16:14,15) the setting is that the Pharisees heard Jesus and derided him.
Verse 19 Jesus starts his illustration or parable. Lazarus was a common name at that time and the Lazarus of the parable or story is not the same Lazarus as Jesus friend Lazarus in John chapter 11.

If we were to take Jesus parable literally then it would mean all enjoying divine favor could all fit at the bosom of one man, Abraham. How could one literal drop of water not evaporate by hellfire? Or one literal drop bring any relief?

The 'rich man' represented the Pharisees or rich religious leaders playing false to God.
Since Lazarus was a common name it could easily represent the common people who were despised by the Pharisees and look down upon them. Those common folk represented the genuine followers of Jesus.
(Luke 18:11; John 7:49; Matt 21:31,32)

All of their death's were not actual but symbolic death representing a change of circumstances. Jesus followers, the former common beggars (starving for real spiritual food), now came into a position of divine favor, whereas the former seemingly favored religious leaders were now rejected by God. Jesus message tormented them because now his message was being carried by the very people they despised. Acts 5:33; 7:54.

As we know Jesus gave Revelation. Isaiah 25:8 wrote that death would be swallowed up forever. When something is swallowed up we know it is gone. Besides death, Isaiah wrote that tears would also be gone from all faces. Jesus in Revelation reveals at Rev 21:4 that death will be no more including tears just as Isaiah foretold.

Jesus will fulfill the promise to Abraham that all nations of the earth will be blessed and all families of the earth will be blessed (Gen 12:3; 22:18; Rev 22:2). In order for that to happen the sleeping dead will need to be resurrected back to life. Acts (24:15) assures there will be a resurrection of just and unjust, with the exception of those of Matthew (12:32; Hebrews 6:4-6).

The reason Jesus would have believed that death was like a deep sleep was because Jesus was familiar with the Hebrew OT Scriptures. The Psalmist wrote at (6:5) in death there is No remembrance. (13:3) mentions sleeping the sleep of death. (115:17) says the dead do Not praise God. (146:4) shows at death thoughts perish. Having no thoughts after death is what King Solomon, who was known for his god-given wisdom, also believed because at Ecclesiastes (9:5,10) he wrote for us that the dead are not conscious of anything. The dead know nothing.

Yes, when good or righteous people die no calamity or evil can hurt them because Jesus will resurrect them to everlasting life. They can rule with Jesus as heavenly kings and priests (Rev 5:9,10), or be part of the humble meek (Psalm 37:11,29,38) to inherit the earth when Jesus demonstrates his power (Isaiah 11:1-9; Rev 19:11,15) in transforming earth to paradise conditions.

Isn't it so, that only Jesus as Prince of Peace can usher in Peace on Earth toward all men of goodwill?
 
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S-word

Well-Known Member
S-word-

Having no thoughts after death is what King Solomon, who was known for his god-given wisdom, also believed because at Ecclesiastes (9:5,10) he wrote for us that the dead are not conscious of anything. The dead know nothing.

I am very wary when quoting from the Book of Ecclesiastes, the book of Sirach, which is to be found in the Apocrypha of the Old Testament, coupled together with the book of Job, a number of the Psalms, Parables, Ecclesiastes, and the Wisdom of Solomon, all belong to the Hogmah or Wisdom Literature of the Hebrews, ‘Mashal’ means Similitude, parable, or proverb.----- In the book of sirach, R, H, Charles translation chapter 47 verse 17, it is written concerning Solomon, “By thy songs, parables, dark speeches, and satires, thou didst cause astonishment to the peoples etc.”

Eat, drink and be merry, for tomorrow we die. I envy those who are dead and gone; they are better off than those who are still alive. But better off than either, are those who have never been born etc. A man may have a hundred children and live a long time, but no matter how long he lives, if he does not get his share of happiness and does not receive a descent burial, then I say that a baby born dead is better off. Man and animal receive the same ultimate reward, total oblivion, from the dust they came and to the dust they shall return. A wise man is no better off than a fool, the reward for doing good is the same as that for doing evil, so don’t be too good or too wise, Why kill yourself?

We are all going to our final resting place, and although life is useless, the conclusion of the matter is, if you live a religious life you may at least experience some peace in the short span of consciousness that has been allocated to you in this useless life. So go ahead and eat, drink and be merry, drink your wine and be cheerful. It’s all right with God. Enjoy your life with the woman you love, as long as you live the useless life that God has given you in this world. Enjoy every useless day of it, because that is all that you’ll get for all your troubles. Never again will you take part in anything that happens in the world, because there will be no action, no thought, no knowledge, no wisdom in the world of the dead to where the righteous, the wicked, the wise and the fools, animal and man, are all going. For the living know that they are going to die, but the dead know nothing.

Solomon’s songs are found in his book, ‘Song of Songs,’ his parables are found in his book of proverbs, his dark speeches are in the ‘Wisdom of Solomon,’ and who can read the negative and even depressing words from the book of ‘Ecclesiastes without realizing that here is the satirical work of Solomon, aimed at those who believed in neither life after death, or the resurrection from the dead.

When you quote from the Book of Ecclesiastes, know that you are quoting the satirical words of Solomon. I've got a hell of a lot on my plate right now mate, but I'll try to get back to you tomorrow and answer your post in detail.
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear the true God and keep his commandments: for this is the whole obligation of man. - Ecc 12:13

Is the resting place final?
According to Acts (24:15) there is going to be a resurrection of the just and unjust.

If the dead are not to be raised let us eat and drink for tomorrow we die- 1st Cor 15:32.
But, death is swallowed up in victory states verse 32 which is also written at: Isaiah 25:8.
Oh death where is thy sting? O grave where is thy victory? - 1st Cor 15:55

Our 'last enemy' death will be brought to nothing. - 1st Cor 15:26.
When something is brought to nothing it does not exist anymore.
That is why Revelation (21:4) can state that there will be No more death.
Jesus, during his thousand-year reign over earth, will reverse all the damage that Adam started in Eden.
 

S-word

Well-Known Member
Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear the true God and keep his commandments: for this is the whole obligation of man. - Ecc 12:13

Is the resting place final?
According to Acts (24:15) there is going to be a resurrection of the just and unjust.

If the dead are not to be raised let us eat and drink for tomorrow we die- 1st Cor 15:32.
But, death is swallowed up in victory states verse 32 which is also written at: Isaiah 25:8.
Oh death where is thy sting? O grave where is thy victory? - 1st Cor 15:55

Our 'last enemy' death will be brought to nothing. - 1st Cor 15:26.
When something is brought to nothing it does not exist anymore.
That is why Revelation (21:4) can state that there will be No more death.
Jesus, during his thousand-year reign over earth, will reverse all the damage that Adam started in Eden.

John 14: 30; I cannot talk to you much longer, because (Death) the ruler of this world is coming. He has no power over me, but the world must know that I love the Father; that is why i do everything he commands me.

The death of the body was once the ruler of this world, until the resurrection proved otherwise, it was for this reason that Paul used the sarcastic comment recorded by Solomon in his satirical writing in the book of Ecclesiastes: If the dead are not to be raised let us eat and drink for tomorrow we die- 1st Cor 15:32. If there is no resurrection of the dead, then beyond death there is nothing, no punishment, no reward, the good the bad the animals, all go off into total oblivion so don't be too good or too wise, why knock yourself out for nothing.

The resurrection of Jesus by our Father and saviour, had brought to nothing the concept of the death of our bodies as being the end of our life, and death has lost its sting for those who believe-- Oh death where is thy sting? Death is swallowed up in victory----- O grave where is thy victory?

Of course there will always be the death of any and every physical body, even this physical universe will burn up and fall as fire into the great abyss from which it originated, before it is resurrected again to continue in the eternal process of evolution, but the death of the body has lost its power to hurt those who believe in the resurrection, the black hole (grave) into which all men must descend no longer has any victory over those who believe.

Jesus was the compilation of all the spirits of good people who had fallen asleep in righteousness and were gathered to the bosom of Abraham, Jesus was one with his ancestral spirit, he was totally obedient to his inner self, and did, nor spoke anything other than that which he was commanded by the Father spirit who dwelt within the inner most sanctuary of the Temple, which was his body, and every spirit within that enclosure that was Jesus, had paid the blood price for the sins and mistakes that they had made in thir physical lives. They had been judged in the flesh as all are judged and were found worthy of life eternal, their blood was the ransom price for their compilation, Jesus.

It was this spiritual body to who the man Jesus was one, which was torn asunder and poured out as fire on all those who believed the words of our ancestral Father spirit as spoken through the mouth of his obedient servant Jesus the first fruits, the first of many brothers chosen from the body of mankind in the creation of God's new Temple of which the man Jesus was the chosen cornerstone.

Mankind is currently the most high in the evolution of the Logos who was the animating force within the singularity of origin which has evolved to be all that is, and mankind is the Tent of God as he awaits the creation of his new Temple of light. Mankind the most high in the evolution is lord of creatures and the prototype of the Lord of spirits who is the "The Son Of Man," the evolving spirit of the eternal who, in the body of mankind is evolving on all the wisdom, knowledge and insight of those righteous spirits of man who are gathered to him.

Those spirits that were of the enclosure to who Jesus was one, who were judged in the flesh as all are judged, now in their spiritual existence live as God lives, gathering to themselves all the spirits of their righteous descendants and these who are the body of Jesus, are those of the first resurrection. They will be reborn on earth and take the thrones that have been prepared for them and rule the world for a thousand years.

After the Lord's Day has ended and Satan is let loose to deceive and divide the world once again, fire will come down from heaven and incinerate every physical life form on this planet, except for those of the first resurrection who had already died and paid the penalty of blood, for at the sound of the last trumpet, they shall be changed in a moment in the twinkling of an eye, from bodies of corruptible matter into glorious and brilliant bodies of incorruptible and blinding light and they will be the same as the brilliant body of Jesus of Nazareth who met Paul on the road to Damascus.

When the earth is capable of sustaining physical life forms again, it is they who will have been caught up to heaven to be with their brother Jesus, in whom are the resting spirits of the righteous, who will then say, "Let us make man in our image and likeness." Zephaniah; ‘for the Lord said, “I am going to destroy everything on earth. All human beings and animals, birds and fish. I will bring about the downfall of the wicked. I will destroy all mankind and no survivors will be left.” I the Lord have spoken.----------On the day when the Lord shows his fury, not even all their silver and gold will save them. The whole earth will be destroyed by the fire of his anger. He will put an end--a sudden end—to everyone who lives on earth.


“The world being melted and re-entered into the bosom of Jupiter, this God continues for some time totally concentred in himself:....Afterwards we see a new world spring from him, perfect in all its parts; animals are produced anew; an innocent race of man is formed under more favourable auspices, in order to people this earth.”—Seneca, Epist,9, and Qucest. NAT.L. 3, c, ult.
 
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URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
According to Revelation 21:4 the time will come when 'death will be No more'.

Isn't our last enemy 'death' destroyed according to 1st Corinthians 15:26?______

As far as the earth, God did not create it for nothing but as Isaiah wrote (45:18) that God 'established' the earth, God did not create it in vain, God formed the earth to be inhabited.

Solomon wrote the earth abides forever. So forever the earth will abide- Ecc 1:4 b

The Psalmist agrees (119:90) God established the earth that is why it abides.

Psalm (78:69) the earth God established forever. Isn't forever is permanent?

Psalm (104:5) the foundations of the earth will not be removed forever.

According to Proverbs 2:21,22 who will 'remain' on earth?________ Isn't it the upright?
However the wicked will be removed. Proverbs 10:30 agrees.

Psalm (92:7) isn't it the wicked that are destroyed? (Psalm 37:38)

When Jesus takes action, Isaiah (11:4) and Revelation ( 19:11,15), shows the words from Jesus mouth will do away with those on earth that should not remain here.

The living sheep-like ones of chapter 25 of Matthew receive everlasting life as part of the great crowd of Revelation (7:9,10,14) because they are saved or delivered from the wicked by Jesus. The goat-like ones are cut off in the everlasting punishment of 'destruction' . 2nd Thess ( 1:9). Just like Adam from dust they will return to dust forever.

That is why Zephaniah (2:3) could warn to keep seeking God all the meek of the earth, seek righteousness, seek meekness because you may be hid in the day of God's anger against the wicked. The 'may be' is not on God's part but on our part.

Verse 11 says it will be terrible for the wicked because God will famish or emaciate all the false gods of the earth. The upright or righteous do not have false gods.

Zeph (1:18) ends with making a speedy riddance of all them that dwell in the land.
'All them' are all of the wicked, God's enemies. As Ezekiel (7:19) says even the wealth of the wicked, their silver and their gold, they will throw into the street because it can't deliver them.

At that time according to Isaiah (26:20) we are to 'hide' until God's anger or indignation is past.

Zeph 3:19,20 ends with God making his people have a name and praise among all people of the earth. Verses 15-17 shows God casts out the enemy and evil will be seen no more. So the 'things' consumed off the land are all the wicked things.
 
What do you "see" when you die? Anybody have any interesting Near Death Experiences? I've always wondered what it's going to be like. First I thought it would be pitch blackness, like when you close your eyes. Then I thought it would be brightness and peacefulness. I have many views on what the afterlife is going to be like, but cant decide on one. Please help!?

Near Death Experiences (NDE)

In my work as a neurologist I have primarily treated epilepsy. And as a hospital staff physician I see post-cardiac resuscitation patients in consultation. I have interviewed patients and studied their NDEs. The background is three possible precipitants, blunt or penetrating head trauma, decreased blood flow and/or low pO2 in the brain (Hypoxaemia), and temporal lobe epilepsy (partial complex seizures.)

NDE experiences are largely stereotyped no matter which of the above is the cause. The person is observationally unconscious or in a confusion like state. In the remembered event the patient often perceives an out of body experience (OOBE) which has two forms. One is standing next to one’s own body or more often floating above their body, seeming to see people around the bedside such as nurses and doctors. The other is a feeling of limitlessness, expanding and merging with the universe. The OBE is followed by going through a bright tunnel in a dark background. In this phase one might see images of dead relatives, angels, Jesus, or Brahma, or saints. This is followed by a smaller but brighter light. Usually at that point they either come out of it or come out of it (sometimes in reverse.) During the tunnel phase they may hear the voice of a dead parent or God/Jesus/Virgin Mary/Muhammad/Brahma.

On recovery, the patients often feel disappointed, cheated out of Heaven or bliss. They do have often have permanent or transient neurobehavioural changes mainly in short term memory, attention span, and emotional regulation with loss of some inhibition, loss of rational skills, loss of some problem solving efficiency, and changes in efficiency of task specific shifts. Depending on the degree of hypoxia or hypoxaemia, the post-episode impairment varies.


NDE’s are only sometimes near (risk of) death. Many occur with cardiac arrests which indeed are life threatening. In such a case, there is a marked decrease or stop in blood flow to the brain temporarily in “watershed regions.” Watershed areas are the tissue between two different arterial trees and perfusion there is more tenuous. During shock or cardiac arrest blood perfusion to the border zone between the territories of two arteries decreases.

Arteries branch into more and smaller arteries and arterioles. At the peripheral end of an arterial “tree”, the capillaries merge with those of the neighbouring artery producing the Watershed Area. When blood flow decreases, the area getting the worst deprivation is this watershed area. It is the area suffering any neuronal loss (there is likely always some neuronal loss, varying with the severity of hypoxaemia).

Watershed areas are found all over the body. However, in the inferior medial temporal lobes are arteries named the posterior cerebral and middle cerebral. The sudden hypoxaemia can precipitate temporal lobe like seizures. This Temporal Lobe watershed is the anatomical focus of the Near Death Experience.

Other watershed areas are in the upper parasagittal areas of frontal lobe (rational, inhibitory, analytical), calcarine occipital lobe (visual), and cerebellar (balance, coordination (arteries are Superior Cerebellar, Anterior Inferior Cerebellar, and Posterior Inferior Cerebellar.)

Temporal lobe seizures are epileptic discharges that begin in the mesial inferior temporal lobe spreading to the amygdala and on to multiple cortical association areas generating the event. They can also occur in pure brain hypoxia, in hypoxaemia (deoxygenated blood and poor flow or shock) and in deoxygenated but normal volume blood perfusion.

Complex Partial Epilepsy can and generally is non-hypoxic and non-ischemic. In Epileptics, they have many causes. Some are due to temporal sclerosis (scarring), head trauma, brain tumours, arterio-venous malformations, small haemorrhages, small infarcts/strokes, metabolic imbalances (↓Na+, Renal Failure, ↓Mg++, ↓ or ↑Ca++, ↓blood osmolality, and ↓pH.) They can also occur from a number of different drugs such as cocaine, methamphetamines or drug/alcohol withdrawal.

The electrical discharge begins in the neurons in the region of Ammon’s Horn in the temporal lobe. The discharge is transmitted to memory association areas of the nearby temporal lobe for visual and auditory memories and odd smell memories. Some go to the superior parietal lobe (body orientation/localization areas) to give the primary OOBE (Out of body experience) phase.

In this situation discharges have an inhibitory effect. Some go to cingulate gyrus as well for the affective component (happiness, mystical, frightened, or angry.) In some cases frontal lobe discharges are recorded. This causes the symptoms I described in the second paragraph.

The third major cause is head trauma. Sudden trauma precipitates seizures. Americans usually remember the televised generalised seizure of Roger Staubach of the Dallas Cowboys in the end zone of a Saturday televised game seen by millions of fans. His career soon ended. But he did not have epilepsy. It was just a post-traumatic seizure. Many trauma patients who have seizures, have partial seizures instead of generalised. These often manifest as Temporal Lobe seizures or focal motor seizures. The Temporal Lobe Seizure may be simple hallucinations auditory or visual which some call Partial Simple Seizures. Many spread across the cortex to a full NDE described in the second paragraph.

The most important thing is that these people are not clinically DEAD. They are unconscious, and in some cases at risk of death. Most Epileptic patients are not at serious death risk unless driving a car. Those who actually die may experience NDEs before they die but cannot tell us about them. The DEAD brain cannot seize. We have no evidence of sentience in a dead brain. That is for you to speculate as you wish.

I would separate the Real Death from Near Death Experiences. The latter do not really die and the brain cells remain functioning. In true death, the brain cells start dying in 4 minutes and electrolyte changes cause cells to take in water and explode into a mushy mass. These people never awaken so we can't ask them about NDE's.

I would say that the experiences in the NDE may well be similar to those in real death just before the brain dies. Unfortunately that memory is permanently lost without neurons, axons, synapses, dendrites, flowing oxygenated blood, and normal glucose levels.

NDE's do not prove a "soul" because they occur in people who are not near death death such as Complex Partial Epileptics who may have many such episodes.

Ardipithecus
 

rusra02

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
What do you "see" when you die? Anybody have any interesting Near Death Experiences? I've always wondered what it's going to be like. First I thought it would be pitch blackness, like when you close your eyes. Then I thought it would be brightness and peacefulness. I have many views on what the afterlife is going to be like, but cant decide on one. Please help!?

You feel nothing, you know nothing. You are unconscious. " His spirit goes out, he goes back to his ground;In that day his thoughts do perish." (Psalms 146:4) Jesus likened death to sleep. (John 11:11-14), Ecclesiastes 9:5,10 says regarding the dead "They are conscious of nothing at all".
Hope for the dead is a resurrection. Meanwhile, they are alive in God's memory. (John 5:28,29)
 

godnotgod

Thou art That
What do you "see" when you die? Anybody have any interesting Near Death Experiences? I've always wondered what it's going to be like. First I thought it would be pitch blackness, like when you close your eyes. Then I thought it would be brightness and peacefulness. I have many views on what the afterlife is going to be like, but cant decide on one. Please help!?

Before you were born, did you also wonder what the afterbirth (no pun intended) would be like?

Perhaps what you call the afterlife will be determined, in large part, by what you do or do not do in this life. This would seem to suggest that one is better off paying very close attention to what is going on right now, instead of speculating on what is going to come.

Live THIS afterlife first, fully and completely, from one eternal moment to the next, before worrying about the next afterlife. This means focusing your attention on the Present Moment, and when it wanders, bringing it back, again, and again, until, one fine day, it just stays here. Buddhists call this focusing of the attention "mindfullness".

That way, when the next afterlife comes, it will just take care of itself, as you will already be focused on that moment as well.

I see you post as a Methodist. You are a Christian. Do you recall Jesus's message about the lilies of the field?

Matthew 6:28-34 (New International Version)


28"And why do you worry about clothes? See how the lilies of the field grow. They do not labor or spin. 29Yet I tell you that not even Solomon in all his splendor was dressed like one of these. 30If that is how God clothes the grass of the field, which is here today and tomorrow is thrown into the fire, will he not much more clothe you, O you of little faith? 31So do not worry, saying, 'What shall we eat?' or 'What shall we drink?' or 'What shall we wear?' 32For the pagans run after all these things, and your heavenly Father knows that you need them. 33But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well. 34Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own.

All Jesus was saying is to be present, mind and body, in this wonderful Present Moment as it unfolds.
 
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URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
John 14: 30; I cannot talk to you much longer, because (Death) the ruler of this world is coming. He has no power over me, but the world must know that I love the Father; that is why i do everything he commands me.

Why did you insert the word (Death) at John 14:30?

'Death' does not appear as the word in the Greek at John 14:30.
The world ruler or prince (KJV) of this world is as 2nd Cor 4:4 calls Satan: the god of this world of badness.

Jesus already stated at John 12:31 that the prince (world ruler) will be cast out.
1st John 5:19 says this world of badness lies in the power of wickedness or the wicked one Satan. Isn't it 'woe' to the earth because Satan was cast out at Rev 12:12?

The 'man' that is to be cut off from earth at Zeph 1:3 is the wicked ones.
Chapter two shows there are conditions to be met at Zeph 2:3 to be seeking: God, righteousness and meekness in order to be 'hid' in the day of God's anger against the goat-like ones of Matthew chapter 25.
What does Isaiah 26:20 say?

Fire is symbolic of destruction. Sodom and Gomorrah suffers eternal fire.
We know it is not burning today but that destruction was complete.
Luke 17:27, 29 Jesus shows that water and fire can: destroy.
2nd Thess 1:9 equates punishment with everlasting destruction.
The 'goats' are cut off from earth into the punishment of everlasting destruction.-Matt 25:46 . The 'sheep' are alive and remain alive as the righteous ones that will continue to live right into Jesus 1000-year rule over earth.
Once Jesus rids the earth of the wicked. (remember it was the wicked destroyed at the Flood and Sodom). So once Jesus words rid the earth of the wicked as Isa 11:4; Rev 19:11,15 says, and the wicked are destroyed as Psalm 92:7 states, with the 'upright' remaining according to Proverbs 2:21,22 then the humble meek will inherit the earth as Jesus promised-Psalm 37:11,29.
Jesus as Prince of Peace will usher in Peace on Earth and peace toward all men of goodwill.
 
Some "Near Death Experiences" maybe what is also called "Out of Body Experiences", in which individuals feel that they have died, but can then see themselves from "above". A Neurobiology article (Sept 27, 2002) stated this:

"OBEs are brief sensations that occur when a person feels as if his mind separates from his body. During OBEs, people sense that they are floating above their own bodies. No one knows what causes OBEs, but some people believe that OBEs are religious or spiritual events. Interestingly, many people who have come close to death report that they have had an OBE

Researchers from the University Hospitals of Geneva and Lausanne (Switzerland) have found that OBEs can be produced by direct electrical stimulation of a specific part of the brain. Dr. Olaf Blanke and his colleagues worked with a 43-year-old female patient who suffered from right temporal lobe epilepsy. In order to identify the location where the seizures occurred, the researchers implanted electrodes on the brain under the patient's dura. While the patient was awake, the researchers could pass electrical current through the electrodes to identify the function of the brain area under each electrode.

Electrical stimulation of the angular gyrus on the right side of the patient's brain produced unusual sensations. Weak stimulation caused the patient to feel as if she was "sinking into the bed" or "falling from a height." Stronger electrical stimulation caused the patient to have an OBE.

For example, the patient said, "I see myself lying in bed, from above, but I only see my legs and lower trunk." Stimulation of the angular gyrus at other times caused the woman to have feelings of "lightness" and of "floating" two meters above the bed.

The angular gyrus is located near the vestibular (balance) area of the cerebral cortex. It is likely that electrical stimulation of the angular gyrus interrupts the ability of the brain to make sense of information related to balance and touch. This interruption may result in OBEs. Blood flow changes within the angular gyrus may alter brain activity during "near death experiences." This may result in OBEs reported by people who survive such events."

How complex and well-made the human mind is by our Creator, Jehovah God. It was designed to provide us with the full use of all our senses forever on a paradise earth (Ps 37:29; Luke 23:43), with never a worry about "near death experiences", for death will be completely eradicated from the earth, being thrown into the symbolic "lake of fire".(Rev 20:14)
 
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godnotgod

Thou art That
How complex and well-made the human mind is by our Creator, Jehovah God. It was designed to provide us with the full use of all our senses forever on a paradise earth (Ps 37:29; Luke 23:43), with never a worry about "near death experiences", for death will be completely eradicated from the earth, being thrown into the symbolic "lake of fire".(Rev 20:14)

You cannot have life without death. It is an integral component of our existence. Having said that, death cannot be "conquered" simply because it is an illusion. It is but a concept of the mind, just as life is. Once you see and understand this illusory quality of 'death', you will be free; you will realize the eternity you dwell in exactly at this very moment. In fact, you have always had eternal life, but you were always somewhere else, either in the past or in some imaginary future, when your true existence was always 'at hand', just as Jesus told you. But you were asleep, and not awake in this wondrous and eternal Present Moment.

If you think about what we call physical 'death' in our Western culture, it is soon realized that the process of death is actually the process of life; a 'dead' corpse is actually alive, with billions of bacteria and other macrophages consuming and transforming it. Nothing is wasted. Nothing. Likewise, life itself is death, as our cells are dying as we speak. As living creatures, we consume dead organic matter to nourish our 'life'. Life and Death are inextricably intertwined.

Spiritual Awakening reveals to us the illusory quality of both, so we transcend them, rather than 'conquer', because conquering only creates conflict, and what we want is to see and understand the harmonious relationship of death to life.

We should celebrate death, welcoming its arrival with open arms. It is not an end, but a doorway to a new life. Its arrival should be lived to its fullest extent, just as each moment of living should be, both requiring our full attention.

Living and dying each moment to its fullest leaves no trace behind. When you burn, burn completely. Then it is over. :D
*****

The Strawberry

You are walking in the hills for exercise when you are chased by a mountain lion. At the edge of a cliff you jump over and grab on to a vine. It is far to the bottom and when you look down you see that a grizzly bear is there, looking up. Above you a white mouse and a black mouse appear from the cliff's side and begin to gnaw away at the vine. As you fall, your eye alights on a red strawberry on a vine next to you . You pick it, you eat it. How delicious!:D


Shambhala SunSpace » Practices of Gratitude: An exploration for Thanksgiving

 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
godnotgod why say welcome our enemy death with open arms?

1st Cor 15:26 says our last enemy death will be brought to nothing.

The righteous ones of Matthew 25:31,32,46 are alive or living at the time Jesus comes to bring Peace on Earth toward men of goodwill. Those righteous ones are placed at Jesus right hand of favor, so to speak, and they remain alive to go right on living into Jesus millennium-long day. They do not die but keep right on living, or remain alive, because during Jesus 1000-year rule over earth death comes to an end as Rev 21:4 says.
 

Ben Dhyan

Veteran Member
Death as a metaphor in this beautiful poem reflecting the mystical union that awaits those whose love for God exceeds all other desires,...some verses of Songs of the Soul, by St. John of the Cross, trl by Mirabai Starr.

Songs of the Soul

On a dark night,
Inflamed by love longing---
O exquisite risk!---
Undetected I slipped away,
My house, at last , grown still.

Secure in the darkness,
I climbed the secret ladder---
O exquisite risk!---
Concealed by the darkness,
My house, at last, grown still.

The sweet night: a secret.
No body saw me:
I did not see a thing.
No other light, no other guide
Than the one burning in my heart.

This light led the way
More clearly than the risen sun
To where He was waiting for me
---The one I knew so intimately---
In a place where no one could find us.

O night, that guided me!
O night, sweeter than sunrise!
O night, that joined lover and Beloved!
Lover transformed into Beloved!

 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
ben d

Rejoice, rejoice all ye who weep
For loss of loved ones dear,
What we call death, is but a sleep
In the winter of the year;
And just as surely as the spring
Brings life to tree and flower,
So those who sleep in death will know
The resurrection's Power
by DM Cahoon.

But does the soul sing at death? According to Ezekiel 18:4,20 the soul that sins dies.
When Adam received the breath of life (Gen 2:7) Adam became a living soul and
at death Adam became a dead soul. From dust back to dust.

Remember those dead in Adam are not extinct but just sleeping the sleep of death.
[Ecc 9:5; Psalm 6:5; 13:3; 115:17 ;146:4; John 11:11-14] . Adam was the father (life giver) to the human race, but his downfall bequeathed a legacy of leaving an inheritance of death's deep sleep-like condition to us.

The whole world is shackled in death's prison precinct. We have partial liberty now while we wait for deliverance from that Adamic death sentence. We are still walking in that prison yard. We are not yet shut up in our prison cells (tombs) Eze 18:4

Jesus saved us from the death trap even if for right now salvation is just by that future millennial hope because the dead can not experience actual delivery or salvation from death's power (Hebrews 2:14 b) until the Resurrection. Acts 24:15. The awakening of the sleeping world in the morning (Resurrection morning) when pardoned sinners will be awakened from death's slumber to come forth to peaceful world-wide conditions under Christ Jesus 1000-year reign over earth.- Daniel 12:2, 13.

Sin and death will not reign then. There is no death warrant, no death watch, and their hopes will not even die. All of this is made possible because perfect Jesus died a hero's death for us. As our redeemer he has full power and control over the great prison house of death. Satan (our great jailer) will Not have the keys to death's door because Jesus has the keys of death and hell (gravedom) to unlock death's prison house of detention for us.
Rev 1:18; 20:13,14, 21:4; 1 Cor 15:26; Isaiah 25:8.

Out of death's dungeon comes the prisoner (AKA the jail bird pardoned for their errors) see Romans 6:7. They hear and obey the voice of Jesus to get up and walk. Walk the highway of holiness up and out of the shadow of death to the full and original perfect human life of peace and blessings meant for mankind from the beginning.
Gen 3:15; 12:3; 22:17,18; Rev 22:2.

Those righteous ones of Matthew 25:31,32 are still living and alive when Jesus comes in action. They do not die but continue to live right into Jesus peaceful Millennium-long day.
A paradise the earth will be. Through eyes of faith even now you this can see.
 

godnotgod

Thou art That
godnotgod why say welcome our enemy death with open arms?

1st Cor 15:26 says our last enemy death will be brought to nothing.

The righteous ones of Matthew 25:31,32,46 are alive or living at the time Jesus comes to bring Peace on Earth toward men of goodwill. Those righteous ones are placed at Jesus right hand of favor, so to speak, and they remain alive to go right on living into Jesus millennium-long day. They do not die but keep right on living, or remain alive, because during Jesus 1000-year rule over earth death comes to an end as Rev 21:4 says.

There is no end to death; only the ending of the idea of it.

If you realize your unborn nature, you cannot die.

Yeshua's words have been twisted to imply that death is an 'enemy' that must be conquered. Death can only be conquered upon the realization that it is an illusion to begin with. Pitting oneself against an imaginary enemy only keeps you in a delusional state of mind. You are fighting with shadows and appearances.

Just accept death completely, and then there will be no death to be concerned about as you conceive of it.

To think of a state of affairs in which death is conquered is to live in a static, frozen reality. Death is necessary for life to exist. Don't you see that?

But realizing your unborn nature, you transcend the duality, and the illusion, of both life and death.

Then you are free.
 

godnotgod

Thou art That
godnotgod why say welcome our enemy death with open arms?

1st Cor 15:26 says our last enemy death will be brought to nothing.

It need'nt be brought to anything; it is already no-thing. A caterpillar does not die when it becomes a butterfly. There is only transformation and renewal. Why would we not welcome such transformation and renewal? Why do we think to conquer it as an enemy? Is the reason only our fear and ignorance?

Can you tell me: Who is it that lives? Who is it that dies? If there is no self that lives and dies, then where is death?

The Human Route

Coming empty-handed, going empty-handed -- that is human.
When you are born, where do you come from?
When you die, where do you go?
Life is like a floating cloud which appears.
Death is like a floating cloud which disappears.
The floating cloud itself originally does not exist.
Life and death, coming and going*, are also like this.
But there is one thing which always remains clear.
It is pure and clear, not depending on life and death.
What is that one pure and clear thing?


Zen Master Seung
*****

* "All this life is filled with coming and going (ie; birth and death).
Show me the path where there is no coming and there is no going"
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
It need'nt be brought to anything; it is already no-thing. A caterpillar does not die when it becomes a butterfly. There is only transformation and renewal. Why would we not welcome such transformation and renewal? Why do we think to conquer it as an enemy? Is the reason only our fear and ignorance?
Can you tell me: Who is it that lives? Who is it that dies? If there is no self that lives and dies, then where is death?
"

Since Solomon wrote (Ecc9:5) that the dead know nothing then in that sense yes death is: 'no-thing'. A person, a soul, is: nothing at death.

Caterpillar into butterfly. If we look at the caterpillar as we are in our imperfect human state of mind and body that will become a butterfly, or a perfect human in mind and body, as the purpose of the resurrection will serve.

The transformation and renewal according to Revelation (21:5) is that all things will be made 'new' during Jesus 1000-year Reign over earth.
Former troubles, according to Isaiah (65:16 B,17), will be forgotten. In the 'new' earth where the former will not be remembered, nor come to mind.

Peter mentions three heavens and earth. (2Pt 3:5,7,13).
Vs 5 the old earth of Noah's day
Vs 7 the now or present earthly society
Vs13 the future or new earth. New in the sense that only righteousness will dwell at that Millennial time on earth.

Those righteous ones of Matthew (25:31,32,46) are alive or living at the time Jesus takes action against all wickedness (Isa 11:4; Rev19:11,15) and these living righteous ones remain alive or keep right on living without ever dying into Jesus peaceful 1000-year rule over the 'new' earth as Peter described that Millennial time.
As for the rest, if death were Not brought to nothing, cease to exist, (1Cor15:26) then there would be no resurrection (butterfly) for all those (caterpillars) sleeping the sleep of death to awaken to human perfection of mind and body as Adam originally had.


(Ps 6:5; 13:3; 115:17; 146:4;Daniel 12:2,13; John 11:11-14)
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
To think of a state of affairs in which death is conquered is to live in a static, frozen reality. Death is necessary for life to exist. Don't you see that?

If death is conquered then instead of life in a static, frozen reality, it is really life being not only thawed out, but not static. In life there there is liveliness.
The absence of death equals only living or being alive animated to enjoy all life has to offer.

Jesus promised life to some to rule in the heavens with him.
(Rev 5:9,10; Luke 12:32)
But the majority (John 10:16; Matt 25:33,34) will be part of the promise to Abraham (Gen 12:3; 22:17,18; Rev 22:2) that all families of the earth will be blessed, and all nations of the earth will be blessed.

Jesus death was necessary for life to exist. That is why Jesus is called 'eternal father' by Isaiah. Father means: life giver. As Eternal Father, or life giver, Jesus will give life to the dead ones (except those of Matt 12:32; Heb 6:4-6)
and all righteous ones to gain everlasting life.

If Adam had remained righteous and obedient Adam would have never died.
Adam would be alive today in perfect human health of mind and body to help fulfill the command at Genesis to multiply or fill or populate the earth.
Mankind was only to reproduce until the earth was populated. New scrolls will be opened during Jesus peaceful 1000-year rule over earth, and then we will see what further purpose God has for mankind.
 

godnotgod

Thou art That
Since Solomon wrote (Ecc9:5) that the dead know nothing then in that sense yes death is: 'no-thing'. A person, a soul, is: nothing at death.

When you are dead, there is no "you" to know anything. Who is it that lives? Who is it that dies?

Caterpillar into butterfly. If we look at the caterpillar as we are in our imperfect human state of mind and body that will become a butterfly, or a perfect human in mind and body, as the purpose of the resurrection will serve.

...and yet, the perfect cannot be without having the imperfect to emerge from. So it owes its perfection to the imperfect. The butterfly owes its existence to the humble caterpillar it emerged from.

Resurrection is something else. It is the reanimation of the dead, which is only a fantasy. Once wood turns to ash, it remains ash. It does not return to wood. That is just the nature of things.

The transformation and renewal according to Revelation (21:5) is that all things will be made 'new' during Jesus 1000-year Reign over earth.
Former troubles, according to Isaiah (65:16 B,17), will be forgotten. In the 'new' earth where the former will not be remembered, nor come to mind.

All things are being made new all the time, but if you only focus on the past or the future, you are missing that renewal as it occurs right in front of you, at each and every moment.


As for the rest, if death were Not brought to nothing, cease to exist, (1Cor15:26) then there would be no resurrection (butterfly) for all those (caterpillars) sleeping the sleep of death to awaken to human perfection of mind and body as Adam originally had.

Butterfly into caterpillar is transformation, not resurrection. You are bending the truth to fit your teeth.:D

There is no death to be brought to anything. Death is an illusion; a concept.

We are like birds in cages with open doors.

Fly away and be free, now.
 
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