Detachment and suffering

[Truthseeker]

I have no other family left except one older brother who lives in Colorado, but he does not care about me either. He had not called me in years and about a week ago he finally called me for another reason at which time he found out about my husband. All he did was listen and at the end of the phone call he nonchalantly said "Let me know if Lewis dies." I have told that to many people, complete strangers, and they cannot believe a brother could be that insensitive and uncaring. I get more support and love from the cats.

I do not like that brother! I don't care what religion he espouses, he is a cad!

Some Baha'is in the Baha'i community where I live have expressed some concern and desire to help but they do not really want to be bothered by this so they are not really there to help, especially when I carry on about God. I am in essence completely alone except for my counselor and the people on this forum.

What can they do? You know also you been isolated from them so long, you have no real prior relationship before recently, unlike your brother.

After 37 years that I care for him he has not even called me from the hospital and he does not care if he ever sees me again, all he cares about is himself and his physical pain. I do not really want him at home but I was willing to care for him with the help of visiting nurses. Right now I just want to forget I ever married him, but that won't be easy. I should add that I do not depends upon him for anything so I don't need him the way he needed me. I will have the same income after he dies and the three houses paid in full and more than the equivalent in stocks and bonds and money in the bank. I am fully self-sufficient. There is a part of me that wants a new life perhaps with someone else but there is a part of me who wants to live alone for the rest of my life.

What inner conflict! I pray that this inner conflict will resolve itself sometime soon. Also I sympathise with you for having such a husband. I don't think ultimately you will want to live alone. You could live alone in your house, but having friends in person in your area would be ideal. I can only be friends at a distance. I don't believe being your bff since I am so distant would be that helpful. You need other friends in person. I care for you, you know I do. I cry for you at this moment. For some reason this is the moment when I cry for you.

I should also mention another reason he does not care if he dies, because he believes in an afterlife that is going to be so glorious, and he'd rather be there than here. This is what religious beliefs do to people. I also believe in an afterlife but it won't necessarily be glorious for him when he dies and realizes all the suffering he put me through and how I am suffering now. But God is all-merciful even if that is not just. In Baha'i parlance it is said that God's mercy exceeds His justice. Something is wrong with that, but who doesn't want mercy, even if they don't deserve it?

I hope for mercy for him. I am crying for him, too.

 

[Truthseeker]

After 37 years, my husband does not even care if he ever sees me again. I just cannot understand how anyone could be so aloof from the person who cared about him and for him for 37 years. It hurts more than hell.

I cry for you! Actually I fear fror his sfate in the next world, also. Easy for me to say at a distance, not knowing him at all, or knowing the details of all that.

 

[Trailblazer]

Sorry to hear all that. In my opinion personal contact with some one to talk to would be great, but as you said covid has cut much of that off.
Don't give up and keep seeking. Someone will be there.

A couple of nights ago, I met a man who sees me walking down the street he lives on and he stopped me and we chatted for about a half hour. Then he took me on a tour of his 5 acre property and introduced me to his brother who as sitting outside watching a movie on his tablet. It turns out we have a lot in common because his wife is very ill as is my husband. He could see I was suffering and he told me to stop by any time.

About a week ago, I also met a woman on my other walking route and we chatted for a long time, but she was not looking for a personal relationship.

 

[We Never Know]

A couple of nights ago, I met a man who sees me walking down the street he lives on and he stopped me and we chatted for about a half hour. Then he took me on a tour of his 5 acre property and introduced me to his brother who as sitting outside watching a movie on his tablet. It turns out we have a lot in common because his wife is very ill as is my husband. He could see I was suffering and he told me to stop by any time.

About a week ago, I also met a woman on my other walking route and we chatter for a long time, but she was not looking for a personal relationship.

Look for people to talk with, chat with, confide with, share with, Friends.
A personal relationship should be your last goal in my opinion at this time.

But I'm not there and could easily be wrong.

 

[RestlessSoul]

Sounds like your husband is being selfish, but that doesn’t mean he doesn’t care about you - it just means he is self obsessed, as many people are. Especially when they’re scared. And everyone is scared of dying when confronted with the fact, even if they don’t want to live.

When you finally do detach and let go - and I’m not saying that will be easy - you will be liberated. You will have finally set down the burden you courageously carried for all those years. I hope you get to enjoy your freedom without regret, and without remorse. You have done your duty, and that’s no small thing. Now, perhaps it’s time to think about your duty to yourself; as for what you will do with the rest of your life, God will direct you, if you let Him.

 

[crossfire]

Understandable, and there is nothing wrong with caring for someone, even if they aren't any good for you. The main thing is to not allow that care for them, to override your better judgement of self care.

^^this^^

 

[Truthseeker]

Sounds like your husband is being selfish, but that doesn’t mean he doesn’t care about you - it just means he is self obsessed, as many people are. Especially when they’re scared. And everyone is scared of dying when confronted with the fact, even if they don’t want to live.

It seems to be the case he is not scared of death, according to Susan. I'm just going by what Susan says, I don't know Lewis.

 

[Trailblazer]

What can they do? You know also you been isolated from them so long, you have no real prior relationship before recently, unlike your brother.

I do not know what they can do, but it was their idea to help me, it was not my idea.
Why should it matter if I have been an isolated from them for so long? If they listened to what I have gone through for the last 20 years they would understand why I am isolated.

What inner conflict! I pray that this inner conflict will resolve itself sometime soon. Also I sympathise with you for having such a husband. I don't think ultimately you will want to live alone. You could live alone in your house, but having friends in person in your area would be ideal. I can only be friends at a distance. I don't believe being your bff since I am so distant would be that helpful. You need other friends in person. I care for you, you know I do. I cry for you at this moment. For some reason this is the moment when I cry for you.

Thanks Duane... I do not think the conflict will be resolved until this situation with Lewis unfolds and I know where he is going after the hospital. I cannot even talk to him on the phone right now, I am too hurt. How would it help to talk to him anyway? It never did.

The psychiatrist said he was competent to make his own decisions, but that is just a clinical opinion. He has not made any important decisions since we have been married, I made all the decisions. That was not by choice, it was by deferral. He believes everything the doctors say without questioning. I think he is just looking for an excuse to die.

I have been trying to contact an old friend who is a Buddhist-Christian who believes in God. He is one year younger than me, has a MS degree in wildlife biology and worked for the federal government until he retired about 10 years ago. I met him back in 2009 when we first moved into this house because I responded to a Craigslist ad to buy his stereo. He is an animal lover but he has dogs. Like me he is closer to animals than people. He is very spiritual and kind. After I met him we kept in touch by e-mail but I lost his e-mail address. I left him a voice mail on the phone number I had for him but I don't know if he received it or not. I am going to leave another message. He is an introvert, a very private person who does not like a lot of company, like me.

He would understand what I have been through with Lewis because his wife of 23 years left him for another man and they got divorced and he was very hurt by that. I don't know if he ever remarried.

I hope for mercy for him. I am crying for him, too.

Why does he deserve mercy? I will let God decide that, that's not my department.

 

[crossfire]

I would rather not divulge what I am going through or what I fear is up ahead, I just want to talk about detachment and suffering. One reason I do not want to go into any details is because what people say very often only makes me feel worse and I cannot afford to feel any worse since I am walking a tightrope right now. I kindly ask you not to offer any religious platitudes about how suffering is good for us, as that is the very last thing I need. If you cannot help yourself, please do not reply to this thread.

Some believers claim that detachment is the way to reduce or eliminate suffering, that is a Buddhist as well as a Baha’i belief, but what does one do when they cannot detach from a situation since it involves another person who depends upon them, a person that they care about? I am trying to be detached from the situation but when does it become selfish to detach from the other person who is the source of my suffering, just to reduce my own suffering?

I feel like I want to die whenever I stop to think so I am staying as busy as possible so I won’t have time to think If I did not believe in God and the afterlife, I would probably kill myself before having to go through what is up ahead. This will probably be the most difficult test I have even endured in my life. If only I could be selfish and only care about myself this would not be that difficult, but I have never been one to think about my personal happiness.

When there is nobody left to turn to and no other hope, God is all I have. God is working overtime listening to my constant prayers just so I can stay afloat. I am asking God for guidance and assistance getting through this. God knows I would like to see a miracle but I am trying to believe that whatever happens is God’s will and I am 'trying' to accept that.

Dhammapada verse 166

166. Let one not neglect one's own welfare for the sake of another, however great. Clearly understanding one's own welfare, let one be intent upon the good.​

 

[Trailblazer]

I cry for you! Actually I fear fror his sfate in the next world, also. Easy for me to say at a distance, not knowing him at all, or knowing the details of all that.

I am trying to be fair but the problem is I have been too fair for too long. We needed a mediator long ago, a marriage counselor, but my counselors both said she didn't think it would help now because he is too set in his ways.

God got another earful tonight when I went out walking so He knows exactly where I stand.
Aside from that I say the remover of difficulties nonstop and the Tablet of Ahmad which I have memorized. What more can I do?

 

[Trailblazer]

Look for people to talk with, chat with, confide with, share with, Friends.
A personal relationship should be your last goal in my opinion at this time.

But I'm not there and could easily be wrong.

By personal relationship I meant a friend.

 

[Truthseeker]

I do not know what they can do, but it was their idea to help me, it was not my idea.
Why should it matter if I have been an isolated from them for so long? If they listened to what I have gone through for the last 20 years they would understand why I am isolated.

Thanks Duane... I do not think the conflict will be resolved until this situation with Lewis unfolds and I know where he is going after the hospital. I cannot even talk to him on the phone right now, I am too hurt. How would it help to talk to him anyway? It never did.

The psychiatrist said he was competent to make his own decisions, but that is just a clinical opinion. He has not made any important decisions since we have been married, I made all the decisions. That was not by choice, it was by deferral. He believes everything the doctors say without questioning. I think he is just looking for an excuse to die.

I have been trying to contact an old friend who is a Buddhist-Christian who believes in God. He is one year younger than me, has a MS degree in wildlife biology and worked for the federal government until he retired about 10 years ago. I met him back in 2009 when we first moved into this house because I responded to a Craigslist ad to buy his stereo. He is an animal lover but he has dogs. Like me he is closer to animals than people. He is very spiritual and kind. After I met him we kept in touch by e-mail but I lost his e-mail address. I left him a voice mail on the phone number I had for him but I don't know if he received it or not. I am going to leave another message. He is an introvert, a very private person who does not like a lot of company, like me.

He would understand what I have been through with Lewis because his wife of 23 years left him for another man and they got divorced and he was very hurt by that. I don't know if he ever remarried.

Why does he deserve mercy? I will let God decide that, that's not my department.

Call me by phone if that would help. My phone number and the best times to call are in my latest conversation to you. I have not been hurt by him, so it is easier for me to desire mercy for Lewis. I even desire mercy for Khomeini, you know the guy who is responsible for the Revolution of 1979 in Iran. The martyrs he killed have attained their reward, but he must be in hell.

 

[Trailblazer]

Sounds like your husband is being selfish, but that doesn’t mean he doesn’t care about you - it just means he is self obsessed, as many people are. Especially when they’re scared. And everyone is scared of dying when confronted with the fact, even if they don’t want to live.

When you finally do detach and let go - and I’m not saying that will be easy - you will be liberated. You will have finally set down the burden you courageously carried for all those years. I hope you get to enjoy your freedom without regret, and without remorse. You have done your duty, and that’s no small thing. Now, perhaps it’s time to think about your duty to yourself; as for what you will do with the rest of your life, God will direct you, if you let Him.

Your post deserved a Useful and a Friendly and a Winner but unfortunately I could only give one rating!

I am glad I finally posted about this here, I have been holding back for a long time.
I never thought of the angle of fear of death. If he is afraid I would never know it since he always talks about the afterlife in glowing terms, unlike me.

If he goes directly to hospice and dies without ever seeing me again then it will be a repeat of my childhood when my father died of a heart attack on the bus coming back from the Mayo clinic. That is why I had PTSD later.

I ask for guidance from God every night so hopefully He will lead the way. I am not always good at recognizing guidance I get unless it's obvious.

 

[firedragon]

I would rather not divulge what I am going through or what I fear is up ahead, I just want to talk about detachment and suffering. One reason I do not want to go into any details is because what people say very often only makes me feel worse and I cannot afford to feel any worse since I am walking a tightrope right now. I kindly ask you not to offer any religious platitudes about how suffering is good for us, as that is the very last thing I need. If you cannot help yourself, please do not reply to this thread.

Some believers claim that detachment is the way to reduce or eliminate suffering, that is a Buddhist as well as a Baha’i belief, but what does one do when they cannot detach from a situation since it involves another person who depends upon them, a person that they care about? I am trying to be detached from the situation but when does it become selfish to detach from the other person who is the source of my suffering, just to reduce my own suffering?

I feel like I want to die whenever I stop to think so I am staying as busy as possible so I won’t have time to think If I did not believe in God and the afterlife, I would probably kill myself before having to go through what is up ahead. This will probably be the most difficult test I have even endured in my life. If only I could be selfish and only care about myself this would not be that difficult, but I have never been one to think about my personal happiness.

When there is nobody left to turn to and no other hope, God is all I have. God is working overtime listening to my constant prayers just so I can stay afloat. I am asking God for guidance and assistance getting through this. God knows I would like to see a miracle but I am trying to believe that whatever happens is God’s will and I am 'trying' to accept that.

All I can say is that if I am there with you, if you were my mother, my sister or my friend, right here I would be right there with you. But this is an internet forum, so I can only tell you that you are right here in my thoughts and I love you to pieces.

Peace.

 

[Trailblazer]

Call me by phone if that would help. My phone number and the best times to call are in my latest conversation to you. I have not been hurt by him, so it is easier for me to desire mercy for Lewis. I even desire mercy for Khomeini, you know the guy who is responsible for the Revolution of 1979 in Iran. The martyrs he killed have attained their reward, but he must be in hell.

You are a lot nicer than me. I can be very nice but when hurt and when facing an injustice I can be very angry and harsh.

On another note, I can feel Lewis' presence in this house and that reminds me of a movie where a woman lost her young son and felt his presence in his room. This made me think of what Abdu'l-Baha said about there being 'no real separation' from this world and the next.

But you know that I am afraid of death and some of the reasons why. Something I never told you is that I project the misery of this life onto the next life and imagine living like that for all of eternity. I do hope God has mercy on my soul.

 

[Trailblazer]

It seems to be the case he is not scared of death, according to Susan. I'm just going by what Susan says, I don't know Lewis.

No, I don't think he is scared of death at all. I think he is scared of life.

 

[Trailblazer]

All I can say is that if I am there with you, if you were my mother, my sister or my friend, right here I would be right there with you. But this is an internet forum, so I can only tell you that you are right here in my thoughts and I love you to pieces.

Peace.

I sure wish I could find people as kind and caring as you in person, but they seem to be a rarity.

 

[firedragon]

I sure wish I could find people as kind and caring as you in person, but they seem to be a rarity.

You are there.

 

[Trailblazer]

@Truthseeker

Now that the cat is out of the bag, I think I ill post to you about this here instead of in the conversation. I was going to eat dinner but then I thought of one more thing.... This is awful, so maybe people who are sensitive might not want to read on.

When Lewis was wheeled out of surgery at the outpatient surgery center he was crying and saying he was afraid and he did not want to be alone, and I told him he will not be alone because there are all these nice doctors and nurses who care about him... Then he went off on the stretcher in the ambulance to the hospital and he has not been alone since...

I have not seen him since and I might never see him again. I hope he is happy now that he has all these medical staff doting on him and waiting on him and and foot. Now I am the one who is alone and may be for the rest of my life.

Lewis thinks the doctors care about him, telling him to give up on treatment and go to hospice, he is so naive. I am the only person in the world who ever cared about him and now he has thrown me away like an old pair of shoes. He knows I would take care of him at home until he dies, that I would never abandon him, but he would rather go to hospice and live the remaining time he has left with complete strangers. The question is why do I still care about him?

He wants to go to hospice because he does not want to live and he thinks I would make him seek treatment. I only wish someone cared that much about me if I had cancer.

Now I am going to try to eat and try to go to bed.

 

[PearlSeeker]

This person is my husband of 37 years who has Stage IV bladder cancer. He had been sickly for a long time but nobody had any idea that it was cancer and it was misdiagnosed and mismanaged by the doctors. There will be a lawsuit if that is determined by the law firms that I have a case but now is not the time to be filing lawsuits.

My husband could try to fight this cancer by getting any available treatments, and since we live close to Seattle we are near one of the best cancer treatment centers in the country, but he has chosen not to fight. He is in the hospital 30 miles north of here and I have not seen him since his admission on July 5. He does not care about me and the suffering I will have to endure after he dies, he only cares about himself and not being in pain, but the pain he has is only bladder spasms and it is nothing like the real cancer pain many cancer patients have to endure.

It is not as if we have had a loving relationship. We have been living like roommates who barely get along for over 20 years, but he is still my husband and I still love him even though he does not care about me. I have taken care of him for 37 years and although he worked for 23 of those years, he did nothing else. I took care of everything.

We never had any children so I have no grandchildren and I have no other family left except one older brother who lives in Colorado, but he does not care about me either. He had not called me in years and about a week ago he finally called me for another reason at which time he found out about my husband. All he did was listen and at the end of the phone call he nonchalantly said "Let me know if Lewis dies." I have told that to many people, complete strangers, and they cannot believe a brother could be that insensitive and uncaring. I get more support and love from the cats.

People just assume that everyone has someone, friends or family, but such is not always the case and it is very hurtful when people assume that although I know it isn't their fault. Some Baha'is in the Baha'i community where I live have expressed some concern and desire to help but they do not really want to be bothered by this so they are not really there to help, especially when I carry on about God. I am in essence completely alone except for my counselor and the people on this forum.

Cancer is a scourge. I cannot understand why a loving God would allow such a disease to destroy the lives of so many people, which is one reason why I do not believe God is loving. However, I still cry out to God because I believe God is all-powerful, so He is the only entity that can help me at this point. The way I feel does not make sense to most people, believers or atheists, because they would not believe in a God they felt this way about, but I stayed with my husband too, in spite of him not being loving.

For years, I have known that my husband does not care about me because he never did anything but say "I care" but now that other people are involved in his care they have seen it, as it is right out in the open for all to see. When the doctor at the hospital gave him alternatives for where he wants to go after he gets out of the hospital and suggested Hospice House in the city where the hospital is 30 miles north of here, he said that he would like to go there because he does not want to go home, since he is afraid he will be in pain again, but he could have the same pain medications at home as in the hospice facility.

After 37 years that I care for him he has not even called me from the hospital and he does not care if he ever sees me again, all he cares about is himself and his physical pain. I do not really want him at home but I was willing to care for him with the help of visiting nurses. Right now I just want to forget I ever married him, but that won't be easy. I should add that I do not depends upon him for anything so I don't need him the way he needed me. I will have the same income after he dies and the three houses paid in full and more than the equivalent in stocks and bonds and money in the bank. I am fully self-sufficient. There is a part of me that wants a new life perhaps with someone else but there is a part of me who wants to live alone for the rest of my life.

I should also mention another reason he does not care if he dies, because he believes in an afterlife that is going to be so glorious, and he'd rather be there than here. This is what religious beliefs do to people. I also believe in an afterlife but it won't necessarily be glorious for him when he dies and realizes all the suffering he put me through and how I am suffering now. But God is all-merciful even if that is not just. In Baha'i parlance it is said that God's mercy exceeds His justice. Something is wrong with that, but who doesn't want mercy, even if they don't deserve it?

Sad to hear that TB. You are a good person and you are ready to be there for your husband. It hurts that he is refusing this and only cares about himself...

I will remember you in prayer. I still pray despite being at odds with God/faith. I hope someone/something will alleviate your suffering. Maybe the words of Serenity Prayer will help:

God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
courage to change the things I can,
and wisdom to know the difference.

Take care!