Did Jesus say he was God???

[Pegg]

Straight from the horses mouth

John 10:34-36 "Jesus answered them: “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I said: “YOU are gods”’? 35 If he called ‘gods’ those against whom the word of God came, and yet the Scripture cannot be nullified, 36 do YOU say to me whom the Father sanctified and dispatched into the world, ‘You blaspheme,’ because I said, I am God’s Son?

If he was trying to say that he was God himself, then he made a bit of a mess of it dont you think?

 

[ATAT]

So, what does it mean to be 'God's Son'?

If I wrote, 'God's Messenger' is at the door. We would both conclude the person at the door is not God Himself, but someone speaking on behalf of God.

If I wrote, 'God's Universe', again, the Universe is not God, it was made by and belongs to God, but is not God.

If I wrote, "God's Daughter", again, this person is special, important, made by God, owned by God, but nobody would think that someone claiming to be 'God's Daughter' is claiming to be God Himself.

She might speak for God, embody God, we might see God in her spiritually, etc.

Jesus preferred, 'Son of Man' and said we are all 'God's children'.

Mat 5:9 Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God.

Julius Caesar was assassinated just 30 years before Jesus was born. Caesar was assassinated, in part, because he claimed to be a son of a god. To the Romans, not everybody was made by God.
Great leaders were sons of gods who mated with women, bad peoples were made from excrement.

The Jewish idea was unknown, we are all made by God, we are all God's children.

To the local Roman authorities, there was a confusion. Any talk of being a son of a god meant you were claiming to be a rebel leader.

Jesus wanted to be a spiritual leader, not a leader of arms.

He also held the Jewish value of we are all God's children because, unlike some, he believed that God made all of mankind, even if your mother concieved you out of wedlock, you still deserved to be considered a Son of God.

There's no major figure in all of history who went through so much trouble as to claim NOT to be God as Jesus, every chance he could, he either said God 'sent' him or that he, Jesus, was Son of Man.

If pressed, yes, he, like all of us, is a Son of God. Because, unlike Roman religion, that was the Jewish religion.

Clash of cultures.

Naturally, when the Romans converted, en masse to Jesus' religion, this subtlety was lost because the Romans were not Jewish and didn't distinguish.

 

[look3467]

To God alone is all glory, power and might, and no one else!

Jesus, being the Son of God in complete obedience to every sin of mankind must in His body as God, nail it to the cross, once and for all time.

Ye are gods, as in independent entities from God, can not live apart from God, therefore must die.

But because God so loved the world that He gave His only Son, to be the appropriation for all mankind, in His body took the sins of the world to end the curse of eternal separation, meaning death, and reconciling all back to the Father in only one body, and being that that one body had the full authority as God, to do so.

Therefore, if Jesus had taken any credit for being as God, would have been correctly labeled, blasphemer.

Thus, to only give credit to God alone, Jesus had to be unconditional subservient to God, in order to be that perfect sacrifical lamb, otherwise, had He taken any credit, His whole mission would had bee aborted.

When Jesus was tempted by the devil, Jesus could have overruled the devils gifts, but instead was completely obedient to God for the purpose of His sacrifice.

How else, of all humanity can you find one individual who would dare give up his own soul to save the world?

Only one reason, and that is that God alone, could do it, and not as a spirit, but as a spirit body prepared for that purpose.

Now, if God alone could only do it, then Jesus, with the power of attorney, as God, was God in the delivering of the world back to the Father.

Blessings, AJ

 

[ATAT]

Let's see,

1. They accuse Jesus

2. of Blasphemy

3. for claiming to be God.

1. Just because your opponants accuse you of saying something, does not mean that's what you said.

2. Everyone agrees that claiming to be God would be blasphemy (if you are not God.)

3. If Jesus was claiming to be God, he could have said, 'Yes. I am God."

If Jesus was NOT claiming to be God, he would need to explain how what he was saying was not
1. what they thought he said
2. how what he, Jesus, said, was not 'blasphemy'
3. he would need to clarify what he claimed to be.

1. He said it's OK to claim to be 'gods'. The word must have more than one meaning. In Hebrew, it does. Adon simply means master, it's applied to humans, too.

2. Jesus proves that what he, Jesus said, was not what they thought. He proves from the bible that it's OK to claim to be type human 'gods'.

3. Jesus sums it up by NOT agreeing and not claiming to be God, rather, he re-directs and says that he's only claiming to be God's Son.

In Hebrew, it's OK to claim to be God's Son. Jesus says we are all children ("sons") of God if we are peace makers.

Again, if Jesus wanted us to think he was God, he could have said it a lot shorter: "Yes. I am God."

If I'm going to hell for failing to believe Jesus is God, why would Jesus obfuscate it by saying it's OK for men to call themselves 'gods'? Is Jesus trying to trick me into hell? No. He was trying to explain how claiming to be God's Son is not a claim to be 'God'.
(Note: There are no capital letters in speach nor Hebrew writing.)




Hebrews 5

1Every high priest is selected from among men and is appointed to represent them in matters related to God, to offer gifts and sacrifices for sins. 2He is able to deal gently with those who are ignorant and are going astray, since he himself is subject to weakness. 3This is why he has to offer sacrifices for his own sins, as well as for the sins of the people.
4No one takes this honor upon himself; he must be called by God, just as Aaron was. 5So Christ also did not take upon himself the glory of becoming a high priest. But God said to him,
"You are my Son;
today I have become your Father.[a]"[b] 6And he says in another place,
"You are a priest forever,
in the order of Melchizedek."[c] 7During the days of Jesus' life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with loud cries and tears to the one who could save him from death, and he was heard because of his reverent submission. 8Although he was a son, he learned obedience from what he suffered 9and, once made perfect, he became the source of eternal salvation for all who obey him 10and was designated by God to be high priest in the order of Melchizedek.

cut and paste from Wikipedia proving that Mechizedek was not God in the flesh:

Melchizedek (from Hebrew מַלְכִּי־צֶדֶק melech-i-tzédek, literally "righteousness is my king") is an enigmatic figure twice mentioned in the Hebrew Bible, also known as the Old Testament. Melchizedek is mentioned as the King of Salem, and priest of God Most High, in the time of the biblical patriarch Abram. He brought out bread and wine, blessed Abram, and received tithes from him, Genesis 14:18-20. Reference is made to him in Psalm 110:4 where the victorious ruler is declared to be "priest forever after the order of Melchizedek."

Luke 2:52And Jesus grew in wisdom and stature, and in favor with God and men.

 

[look3467]

Sounds to me you're confused?

Very simple!

God created and God saves His creation..... period.

What you do is up to you!

What you want to believe is also up to you!

No one except Jesus is accountable for your soul, as God, saving God's creation.

If you think this life is not hell, then you must be in heaven.

So, be it as you wish.

Blessings, AJ

 

[URAVIP2ME]

When Jesus was on earth did he think that life was hell?

Or rather, didn't Jesus go to hell only after he died ? -Acts 2vs27,31

Jesus even believed the Biblical hell was the common stone-cold grave of mankind.

[Ecc 9v5; Psalm 6v5; 13v3; 115v17; 146v4; Daniel 12vs2,13; John 11vs11-14]

 

[look3467]

When Jesus was on earth did he think that life was hell?

Or rather, didn't Jesus go to hell only after he died ? -Acts 2vs27,31

Jesus even believed the Biblical hell was the common stone-cold grave of mankind.

[Ecc 9v5; Psalm 6v5; 13v3; 115v17; 146v4; Daniel 12vs2,13; John 11vs11-14]

Jesus knew only what He saw the Father do, meaning limited to that.

Now what He thought other than that I have no clue.

Obviously, He must of known what it was that we had to be delivered from, in order for Him to want to carry out His mission till the end.

Jesus went to what is deemed hell, other words for it is prison where the departed soul where kept until being visited by Jesus.

Hell can also be termed life without God.

Jesus understood, by what I am able to understand by scripture, that He knew only to be obedient to the Fathers will.

This point is affirmed here: Isa 42:19 Who is blind, but my servant? or deaf, as my messenger that I sent? who is blind as he that is perfect, and blind as the LORD'S servant?

You see, Jesus mission was totally focused in doing the Fathers will.

Blessings, AJ

 

[AntonBatey]

Jesus clearly was not god. He always said that he was subordinate to the Father, both on earth and after.

 

[look3467]

Jesus clearly was not god. He always said that he was subordinate to the Father, both on earth and after.

How else would He be in total obedient compliant?

Blessings, AJ

 

[URAVIP2ME]

How else would He be in total obedient compliant?
Blessings, AJ

With Adam being created perfectly sound in mind and body, being sinless, Adam could have been in total obedient compliance to God's will or law.

Sinless Jesus also had human perfection of sound mind and body as Adam originally had, so Jesus, like perfect Adam, could be compliant in the same way Adam could have been compliant or obedient to God's will.

Adam chose to corrupt himself [Deut 32v5]
Adam's will chose Satan's will [2Tim 2v26] over God's will.
Jesus chose to do 'God's will' over his 'own will', and over 'Satan's will'
by remaining compliant to God's will and purpose.
[Mt 26v39;Luke 22v42; John 4v34; 5v30; 6v38]

We all have those same choices,
Our will, Satan's will or God's will.

The only difference is that Satan, Adam and Jesus had perfection.
Job [2v4] and the rest of us with human imperfection, can only comply in a relative sense until the time arrives of Jesus peaceful 1000-year reign over earth when sheep-like ones will gain everlasting life which would mean gaining absolute human perfection in order to live forever. -Matt 25v32.

 

[look3467]

With Adam being created perfectly sound in mind and body, being sinless, Adam could have been in total obedient compliance to God's will or law.>>>URAVIP2ME

I will accept that statement only as applying to Jesus as a type of Adam, and as being a second Adam, Jesus was Obediant to the letter.

Adam chose to corrupt himself

It was a designed fault of which needed redeeming.

We cannot have choice unless God gives us something other than good to choose from.
Hence, the tree of good and evil placed expressionlessly for that reason as a designed fault.

Adam's will chose Satan's will

The will of God was that His creation have the ability to choose.

Jesus chose to do 'God's will' over his 'own will', and over 'Satan's will'

Can you see the will of the Father in both?

We all have those same choices,
Our will, Satan's will or God's will.

Yes, in the following order:
God's will, Satan's will, and our will.

The only difference is that Satan, Adam and Jesus had perfection.

Jesus had perfection, Satan was what the condition of Adam found Himself in: Lost!

..."the rest of us with human imperfection, can only comply in a relative sense until the time arrives of Jesus"...

Jesus has arrived and has completed His mission, and that was to gift us with the righteousness of God for the redemption of our souls.

Why wait, accept Jesus now and live forever! But first, we must shed this old shell.

Blessings, AJ

 

[URAVIP2ME]

RE:.... first, we must shed this old shell.

Do the sheep of Matthew 25v32 shed their shell?
There is no mention of them dying before they have everlasting life in view.
The sheep can remain alive on earth, and keep on living on earth right into the start of Jesus millennial reign over earth. The sheep-like ones will not need to shed their shell, but their shell, so to speak, can gain the same human perfection of sound mind and body that Adam originally had at his creation.
What makes our 'shell' old? Isn't it sin? Sin leads to death.
If one could stop sinning he would not die.
Without death there would be no sickness leading to death.
That is why Isaiah said [33v24] the time will come when No resident will say, "I am sick!"
-Micah 4vs3,4; Rev 21vs3,4.

 

[look3467]

Why wait, accept Jesus now and live forever! But first, we must shed this old shell.>>>Look3467

Why wait.....meaning ...can be had right now.

Otherwise.....having to wait till this shell is shed in order to meet with Jesus.

Blessings, AJ

 

[PhosphorylatedHypnoMonkey]

Why wait.....meaning ...can be had right now.
Otherwise.....having to wait till this shell is shed in order to meet with Jesus.
Blessings, AJ

Jesus is a poetic concept is he not?. Now a concept Is hard to swallow without proof.

What proof can you give me AJ (without referring to the bible) that Jesus actually existed??

 

[logician]

"Did Jesus say he was God??? "

Did god say he was Jesus?

 

[look3467]

Jesus is a poetic concept is he not?. Now a concept Is hard to swallow without proof.

The non-existence of God is a concept is it not? Can you prove that He does not exist?

My view is that Jesus existed as written, for I choose to place my faith in Him as my God, Savior and friend.

The only proof that I can give is only as a personal testimony of how God in Jesus has been by my side, how He has blessed me, has given contentment all the years of my life.

The hope of life after this one.

Apart from that, I dare say, there would be nothing for me to live for.

For if God did not exist, I would be absolutely nothing in the universe of things.

Blessings, AJ

 

[look3467]

"Did Jesus say he was God??? "

Did god say he was Jesus?

Because of the attitude of servitude, as a man, Jesus could not say He was God, for otherwise, fulfillment of the law, by crossing of every T, and dotting of every I, could not be fully realized, had He stated He was God.

God did say this: Isa 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.


other than that, you'll have to take it by faith.

Blessings, AJ

 

[logician]

Because of the attitude of servitude, as a man, Jesus could not say He was God, for otherwise, fulfillment of the law, by crossing of every T, and dotting of every I, could not be fully realized, had He stated He was God.

God did say this: Isa 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.


other than that, you'll have to take it by faith.

Blessings, AJ

I think all of this is faith-based.

 

[javajo]

Jesus said he was the Son of God and that God was his Father, which the religious leaders considered blasphemy for making himself equal with God and so plotted to have him killed. There are verses which tell us Jesus is God like in John 1, he was with God and he was God...a verse calls him God our Saviour, and another says God purchased us with his own blood. One in Colossians says Jesus created everything and by him all things consist. I consider God to be a triune being: Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

 

[Blackdog22]

Jesus said he was the Son of God and that God was his Father, which the religious leaders considered blasphemy for making himself equal with God and so plotted to have him killed. There are verses which tell us Jesus is God like in John 1, he was with God and he was God...a verse calls him God our Saviour, and another says God purchased us with his own blood. One in Colossians says Jesus created everything and by him all things consist. I consider God to be a triune being: Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

You are correct. I believe these are the verses you are referring to.

John 14:7-10 [7] If you really knew me, you would know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him." [8] Philip said, "Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us." [9] Jesus answered: "Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, `Show us the Father'? [10] Don't you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you are not just my own. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work.

John 10:30 "I and the Father are one."



John 10:31-33 [31] Again the Jews picked up stones to stone him, [32] but Jesus said to them, "I have shown you many great miracles from the Father. For which of these do you stone me?" [33] "We are not stoning you for any of these," replied the Jews, "but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God."


Luke 22:66-70 [66] At daybreak the council of the elders of the people, both the chief priests and teachers of the law, met together, and Jesus was led before them. [67] "If you are the Christ, " they said, "tell us." Jesus answered, "If I tell you, you will not believe me, [68] and if I asked you, you would not answer. [69] But from now on, the Son of Man will be seated at the right hand of the mighty God." [70] They all asked, "Are you then the Son of God?" He replied, "You are right in saying I am."


Assuming someone is arguing from a Biblical perspective. On what basis can this be argued?