• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Did Jesus say he was God???

kai

kai

ragamuffin
Popeyesays said:
Yet we can agree that Christianity is the religion of God. There is no doubt. Even when some would like to drive little wedges between us. Christians do not doubt that the God of Abreaham is the God of Jesus, neither do Baha`i's.

Regards,
Scott
Click to expand...
oh yes Christianity is the religion of a God, and they all believe their god is the god of Abraham, that all came from trying to legitimize each new faith at its beginning, its just i don't think Abraham has a say in it anymore do you. people just use him to justify their own "true" faith. otherwise lets face it , it would be a new religion with a new god and far less likely to take root so---------- they give it some roots

Jeremy Mason is not likely to accept bahai any more than you are going to accept jesus as part of the trinity so the diferences are not little wedges but huge great chunks of dogma no matter how much you argue over scripture its all down to faith.

if it as down to minor wedges there would only be one religion of abraham not four majors and countless minors
 
Popeyesays

Popeyesays

Well-Known Member
kai said:
oh yes Christianity is the religion of a God, and they all believe their god is the god of Abraham, that all came from trying to legitimize each new faith at its beginning, its just i don't think Abraham has a say in it anymore do you. people just use him to justify their own "true" faith. otherwise lets face it , it would be a new religion with a new god and far less likely to take root so---------- they give it some roots

Jeremy Mason is not likely to accept bahai any more than you are going to accept jesus as part of the trinity so the diferences are not little wedges but huge great chunks of dogma no matter how much you argue over scripture its all down to faith.

if it as down to minor wedges there would only be one religion of abraham not four majors and countless minors
Click to expand...

"I'm Henery the Eighth, I am.
Henery the Eighth, I am, Iam . . . . . "

Regards,
Scott
 
UnityNow101

UnityNow101

Well-Known Member
As long as we are all lead by the need to feel secure or right, than we can and never will come to know the truth. As I have said before, debates such as these are of very little importance. Is Jesus God? Is there real evidence to support either side of the argument? No, unless you accept the words of a book as absolute truth. And there is no reasonable person that would do such a thing. And if you do accept one book as truth, what is going to make you drop that one and believe another. A truly Divine experience? It is highly unlikely. More often than not, it will be just another attempt of mental security and the need to feel right. Why defend something which cannot be proven? If God is the author of the Bible, Koran or Bahai scriptures, is he not able to prove it in other ways besides words written hundreds and even thousands of years ago? If not, than he can hardly be called all-powerful and there is a real question as to whether you should be worshipping such a being.
 
Jeremy Mason

Jeremy Mason

Well-Known Member
Popeyesays said:
Here is the section in question in a more literal translation (oung's Literal Translation):


"
John 1


1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God;
2this one was in the beginning with God;
3all things through him did happen, and without him happened not even one thing that hath happeJohn 1


1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God;
2this one was in the beginning with God;
3all things through him did happen, and without him happened not even one thing that hath happened.
4In him was life, and the life was the light of men, 5and the light in the darkness did shine, and the darkness did not perceive it. ned.

4In him was life, and the life was the light of men, 5and the light in the darkness did shine, and the darkness did not perceive it.

Note the pronoun before the phrase in red. This is a clear reference to GOD, not the Word.

Not that ou understand the meaning of "the Word" much at all.

Regards,
Scott
Click to expand...

Scott, for a minute there I thought you and I were on the same page. You have quoted Manifestation of God in other threads. Think about what you are saying. God manifested in human form, not just spiritually but physically. The word manifest should clue you in. right?
 
Popeyesays

Popeyesays

Well-Known Member
Jeremy Mason said:
Scott, for a minute there I thought you and I were on the same page. You have quoted Manifestation of God in other threads. Think about what you are saying. God manifested in human form, not just spiritually but physically. The word manifest should clue you in. right?
Click to expand...

God made a Prophet "Manifest". He did not manifest Himself anymore than He already has. "God the Most Manifest of the Manifest, Most Hidden of the Hidden."

I agree that Jesus is the closest thing man can perceive to God, as was Moses, or Muhammed, or Buddha or Baha`u'llah or any of the others.

God does not pour Himself into the form of a man and remain God, one cannot pour the waters of the earth into a teacup--one just gets an almost full teacup (some will be lost to the effects of splashing) and a huge puddle. The puddle remains God and the teacup stays a teacup.

On the other hand any human spirit filled to that point with the Holy SPirit will appear to be God. So we are not arguing as much as you think.

Regards,
Scott
 
kai

kai

ragamuffin
Popeyesays said:
In other words, Kai: "Second verse, same as the first . . . . ."

Regards,
Scott
Click to expand...
Oh i am well aware of the fact i am repeating myself ,crying in the wilderness so to speak, the argument is pointless , unless you are trying to convert one another, there is no point to the argument
you have different faiths
you beleive different things
your Gods have different natures

to be blunt you argue over ancient scripture like its historical fact , when its all about faith . yur view of God is of the nature of Allah, unknowable, inaccessible which is of course your beleif and you are entitled to it

Jeremy is a christian his beleifs are different and he is entitled to them as you are to yours . but at the end of the day you are arguing over beleifs no amount of pondering over ancient manuscripts trying to put over what someone meant by this phrase or that will turn either of you from your own set of beleifs because brush me off if you like, but the fact is your Gods are different .and you both think you have the truth.
 
B

baybars

New Member
There must be two Gods. One is the Hebrew God of the OT,the one
who commanded Joshua to kill every man, woman and child
in Jericho,the one who drowned countless people in the flood,
the one who leveled Sodom and Gomorrah.The other God is
the one who Jesus preached about,the understanding God,
the God of love and kindness. Which is the real God ? One of the two
mentioned above, is it THE WORD,is it Jesus,or is it whoever you want it
to be?
 
Jeremy Mason

Jeremy Mason

Well-Known Member
baybars said:
There must be two Gods. One is the Hebrew God of the OT,the one
who commanded Joshua to kill every man, woman and child
in Jericho,the one who drowned countless people in the flood,
the one who leveled Sodom and Gomorrah.The other God is
the one who Jesus preached about,the understanding God,
the God of love and kindness. Which is the real God ? One of the two
mentioned above, is it THE WORD,is it Jesus,or is it whoever you want it
to be?
Click to expand...

Welcome to the forum. I feel sometimes that when people debate religion, some of the essence is lost. My best advice to you is read the Bible with an open mind and heart and God will do the rest.

If you have all ready read it, then this is a great place to expose yourself to many interpretations and only you can choose the ones that fit within the context of how the Bible illustrates it's case.
 
Jeremy Mason

Jeremy Mason

Well-Known Member
Popeyesays said:
God made a Prophet "Manifest". He did not manifest Himself anymore than He already has. "God the Most Manifest of the Manifest, Most Hidden of the Hidden."

I agree that Jesus is the closest thing man can perceive to God, as was Moses, or Muhammed, or Buddha or Baha`u'llah or any of the others.

God does not pour Himself into the form of a man and remain God, one cannot pour the waters of the earth into a teacup--one just gets an almost full teacup (some will be lost to the effects of splashing) and a huge puddle. The puddle remains God and the teacup stays a teacup.

On the other hand any human spirit filled to that point with the Holy SPirit will appear to be God. So we are not arguing as much as you think.

Regards,
Scott
Click to expand...

Who do you feel is going to sit at the right hand of the Father?
 
Dirty Penguin

Dirty Penguin

Master Of Ceremony
Revelation 3:12
All who are victorious will become pillars in the Temple of my God, and they will never have to leave it. And I will write my God's name on them, and they will be citizens in the city of my God--the new Jerusalem that comes down from heaven from my God. And they will have my new name inscribed upon them.

He explicitly informs John he has a god. I'm quite sure John did not take him to mean he was God.

If Yeshua is God then at this point there should be no statements made like this. Regardless of how you try to spin it....In John 20:17 way before your mis-interpreted John 20:28 Yeshua tells the women he has a god..("But go find my brothers and tell them that I am ascending to my Father and your Father, my God and your God.")....then as you can see right here...after the ascension he flat out says it THREE times he has a god.

NO...Yeshua is not God, he did not claim to be, he did not teach that he was, nor did his followers believe that he was.....
 
Popeyesays

Popeyesays

Well-Known Member
Jeremy Mason said:
Are you helping God?
Click to expand...

To some degree, yes. Not that He needs my particular help, the will of God cannot be thwarted. I am one of His servants and I abide by His will--as best I understand it.

That does not mean He NEEDS anything at all. He is The Self-Subsistent.

Regards,
Scott
 
kai

kai

ragamuffin
Popeyesays said:
To some degree, yes. Not that He needs my particular help, the will of God cannot be thwarted. I am one of His servants and I abide by His will--as best I understand it.

That does not mean He NEEDS anything at all. He is The Self-Subsistent.

Regards,
Scott
Click to expand...
than why does he need prayers, submission or prophets ?
and i suppose you are going to say its not for him/her/it its for us, then to what end does he need us. if he is the self subsistent
 
Popeyesays

Popeyesays

Well-Known Member
kai said:
than why does he need prayers, submission or prophets ?
and i suppose you are going to say its not for him/her/it its for us, then to what end does he need us. if he is the self subsistent
Click to expand...

That's a mystery, Kai/ Itg's b est described in The Arabic Hidden Words:
"O SON OF MAN! Veiled in My immemorial being and in the ancient eternity of My essence, I knew My love for thee; therefore I created thee, have engraved on thee Mine image and revealed to thee My beauty. You can google the term "self subsistent" and find a wiki article on SPinoza:
"Spinozism is the pantheistic philosophical system of Baruch Spinoza which defines "God" as a singular self-subsistent substance, and both matter and thought as attributes of such. Spinoza claimed that the third kind of knowledge, intuition, is the highest kind attainable."

Regards,
Scott
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top