Did Jesus say he was God???

[American Patriot]

It means "Deity" in the Qualitative sense, not in the Direct Nominative as in an entity.

de·i·ty

   /ˈdi

ɪ

ti/ Show Spelled[dee-i-tee] Show IPA
–noun, plural -ties. 1. a god or goddess.

2. divine character or nature, especially that of the Supreme Being; divinity.

3. the estate or rank of a god: The king attained deity after his death.


From your own link: The word "Belonging" clearly indicates a quality.

Col 2:9
(9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the deity bodily.

Now where does the bible say the elders were seated on thrones of GLORY?

Its nice to see you finally can post after you have been destroyed! You're just trying to pick apart every little thing but you cant do it because it's scripture!

 

[Shermana]

Col 2:9
(9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the deity bodily.

Now where does the bible say the elders were seated on thrones of GLORY?

Its nice to see you finally can post after you have been destroyed! You're just trying to pick apart every little thing but you cant do it because it's scripture!

1 Samuel 2:8

King James Bible
He raiseth up the poor out of the dust, and lifteth up the beggar from the dunghill, to set them among princes, and to make them inherit the throne of glory: for the pillars of the earth are the LORD'S, and he hath set the world upon them.

Isaiah 22:2

American Standard Version
And I will fasten him as a nail in a sure place; and he shall be for a throne of glory to his father's house.

 

[American Patriot]

1 Samuel 2:8

King James Bible
He raiseth up the poor out of the dust, and lifteth up the beggar from the dunghill, to set them among princes, and to make them inherit the throne of glory: for the pillars of the earth are the LORD'S, and he hath set the world upon them.

Isaiah 22:2

American Standard Version
And I will fasten him as a nail in a sure place; and he shall be for a throne of glory to his father's house.

None of these say the elders are sitting on the throne of glory!

 

[Shermana]

None of these say the elders are sitting on the throne of glory!

Obviously, if the Father causes the souls of the righteous to inherit "the throne of glory" the overall concept is not exclusive to him or Yashua, it's a relative concept, some thrones may be more glorious based on their rank.

The word is often used as "Honor" instead of "glory".

 

[Pegg]

None of these say the elders are sitting on the throne of glory!

Matthew 19:27 Then Peter said to him in reply: “Look! We have left all things and followed you; what actually will there be for us?” 28 Jesus said to them: “Truly I say to YOU, In the re-creation, when the Son of man sits down upon his glorious throne, YOU who have followed me will also yourselves sit upon twelve thrones..."

Luke 22:30 "that YOU may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom, and sit on thrones to judge the twelve tribes of Israel."

Revelation 20:4 And I saw thrones, and there were those who sat down on them, and power of judging was given them... And they came to life and ruled as kings with the Christ for a thousand years"

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Actually you're wrong again!

There is one throne in heaven

Actually "you're" wrong. There are more than one throne mentioned in Revelation if you read the Greek. The elders are seated upon theirs, "God" is seated upon his and Yeshua is "standing"......

 

[Dirty Penguin]

yes, because he is talking about God. God is on his throne in heaven. Jesus is beside him.
That is also the vision that the disciple Stephen saw when he was given a vision of heaven opened up... Acts 7:55 But he, being full of holy spirit, gazed into heaven and caught sight of God’s glory and of Jesus standing at God’s right hand, 56 and he said: “Look! I behold the heavens opened up and the Son of man standing at God’s right hand."

Perfect quote...

going by that logic, if God cannot be contained on his own heavenly throne, how can he be contained in a mortal human body? We are like grains of sand...we are mere dust... how can you believe that God could be contained in such a flimsy piece of physical material???

I think I've asked this question before as well.

But anyway, to save this from turning into an argument, you are free to worship Jesus as God if thats what you desire to do.
But have you considered who you will worship when Jesus hands the kingdom back to his Father?
1Cor 15:24 Next, the end, when he hands over the kingdom to his God and Father, when he has brought to nothing all government and all authority and power. 25 For he must rule as king until [God] has put all enemies under his feet. ...then the Son himself will also subject himself to the One who subjected all things to him, that God may be all things to everyone"

Another perfect quote from your scripture and it's what I've been saying all along...These faithful followers, the creatures and angels in heaven, John as well as Yeshua saw "God" separate from Yeshua.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Where does the bible say they are seated on thrones of GLORY?

While Pegg has pointed out Rev 20:4 I must note that a few pages ago I also gave an earlier verse where it actually says the elders were seated upon their thrones.

Rev 4:4
καὶ κυκλόθεν τοῦ θρόνου θρόνοι εἴκοσι καὶ τέσσαρες καὶ ἐπὶ τοὺς θρόνους εἴδον τοὺς εἴκοσι καὶ τέσσαρας πρεσβυτέρους καθημένους περιβεβλημένους ἐν ἱματίοις λευκοῖς καὶ ἔσχον ἐπὶ τὰς κεφαλὰς αὐτῶν στεφάνους χρυσοῦς

And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold.


DP:
'And round about the throne were twenty four thrones and upon the thrones I saw twenty four elders sitting........'


Revelation is an easy read once you look beyond the English language.

 

[ApostolicPeter]

While Pegg has pointed out Rev 20:4 I must note that a few pages ago I also gave an earlier verse where it actually says the elders were seated upon their thrones.

Rev 4:4
καὶ κυκλόθεν τοῦ θρόνου θρόνοι εἴκοσι καὶ τέσσαρες καὶ ἐπὶ τοὺς θρόνους εἴδον τοὺς εἴκοσι καὶ τέσσαρας πρεσβυτέρους καθημένους περιβεβλημένους ἐν ἱματίοις λευκοῖς καὶ ἔσχον ἐπὶ τὰς κεφαλὰς αὐτῶν στεφάνους χρυσοῦς

And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold.


DP:
'And round about the throne were twenty four thrones and upon the thrones I saw twenty four elders sitting........'


Revelation is an easy read once you look beyond the English language.

Everybody sure has wasted a lot of time barking up a dead tree. Did you even read Patriot's simple one-line post???? How can you understand the Bible when you can't grasp a simple statement???

AmericanPatriot said:
"None of these say the elders are sitting on the throne of glory!"

 

[ApostolicPeter]

Matthew 19:27 Then Peter said to him in reply: “Look! We have left all things and followed you; what actually will there be for us?” 28 Jesus said to them: “Truly I say to YOU, In the re-creation, when the Son of man sits down upon his glorious throne, YOU who have followed me will also yourselves sit upon twelve thrones..."

Luke 22:30 "that YOU may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom, and sit on thrones to judge the twelve tribes of Israel."

Revelation 20:4 And I saw thrones, and there were those who sat down on them, and power of judging was given them... And they came to life and ruled as kings with the Christ for a thousand years"

Everybody sure has wasted a lot of time barking up a dead tree. Did you even read Patriot's simple one-line post???? How can you understand the Bible when you can't grasp a simple English statement???

AmericanPatriot said:
"None of these say the elders are sitting on the throne of glory!"

 

[ApostolicPeter]

House of Yahweh and JW's have TWO of everything:

TWO KINGS
TWO FATHERS
TWO SPIRITS (actually three counting the Holy Ghost)
TWO SAVIORS
TWO CREATORS
TWO COMING
TWO JUDGES
TWO REWARDERS
TWO FIRST AND LASTS
TWO BEGINNING AND ENDS
TWO G/gods
TWO Lords
TWO MAKERS
TWO LIFE-GIVERS
TWO HOLY ONES, yes, TWO HOLY *** ONES *** :biglaugh:
TWO THRONES
TWO SEATED ON THE THRONES
TWO MIGHTY GODS (Ps 50:1, Is 9:6)
TWO ALMIGHTIES (Col 2:10) FYI, I am COMPLETE IN JESUS, why do I need another?
TWO THAT RAISED JESUS FROM THE DEAD

This is polytheism, paganism, and anti-scriptural. :yes:

I am a true monotheist, I believe in ONE of all the above. I worship Jesus! :bow:

The Bible teaches there is ONLY ONE Creator: Is 44:24, 45:18
The Bible teaches there is only ONE Savior: Hos 13:4
The Bible teaches there is only ONE King: Ez 37:23, Is 43:15, Zech 9:9
The Bible teaches there is only ONE HOLY ONE: Is 43:15

It did not take two or three to raise Jesus from the dead. It does not take two to create the world. It does not take two to have God in heaven and on the earth in human flesh as the Saviour at the same time. It does not take two to come, to judge, to reward, to rule, etc. It does not take TWO to make ONE HOLY ONE. It only takes ONE. God did it all by himself:

Isaiah 44:24
(24) Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself

Isaiah 43:15
(15) I am the LORD, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Hosea 13:4
(4) Yet I am the LORD thy God from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no god but me: for there is no saviour beside me.

Either Jesus was an impostor, a counterfeit, and a deceiver, because He (and the NT writers) attributed all these titles to JESUS, or He was the God of Isaiah and Hosea. Worship HIM! :bow:

How come nobody wants to touch this??? I guess it's too embarrassing.

 

[American Patriot]

House of Yahweh and JW's have TWO of everything:

TWO KINGS
TWO FATHERS
TWO SPIRITS (actually three counting the Holy Ghost)
TWO SAVIORS
TWO CREATORS
TWO COMING
TWO JUDGES
TWO REWARDERS
TWO FIRST AND LASTS
TWO BEGINNING AND ENDS
TWO G/gods
TWO Lords
TWO MAKERS
TWO LIFE-GIVERS
TWO HOLY ONES, yes, TWO HOLY *** ONES *** :biglaugh:
TWO THRONES
TWO SEATED ON THE THRONES
TWO MIGHTY GODS (Ps 50:1, Is 9:6)
TWO ALMIGHTIES (Col 2:10) FYI, I am COMPLETE IN JESUS, why do I need another?
TWO THAT RAISED JESUS FROM THE DEAD

This is polytheism, paganism, and anti-scriptural. :yes:

I am a true monotheist, I believe in ONE of all the above. I worship Jesus! :bow:

The Bible teaches there is ONLY ONE Creator: Is 44:24, 45:18
The Bible teaches there is only ONE Savior: Hos 13:4
The Bible teaches there is only ONE King: Ez 37:23, Is 43:15, Zech 9:9
The Bible teaches there is only ONE HOLY ONE: Is 43:15

It did not take two or three to raise Jesus from the dead. It does not take two to create the world. It does not take two to have God in heaven and on the earth in human flesh as the Saviour at the same time. It does not take two to come, to judge, to reward, to rule, etc. It does not take TWO to make ONE HOLY ONE. It only takes ONE. God did it all by himself:

Isaiah 44:24
(24) Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself

Isaiah 43:15
(15) I am the LORD, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Hosea 13:4
(4) Yet I am the LORD thy God from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no god but me: for there is no saviour beside me.

Either Jesus was an impostor, a counterfeit, and a deceiver, because He (and the NT writers) attributed all these titles to JESUS, or He was the God of Isaiah and Hosea. Worship HIM! :bow:

Great posts!:yes:

 

[Shermana]

1 Samuel 2:8

King James Bible
He raiseth up the poor out of the dust, and lifteth up the beggar from the dunghill, to set them among princes, and to make them inherit the throne of glory: for the pillars of the earth are the LORD'S, and he hath set the world upon them.

Isaiah 22:2

American Standard Version
And I will fasten him as a nail in a sure place; and he shall be for a throne of glory to his father's house.

This verse clearly says they will inherit the Throne of Glory. It doesn't have to be from the same book. it would help if you understood the term "Throne of Glory" to mean something that's not exclusive to one being but a concept in itself.

Nice of you to discuss dodging points, why did you repeatedly avoid the issue of the "Last Adam" like it was a grenade?

 

[ApostolicPeter]

This verse clearly says they will inherit the Throne of Glory. It doesn't have to be from the same book. it would help if you understood the term "Throne of Glory" to mean something that's not exclusive to one being but a concept in itself.

Nice of you to discuss dodging points, why did you repeatedly avoid the issue of the "Last Adam" like it was a grenade?

Do your research, I did address it. You missed it because you vanished from the forum while I was posting how certain organizations have two Holy Ones, two creators, two saviours, AND two FIRST AND LASTS, etc.

 

[American Patriot]

This verse clearly says they will inherit the Throne of Glory. It doesn't have to be from the same book. it would help if you understood the term "Throne of Glory" to mean something that's not exclusive to one being but a concept in itself.

Nice of you to discuss dodging points, why did you avoid the issue of the "Last Adam" like it was a grenade?

Its nice too see you didn't reply to any of my and Apostolicpeters post till you could try and pick apart one thing that you couldn't even do!Its also nice to see you not able to prove angels are gods which makes David monotheistic!

You said the ELDERS were sitting on thrones of GLORY!

 

[Shermana]

Its nice too see you didn't reply to any of my and Apostolicpeters post till you could try and pick apart one thing that you couldn't even do!Its also nice to see you not able to prove angels are gods which makes David monotheistic!

You said the ELDERS were sitting on thrones of GLORY!

I have no idea what you're trying to mean there, maybe someone else can explain how I didn't reply to ANY of your posts. Lying is a sin but I think you don't care because you probably believe that Pious fraud is allowable.

And actually, I did prove that angels are called gods, the text itself calls them "Elohim". Psalm 136:2, which you repeatedly ignore, says "Elohei Ha-elohim". God of the gods. Likewise, many translations use "Heavenly Beings" for "Elohim' such as in Psalm 82:1 and 6. What exactly is a "Heavenly being?" Just because you don't agree doesn't mean I didn't prove it. The false gods of the nations are false gods. I'm assuming you think the word "Angel" itself means a winged being, when the term itself means "Messenger". Heard of "Ev-angelos" ? It doesn't mean they are as powerful as the Elohei Ha-Elohim. I don't think you're even aware what the word "god" actually means, "Ayel" simply means "Mighty/Superior one". The concept of "having a god", means accepting a body as YOUR god. The context of the term changes when its referring to "one's god". In the possessive form, the meaning is a bit different and refers to an issue of loyalty.

You completely dodged the issue of 2 Cor 4:4 calling Satan "The god of this world".

I can repeat that each time if you want.

Yes, the thrones that the Elders were seated on were indeed "Thrones of Honor/glory". It helps if you understand what the term "Glory" and "Honor" mean. You can ignore all the verses I mention if you think that helps your case.

 

[American Patriot]

I have no idea what you're trying to mean there, maybe someone else can explain how I didn't reply to ANY of your posts. Lying is a sin but I think you don't care because you probably believe that Pious fraud is allowable.

And actually, I did prove that angels are called gods, the text itself calls them "Elohim". Psalm 136:2, which you repeatedly ignore, says "Elohei Ha-elohim". God of the gods. Likewise, many translations use "Heavenly Beings" for "Elohim' such as in Psalm 82:1 and 6. What exactly is a "Heavenly being?"

Yes, the thrones that the Elders were seated on were indeed "Thrones of Honor/glory". It helps if you understand what the term "Glory" and "Honor" mean. You can ignore all the verses I mention if you think that helps your case.

No it can mean heavenly beings. That is not what it means!

Psa_96:5 For all the gods of the nations are idols: but the LORD made the heavens.

Psa 97:7 Confounded be all they that serve graven images, that boast themselves of idols: worship him, all ye gods.

You haven't gave one verse that says the ELDERS were seated on thrones of GLORY!

 

[ApostolicPeter]

I have no idea what you're trying to mean there, maybe someone else can explain how I didn't reply to ANY of your posts. Lying is a sin but I think you don't care because you probably believe that Pious fraud is allowable.

And actually, I did prove that angels are called gods, the text itself calls them "Elohim". Psalm 136:2, which you repeatedly ignore, says "Elohei Ha-elohim". God of the gods. Likewise, many translations use "Heavenly Beings" for "Elohim' such as in Psalm 82:1 and 6. What exactly is a "Heavenly being?" Just because you don't agree doesn't mean I didn't prove it. The false gods of the nations are false gods. I'm assuming you think the word "Angel" itself means a winged being, when the term itself means "Messenger". Heard of "Ev-angelos" ? It doesn't mean they are as powerful as the Elohei Ha-Elohim. I don't think you're even aware what the word "god" actually means, "Ayel" simply means "Mighty/Superior one". The concept of "having a god", means accepting a body as YOUR god. The context of the term changes when its referring to "one's god". In the possessive form, the meaning is a bit different and refers to an issue of loyalty.

You completely dodged the issue of 2 Cor 4:4 calling Satan "The god of this world".

I can repeat that each time if you want.

Yes, the thrones that the Elders were seated on were indeed "Thrones of Honor/glory". It helps if you understand what the term "Glory" and "Honor" mean. You can ignore all the verses I mention if you think that helps your case.

Do read anything we post??? I've addressed this TWICE now. See post #3048 where I answer it and tell you I've already addressed it previously. Unbelievable.

But you sure did a great job of pretending my "twosies" post didn't exist. Of course considering your predicament, I understand.

 

[Shermana]

Just because you claim to have addressed it doesn't mean you reproved it.

Meanwhile you completely jumped the "Last Adam" question. Several times.

And again, Satan is in fact called "the god of this world", whether or not it says that the "gods of the nations are false", Satan is a "god", though an evil one, and his power is nothing compared to the Most High God's.

Another example, when the Witch of Endor summons Samuel's Soul, she claims to have seen a god. Clearly, the OT refers to actual spirit beings as "gods" while condemning idols as the "false gods" of (possessive, "of", a god is different than the "god of" gramatically) the nations.

I'd love to know your explanation of John 10:34.

 

[Shermana]

No it can mean heavenly beings. That is not what it means!

Psa_96:5 For all the gods of the nations are idols: but the LORD made the heavens.

Psa 97:7 Confounded be all they that serve graven images, that boast themselves of idols: worship him, all ye gods.

You haven't gave one verse that says the ELDERS were seated on thrones of GLORY!

"gods of the nations" is exactly the Possessive form of the word I was referring to.

There is a difference between the "Elohim" who are the "Heavenly beings" and the "gods of the nations" in the posessive form who are false gods.

And as proven, the concept of the "Thrones" is stated to be "Thrones of Glory", if you don't want to connect passages to get the whole meaning that's on you.