Did Jesus say he was God???

[1robin]

I have a question for the Christians if you are trying to use Isaiah to give ''prophecies'' about Jesus(p) can muslims also take verses out of Isaiah to show ''Prophecies'' about Mohammed(saws) and if not why not?

Why don't you go ahead and do so and we can discuss whether yours or the Christian interpretation is the most accurate and why?

 

[LioneDea]

What's false? It most certainly does say "young woman". It is rendered that way in many Christian bibles as well as the Jewish Tanakh. You ARE basing your translation and understanding on the KJV. The KJV DID translate the word to mean "virgin" from the Greek ("parthenos"). They didn't render it from Hebrew to English. And you certainly did not contest the rendering to ("young woman") the CJB listed. So what in all of that is false?

Lione D' ea: The false there was your understanding of the status of the young woman mention in Isaiah 7:14 because the woman in that passage did not tell it she had a husband and not virgin. Concerning of her status as being a young she is a virgin within the law of Moses, I not refute if it render in the passage in any versions of the Bible as young woman.

Nor does it tell us she is a virgin. Almah has less to do with actual virginity. If you were talking about (bethulah) then we'd have no argument because I'm sure both of us can agree that (bethulah) means virgin.

Lione D' ea: Where on that brother, the passage did not state as bethulah but doesn't mean to the fine reader she is not virgin there, the only state of that passage is the term of young whereas the woman before she conceiving is in the state of youth as natural virgin. How we testify in the Bible that the woman cannot considered as called young if she had intercourse nor had a husband in Genesis 2:23 and forward:

And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.

Lione D' ea: The woman mention in that verse is Eve which she was taken out of Adam. Why the Bible called her as woman in verse 24 it say's?

24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh. (King James Version)


Lione D' ea: In that particular time Eve was found as virgin, the verse did not state as well bethulah doesn't mean she is not virgin there, that is wrong to conclude. As for God a woman had a husband she may not considered in the Bible as young woman the same of the opposite, even she not intercourse in that the Bible called Eve as woman. The same status of young woman mention in Isaiah she is in the state of youth before she conceiving there is no involve a man around with her nor intercourse with her and it is impossible she is the wife of Isaiah because the verse did not term the young woman as woman that is my answer.

Eve is not really a good example. Scriptually speaking she was created. We have no idea how old she was. She could have been created as a teenager or created fully adult. Even so, Eve would still have been considered a (bethulah) at the time. If the reasoning is that she would have been an (almah) but then once she was considered Adams wife by "God" then she is just considered "woman" then your line of reasoning that (almah) has to do with virginity is null considering she and Adam never had relations until after being removed from the garden. If (almah) has to do with marriageable age then it would have less or virtually nothing to do with virginity.

Lione D' ea: Let us read Genesis 2:21-23 Read:

And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;

22 And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.

23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man. (King James Version)


Lione D' ea: The paragraph itself when God create the woman from the rib of man the man calls her a Woman not a young woman because she will be wife of the man. Why I state will be, because according in verse 23 "she shall be called Woman," therefore it is future to come for Adam not in God because in God both them already married, that is why God said in verse 24 it Read:

24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh. (King James Version)

Lione D' ea: As for God they are married for Him. So concern of considering the status of Eve in being woman which did not state as Bethulah let us read Genesis 2:24-25 Read:

Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.

25 And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed.


Lione D' ea: According in verse they are innocent in sexual intercourse, meaning not yet happening in their two. Eve was virgin in this time ,when she was get pregnant in Genesis 4:1 it say's:

And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the LORD.


Lione D' ea: If you notice the word knew in that passage, the passage tells us they had intercourse there. About in Almah you refer, you cannot say the word almah if she is not bethulah , so why in my statement the woman cannot considered in the Bible called as young woman if she had a husband nor intercourse with her. According in verse it say's:

And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.

24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.


Lione D' ea: This is the interpretation of the Bible once a woman had a husband nor intercourse with her, the Bible cannot considered call as young woman, because in Isaiah 7:14 which you implying in the context the young woman there had husband, it did not state there in term as woman...but a young woman which is in the state of youth with had natural purity before she conceiving. The word young there meaning "inexperienced" meaning she hadn't intercourse with someone, so then why Eve called there as woman if she hadn't also inexperienced, because Eve had husband there which known by the Bible because as for God they're both married already alike in Isaiah 7:14 it did not state there as woman which she had husband there already if she had but a term as young woman, doesn't mean it did not state bethulah she is not virgin there, the fact is bethulah did not state also to Eve doesn't mean she is not virgin, Eve is virgin after she was create and named by God as woman that is my answer.

Eve was a bethulah not an almah.

Lione D' ea: Eve was bethulah in that time when she was create by God, the fact is the term bethulah did not state to her doesn't mean she is not virgin there. The only Eve did not happened to her is the almah because the Bible called her as woman which she is had a husband there already.

I can because I maintain the context does not tell me she is.

Lione D' ea: She is what....in what particular aspect she is not virgin, is the term bethulah in her youth let us read Deuteronomy 22:20-21 Read:

But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel:

21Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you.


Lione D' ea: If she not found she is not virgin in her state of her young she will die in the Law of Moses...



...

 

[LioneDea]

I'm fine with that if that is what you believe. I don't. I have no problem agreeing to disagree.

Lione D' ea: I respect what is your opinion but when it comes to Bible, the opinion of the Bible will reject your allege there brother. Bible opinion will prevail.

You said she was "in a state of conceiving" and that's false. The verse says she's already pregnant which is why I said "You can't be "in a state of conceiving" and already "be with child." You can't be ready to become pregnant if you're already pregnant.

Lione D' ea: You can not say to her the word pregnant if she is not conceive there brother. Let us read Isaiah 7:14 it reads:

Therefore, the Lord, of His own, shall give you a sign; behold, the young woman is with child, and she shall bear a son, and she shall call his name Immanuel.


Lione D' ea: The passage telling us she was pregnant, she is in the middle of conceiving that is y answer.

Yes you can. "virginity" is (implied) but not known when using the word (almah). Check out how virginity is rendered in Genesis. The understanding is much different at Gen. 24:16 where (almah) doesn't even occur. The word there is (na'arah - damsel) and (bethulah - virgin). A concubine would have been an unmarried woman and in many cases in the bible a young woman/girl and certainly not a virgin.

Lione D' ea: Let us read Genesis 24:16 it say's:

Now the maiden was of very comely appearance, a virgin, and no man had been intimate with her, and she went down to the fountain, and she filled her pitcher and went up. (TCJB)

And the damsel was very fair to look upon, a virgin, neither had any man known her: and she went down to the well, and filled her pitcher, and came up. (King James Version)

Lione D' ea: You answer your own question brother, because according in that passage the maiden is a virgin. You can not say the word: (young woman, damsel, maiden) is not a virgin because if it was happened to her Deuteronomy 22:20-21 Read:

But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel:

21 Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you. (King James Version)

Lione D' ea: The young woman nor young etc. will die in the Law of Moses brother because she commit fornication, that is my answer.




...

 

[LioneDea]

But that's just it. Scriptually speaking I agree with this but you seem to contend that Isaiah delivered a message but in other places it was "God" speaking directly to Ahaz and I have shown that no theologian or biblical scholar agrees with this.

Lione D' ea: Ask them first who is that Lord spoke to Ahaz because according in the passage:

Moreover the LORD spake again unto Ahaz, saying,

 

[LioneDea]

Lione D' ea: The cited is very clear the question is who is that Lord ask them?


(end.)

 

[LioneDea]

I have a question for the Christians if you are trying to use Isaiah to give ''prophecies'' about Jesus(p) can muslims also take verses out of Isaiah to show ''Prophecies'' about Mohammed(saws) and if not why not?

Lione D' ea: Let me guess Isaiah 29:11-12 Read:

And the vision of all is become unto you as the words of a book that is sealed, which men deliver to one that is learned, saying, Read this, I pray thee: and he saith, I cannot; for it is sealed:

12 And the book is delivered to him that is not learned, saying, Read this, I pray thee: and he saith, I am not learned. (King James Version)


Lione D' ea: It is not Muhammad who referring the verse, because Muhammad can read what the vision says..meaning it is not him that is my answer.






(end.)

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Lione D' ea: The false there was your understanding of the status of the young woman mention in Isaiah 7:14 because the woman in that passage did not tell it she had a husband and not virgin.

The context did. See Isaiah 8:1-4. The son of Isaiah is important to the prophecy or else it wouldn't mention him.

Lione D' ea: Where on that brother, the passage did not state as bethulah but doesn't mean to the fine reader she is not virgin there

Yes it does unless you're prepare to tell Jews that "young woman" means "virgin". I'm sure you will agree that you won't get very far with that.

the only state of that passage is the term of young whereas the woman before she conceiving is in the state of youth as natural virgin.

This is false. (Bethulah) would be talking about and young girl or woman who's a natural virgin. Almah isn't. You can't find anywhere in the OT where (Almah) is used to mean virgin. It's only used 7 times in the Tanakh and ALL 7 have nothing to do with actual "virginity" including Isaiah 7:14.

How we testify in the Bible that the woman cannot considered as called young if she had intercourse nor had a


husband in Genesis 2:23 and forward:

And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.

Lione D' ea: The woman mention in that verse is Eve which she was taken out of Adam. Why the Bible called her as woman in verse 24 it say's?

24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh. (King James Version)


Lione D' ea: In that particular time Eve was found as virgin, the verse did not state as well bethulah doesn't mean she is not virgin there, that is wrong to conclude.

As I said before, using Even is not a good example. All it says is that she was created and that she was sanctioned by "God" as the wife of Adam. We don't know, scriptually, if she was created as a young girl, a teenager or fully adult. Even if we assume she is an adult we know that there is no mention of sex until after their expulsion from the garden. At best we can say she was a (bethulah) but under no circumstance can we say with certainty she was an (almah). It would help if you truly understood the difference.

Lione D' ea: The paragraph itself when God create the woman from the rib of man the man calls her a Woman not a young woman because she will be wife of the man. Why I state will be, because according in verse 23 "she shall be called Woman," therefore it is future to come for Adam not in God because in God both them already married

Then she was a (bethulah) like I said because (almah) under no circumstance would apply to her so it's a waste of time trying to user her as an example.

Lione D' ea: According in verse they are innocent in sexual intercourse, meaning not yet happening in their two. Eve was virgin in this time

Yes, a (bethulah) and not an (almah)

Lione D' ea: She is what....in what particular aspect she is not virgin, is the term bethulah in her youth let us read Deuteronomy 22:20-21 Read:

But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel:

21Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you.


Lione D' ea: If she not found she is not virgin in her state of her young she will die in the Law of Moses...

But here it's using (bethulah) and not (almah)

Lione D' ea: You can not say to her the word pregnant if she is not conceive there brother. Let us read Isaiah 7:14 it reads:

Therefore, the Lord, of His own, shall give you a sign; behold, the young woman is with child, and she shall bear a son, and she shall call his name Immanuel.


Lione D' ea: The passage telling us she was pregnant, she is in the middle of conceiving

A woman is either pregnant or not pregnant. There are no in between. "Is with child" means she is pregnant. "shall bare" means that she will give birth.

Lione D' ea: Let us read Genesis 24:16 it say's:

Now the maiden was of very comely appearance, a virgin, and no man had been intimate with her, and she went down to the fountain, and she filled her pitcher and went up. (TCJB)

No (almah) here though.

 

[LioneDea]

The context did. See Isaiah 8:1-4. The son of Isaiah is important to the prophecy or else it wouldn't mention him.

Lione D' ea: The let us prove if it was Isaiah who speaker here:

And the Lord said to me, "Take for yourself a large scroll, and write on it in common script, to hasten loot, speed the spoils.

2. And I will call to testify for Myself trustworthy witnesses, Uriah the priest and Zechariah the son of Jeberechiah."

3. And I was intimate with the prophetess, and she conceived, and she bore a son, and the Lord said to me, "Call his name Maher-shalal-hash-baz.


Lione D' ea: The passage did not state that it was Isaiah who speak here. How we prove it is not Isaiah, let us read in verse 5 it say's:

And the Lord continued to speak to me further, saying:

Lione D' ea: Who is this person which the Lord spoke to him again in Isaiah 7:10 Read?

And the Lord continued to speak to Ahaz, saying,


Lione D' ea: It was Ahaz who speak in chapter 8. To testify my statement when the Lord ordered Isaiah to give the report to Ahaz according in chapter 7:3 which inward inside of that message of the Lord saying:

So said the Lord God, 'Neither shall it succeed, nor shall it come to pass.

8. For the head of Aram is Damascus, and the head of Damascus is Rezin; and in another sixty-five years, Ephraim shall be broken, no longer to be a people.

9. And the head of Ehpraim is Samaria, and the head of Samaria is the son of Remaliah; if you do not believe, it is because you cannot be believed." (TCJB)

Lione D' ea: This is the message which Isaiah heard in the Lord to give this report to Ahaz whereas Ahaz declared in the house of Judah which is the message that:

And the Lord continued to speak to me further, saying:

6. "Since this people has rejected the waters of the Shiloah that flow gently, and rejoice in Rezin and the son of Remaliah,

7. Therefore, behold the Lord is bringing up on them the mighty and massive waters of the river-the king of Assyria and all his wealth, and it will overflow all its distributaries and go over all its banks.

8. And it will penetrate into Judah, overflowing as it passes through, up to the neck it will reach; and the tips of his wings will fill the breadth of your land, Immanuel.

9. Join together, O peoples, and be broken, hearken, all you of distant countries. Gird yourselves and be broken, gird yourselves and be broken.

10. Take counsel and it will be foiled; speak a word and it will not succeed, for God is with us. (TCJB)


Lione D' ea: Therefore it is not Isaiah who speak in Isaiah 8 because the Lord said to Isaiah: Now go out toward Ahaz, according in Isaiah 7:3. Wherefore it is not Isaiah who speak there in chapter 8:1 and also it is not the son of Isaiah mention in passage, and that Maher-shalal-hash-baz is not "Hezekia" that is my answer.

Yes it does unless you're prepare to tell Jews that "young woman" means "virgin". I'm sure you will agree that you won't get very far with that.

Lione D' ea: Let us read Isaiah 7:14 it say's:

Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel. (King James Version)

Lione D' ea: At least in this passage clear to you that even did not state in tanahk as virgin conclude already she is not virgin, you will get wrong there brother. The King James Version is good translation it state there virgin so the young woman is virgin.

This is false. (Bethulah) would be talking about and young girl or woman who's a natural virgin. Almah isn't. You can't find anywhere in the OT where (Almah) is used to mean virgin. It's only used 7 times in the Tanakh and ALL 7 have nothing to do with actual "virginity" including Isaiah 7:14.

Lione D' ea: False. How not to be called the young woman in the Bible is not a virgin which the term young is in between of childhood and adulthood meaning the young girl and young woman is in the nature of purity they are virgin, they are in the status of inexperience, how can you say the young woman known in Bible is not virgin let us read the fact why a young woman is a virgin in the Law, Deuteronomy 22:20-21 Read?

But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel:

21 Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you. (King James Version)


Lione D' ea: The young woman is committing fornication in the Law of Moses which give to Israel. And the young woman will die even all young women in Israel if you force implying the word young woman is not virgin that is my answer.

As I said before, using Even is not a good example. All it says is that she was created and that she was sanctioned by "God" as the wife of Adam. We don't know, scriptually, if she was created as a young girl, a teenager or fully adult. Even if we assume she is an adult we know that there is no mention of sex until after their expulsion from the garden. At best we can say she was a (bethulah) but under no circumstance can we say with certainty she was an (almah). It would help if you truly understood the difference.

Lione D' ea: Wrong brother, the fact is Eve is a virgin in that time after when she was create by God let us read again Genesis 2:22-25 it say's:

And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.

23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.

24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.

25 And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed.


Lione D' ea: In that time Eve is a virgin according in verse 25, they are innocent. Adam took Eve virginity at chapter 4:1 it say's:

And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the LORD.


Lione D' ea: At this time Eve is not virgin here according in this passage, because Adam knew his wife, the word knew there means sexual intercourse do you understand that brother I hope you understand the interpretation of the Bible.

Then she was a (bethulah) like I said because (almah) under no circumstance would apply to her so it's a waste of time trying to user her as an example.

Lione D' ea: Because they are married for God that is the interpretation of the Bible not only for example but for interpretation to understand, you cannot called a woman as young if she had husband there because in Isaiah 7:14 it was term there as young meaning the woman is in the state of youth she is independent freely. And you cannot say the word almah is not virgin because there is a Law which transgressed in God that is my answer.

Yes, a (bethulah) and not an (almah)

Lione D' ea: Your wrong in your thinking brother. You cannot say almah(young woman, damsel, maiden, woman, etc.) if she is not bethulah(virgin), and you cannot say the passage did not state almah because she did not reach this known in Bible you will considered her as not virgin that is wrong. The fact is Bible did not say Eve was young woman but woman because she had there a husband.

 

[LioneDea]

But here it's using (bethulah) and not (almah)

Lione D' ea: You cannot say the word Almah if she is not bethulah brother because there is Law which God give to Moses.

 

[LioneDea]

A woman is either pregnant or not pregnant. There are no in between. "Is with child" means she is pregnant. "shall bare" means that she will give birth.

Lione D' ea: Let us read Isaiah 7:14 it reads:

Therefore, the Lord, of His own, shall give you a sign; behold, the young woman is with child, and she shall bear a son, and she shall call his name Immanuel.

 

[LioneDea]

Lione D' ea: The word shall tell us "coming yet" brother.

No (almah) here though.

[/QUOTE]


Lione D' ea: Where did you read she is not virgin?



(end.)

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Lione D' ea: The let us prove if it was Isaiah who speaker here:
Lione D' ea: The passage did not state that it was Isaiah who speak here. How we prove it is not Isaiah, let us read in verse 5 it say's:

Lione D' ea: Who is this person which the Lord spoke to him again in Isaiah 7:10 Read?


Lione D' ea: It was Ahaz who speak in chapter 8. To testify my statement when the Lord ordered Isaiah to give the report to Ahaz according in chapter 7:3 which inward inside of that message of the Lord saying:

Lione D' ea: This is the message which Isaiah heard in the Lord to give this report to Ahaz whereas Ahaz declared in the house of Judah which is the message that:


Lione D' ea: Therefore it is not Isaiah who speak in Isaiah 8 because the Lord said to Isaiah: Now go out toward Ahaz, according in Isaiah 7:3. Wherefore it is not Isaiah who speak there in chapter 8:1 and also it is not the son of Isaiah mention in passage, and that Maher-shalal-hash-baz is not "Hezekia" that is my answer.

I'm not going to argue this with you any further. I'm going to simply state this because it is fact...NO Jewish or Christian theologian or scholar agrees with you. You can not find one that says "God" is talking directly to Ahaz. The reason why is because it's known from the context that Ahaz didn't believe in "God". He was a heathen. We know that 7:13-14 and 17 is Isaiah talking. "The Lord" is not speaking in the third person.

Lione D' ea: Let us read Isaiah 7:14 it say's:

Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel. (King James Version)

Lione D' ea: At least in this passage clear to you that even did not state in tanahk as virgin conclude already she is not virgin, you will get wrong there brother. The King James Version is good translation it state there virgin so the young woman is virgin.

The KJV is wrong and I've shown plenty of times why it is.

Lione D' ea: False. How not to be called the young woman in the Bible is not a virgin which the term young is in between of childhood and adulthood meaning the young girl and young woman is in the nature of purity they are virgin, they are in the status of inexperience, how can you say the young woman known in Bible is not virgin

(almah) appears only 7 times in the OT and none of them mean virgin in the sense that a young girl has never had sex. It can be implied by the use of the word but it's not strictly used to mean virginity. Every instance you've pointed to that actually focuses on the sexual purity of a young girl has referred to her as a (bethulah). You can't point to one of those 7 instances to say the young woman was regarded as a virgin. Your only hope is to hold onto the KJV as it rendered the word (parthenos) from the Greek into English. Out of all 7 in the OT the KJV uses (almah) at 7:14 to mean virgin but doesn't do so any other place.

Lione D' ea: Wrong brother, the fact is Eve is a virgin in that time after when she was create by God

I'm not disagreeing that she was. I agree that she was a (bethulah). That is virgin in the explicit sense. She didn't have sex with Adam until (after) their expulsion from the Garden. If you're holding to the notion that Eve was a "woman" and not a "young woman" then she wasn't an (almah). She was a (bethulah). So trying to use her to prove any point you're trying to make about the word (almah) doesn't work.

Lione D' ea: The word shall tell us "coming yet" brother.

I don't think you know what ("with child") really means. When it is laid out like that then the term means the woman IS (pregnant). When it says (shall) then this means that the woman is pregnant and the gender of the child is already known before the birth of the child....see (Gen. 16:11). In fact, as I can tell, every instance of (with child) in the OT meant the woman was already pregnant.

 

[Muffled]

I have a question for the Christians if you are trying to use Isaiah to give ''prophecies'' about Jesus(p) can muslims also take verses out of Isaiah to show ''Prophecies'' about Mohammed(saws) and if not why not?

I sthere any place in the Qu'ran that says that Mohammed was born to a virgin? THe problem is that Mohammed might be squeezed out of some generalities but he doesn'y fit any details.

 

[Muffled]

The question should be: since when Jesus is call "the son of God"? Was not after He came here to earth? Was not after Mary was conceived by the Holy Spirit?​

Of course; So, this not means that Jesus was created; but He came here in that way, even in a position lower than the angels! Jesus was both God and man while here on earth. As a man, he was the Son of God. He had added to Himself human nature (Col. 2:9). He became a man to die for the whole world.​

You’ll never find in the OT anything about Jesus been the “Son of God”

That is a misappropriation of that verse. God did not add anything to Himself. He is immutable. He added Himself to the body of Jesus.

 

[Muffled]

Why don't you go ahead and do so and we can discuss whether yours or the Christian interpretation is the most accurate and why?

Maybe He should start a new thread. This one is long enough as it is.

 

[IslamBox]

No. He never said that he is God because he was aware of the fact that he is a messenger of Almighty Allah who created him and send him to tell others that Allah is the only one and no one can be compared with him.

 

[jasonwill2]

Technically speaking Jesus claimed to be God... doesn't mean it's true.:angel2:

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Technically speaking Jesus claimed to be God...

Where?

 

[jasonwill2]

Where?

In one of the four gospels.

He said "I AM" when asked about it... which translated properly actually means "I AM GOD". cue they tried to stone him

that phrase "I am" is a reference to Exodus 3:14

" And God said to Moses, “I AM WHO I AM.” And He said, “Thus you shall say to the children of Israel, ‘I AM has sent me to you.’”

Knowing The Bible... Yahweh's name was never written in it so most likely if that god wasn't so picky it would read "I Am Yahweh" but his name is "too sacred" to write in the Bible for some reason, hence calling him Lord and God so much.



"Jesus answered them, "Is it not written in your Law, 'I have said you are gods'? If he called them 'gods,' to whom the word of God came—and the Scripture cannot be broken— what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, 'I am God's Son'?"

John 10:34-36

"Then the high priest stood up before them and asked Jesus, "Are you not going to answer? What is this testimony that these men are bringing against you?" But Jesus remained silent and gave no answer.
Again the high priest asked him, "Are you the Christ,[Messiah] the Son of the Blessed One?"

"I am," said Jesus. "And you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven."

Mark 14:60-62

He accepted this address by Thomas:

"A week later his disciples were in the house again, and Thomas was with them. Though the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them and said, "Peace be with you!" Then he said to Thomas, "Put your finger here; see my hands. Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and believe."

Thomas said to him, "My Lord and my God!"

Then Jesus told him, "Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed."

John 20:26-29

Both at His baptism and on the Mount of Transfiguration; the Father speaking from heaven declared Jesus to be his Beloved Son, to whom we should give heed.
He confirmed it again, by raising Him from the dead.

"Paul, a servant of Christ Jesus, called to be an apostle and set apart for the gospel of God— the gospel he promised beforehand through his prophets in the Holy Scriptures regarding his Son, who as to his human nature was a descendant of David, and who through the Spirit[a] of holiness was declared with power to be the Son of God by his resurrection from the dead: Jesus Christ our Lord."




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He clearly claimed as such, but it doesn't make it true. Also parts of this post are from a yahoo answers answer as I was lazy to explain all but the "I am" part it in my own words lol

 

[Shermana]

Sigh.

1. Once again, the name "I am" should be "I shall be as I shall be" in Exodus 3:14. This is how Jewish Septuagints rendered it before the Sinaiticus, Philo had it as "The one", the name "I am" seems to be a more Trinitarian adaption that arose from their quest to turn the OT in their favor.
2. Jesus never says that his name itself is "I am". Use of such in the grammar is a common Trinitarian abuse of context and grammar, don't fall into this same trap. Jesus was in no way referring to the Holy Name by merely saying "I am", he was making a statement in context that he was a divine being who had existed before Abraham. Don't be like Trinitarians who think anytime Jesus says "I am" that he can't just be saying "I am" like I would say "I am" in relation to a statement.
3. John 20:28, pretty much all after 20:12-18 appears to be interpolated and clashes with the endings of Luke and Matthew.

All this and more is covered like 20 times so far in the last 100 pages.