Disgruntled former SS teacher

[Just_me_Mike]

Truly I can not divulge a competent understanding to you, as mine is only an exploratory understanding and interest.

Sorry to mislead you, as I was simply suggesting that the quicker we get away from thinking about "jealous" as we think in modern times and dismiss the text (which I am not suggesting you did that) but clearly others use that word by itself to mock and make fun of...

When we look at a phrase like, "God not bearing any rival" it might simply suggest "bearing" means creating or birthing, and if that is the case, and God created everything, it seems to be a declaration that God created everything but never did God create anything his equal.

This explanation goes well with much of the Old Testament, where God warns over and over, don't treat anything like it is God.
Could be a simple a candid statement by God, that while somethings are glorious and reflect God's great ability to create, don't mistake the creation for the creator.

This is no way implies a childish immature jealousy we might usually equate with the word jealous, IMO.

So that is my unscholarly two cents, and I look forward to getting slammed by Jay! and learning more.

bump for Storm in case you missed this. I would like your comment on what I wrote.

 

[Storm]

bump for Storm in case you missed this. I would like your comment on what I wrote.

I don't really have one. Maybe your speculation is right, but we just don't know.

I have no more credentials than you, but I don't see how "separate from Creation" would be translated as "jealous."

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Is jealousy bad if you are jealous because your spouse cheated on you?

You must have done something wrong if your spouse is cheating on you. There's a good chance they're cheating because of your jealousy and insecurity.

 

[Storm]

I sent a PM to AE asking for his help.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

I don't really have one. Maybe your speculation is right, but we just don't know.

It is all speculation sweetie. :yes: Some better than others.

I have no more credentials than you, but I don't see how "separate from Creation" would be translated as "jealous."

You don't see how creatures seperating from the creator, and confusing other creations as possible creator could be interpreted as jealous?

 

[Just_me_Mike]

I sent a PM to AE asking for his help.

kewl...

 

[Storm]

It is all speculation sweetie. :yes: Some better than others.

You don't see how creatures seperating from the creator, and confusing other creations as possible creator could be interpreted as jealous?

I think it's a stretch.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

I think it's a stretch.

In what way?
Oh never mind,we'll wait for the qualified speculations...

 

[Storm]

In what way?

In that, if the original was that specific, condensing it to "jealous" was pretty crappy translation.

Oh never mind,we'll wait for the qualified speculations...

Agreed.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

In that, if the original was that specific, condensing it to "jealous" was pretty crappy translation.

So if what I am saying is right, you would prefer the bible to say instead of "I am a jealous God" to say "I am a God that created all things and do not want you to confuse the creator for the creation."

I am OK with jealous

 

[Storm]

So if what I am saying is right, you would prefer the bible to say instead of "I am a jealous God" to say "I am a God that created all things and do not want you to confuse the creator for the creation."

Something like that.

I am OK with jealous

Well, I'm unusually fussy about precise language. I don't even like being called a theist, and get really annoyed when people conflate pacifism and non-violence. The devil's in the details; precision is important.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

Something like that.


Well, I'm unusually fussy about precise language. I don't even like being called a theist, and get really annoyed when people conflate pacifism and non-violence. The devil's in the details; precision is important.

I guess I am looking at it logically. If in many, many other places God emphasizes the importance of worshiping Him and not the creation (gold, silver, people etc...) I am a bit confused on why this little word and my explanation seems so crappy
I could understand if we didn't have the original to examine, and I gave that explanation out of thin air.

I will be interested to see what other "details" AE can offer. Where's the bugger at?

 

[Storm]

I guess I am looking at it logically. If in many, many other places God emphasizes the importance of worshiping Him and not the creation (gold, silver, people etc...) I am a bit confused on why this little word and my explanation seems so crappy

Oh, I'm not saying that the God of the Bible doesn't make his stance on idolatry clear. I'm just saying, if the original text was condemning idolatry, translating it as "I'm jealous" was problematically imprecise.

I will be interested to see what other "details" AE can offer. Where's the bugger at?

He went offline.

 

[linwood]

He's jealous as in...it's upsetting when His creation places other things (could be anything, really) before Him. He expects undivided attention and affection.

So now the all powerful creator of the universe is insecure AND co-dependent?

 

[Just_me_Mike]

translating it as "I'm jealous"

Out of curiousity, what does it mean to you for God to say He is jealous? I want to understand the slight contention you have.
I mean surely you are not taking that one sentence out of context and forming a judgment, but in it's context what does it imply to you at face value?

 

[Just_me_Mike]

So now the all powerful creator of the universe is insecure AND co-dependent?

I differ from her take, and rather state, God simply declares if you walk off a cliff you fall and die.

Pretty straight forward. I created everything, so don't worship the creation. Nothing in secure about it.

 

[linwood]

I differ from her take, and rather state, God simply declares if you walk off a cliff you fall and die.

Pretty straight forward. I created everything, so don't worship the creation. Nothing in secure about it.

That sounds more worthy of worship for me.

 

[Man of Faith]

Here is a scenario where jealousy is a good thing. Let's say that my kids are spending an exorbiant amount of time next door. I come home and they are next door playing games, watching movies every day. Well I get jealous and I want to spend time with my own kids so I tell them I am going to play games and watch movies with them too. So they come home and we have a great time together spending time as a family.

 

[Storm]

Out of curiousity, what does it mean to you for God to say He is jealous? I want to understand the slight contention you have.

I mean surely you are not taking that one sentence out of context and forming a judgment, but in it's context what does it imply to you at face value?

Well as you know, I don't believe God said any such thing. Bearing that in mind is important to understanding my perspective.

Assuming accurate translation for the moment, I think the ancient Hebrews thought of their God as jealous because they were originally monolatrous. They recognized the existence of other Gods, but had a pact with the God of the Bible, who was possessive of their worship. IOW, THEIR God saw worship of other Gods as a betrayal.

Over the millennia, however, the theology of the Bible has changed from monolatry to monotheism. This changes the attribute of jealousy from the understandable expectation to honor a mutual pact to petty human failing.

 

[Autodidact]

Here is a scenario where jealousy is a good thing. Let's say that my kids are spending an exorbiant amount of time next door. I come home and they are next door playing games, watching movies every day. Well I get jealous and I want to spend time with my own kids so I tell them I am going to play games and watch movies with them too. So they come home and we have a great time together spending time as a family.

Of course, this bears no resemblance to YHWH, who smites your kids for acknowledging the existence of the family next door.