Do Christians really overly persecute homosexuals?

[Smoke]

I've been attacked personally simply because of my stance which some simply are unwilling to try to understand.

Everybody understands your point. You've made your point over and over again. There's no missing your point.

Today, in America, Christians, Muslims, Jews, Hindus, Blacks, Whites, straight, gay, whatever face persecution to a point. That is simply life.

That's simply a lie. Christians are persecuted in America? White people? Straight people? Do you really expect anybody to take this nonsense seriously?

 

[Kathryn]

Fallingblood - gays ARE discriminated against because of their sexuality. Not necessarily because of their LIFESTYLE, but simply because of their sexual orientation. I don't see how this can be justified in any way.

This discrimination is not only at the hands of some fundamentalist Christians, but aso other religious groups - and probably some UN religious groups as well. It's a societal prejudice which is prevalent in many groups - and it's a travesty of justice.

That's my two cents' worth, anyway.

 

[ChristineES]

How much persecution do you think would be appropriate?

I said earlier in a post that none of the services I attended ever openly attacked gays or anyone else. Sure, there are always people who hate others, but we are not all a party to that. I, for one, never hated anyone and I certainly never disliked someone for something as superficial as race, sexual orientation, etc.

 

[Smoke]

I said earlier in a post that none of the services I attended ever openly attacked gays or anyone else. Sure, there are always people who hate others, but we are not all a party to that. I, for one, never hated anyone and I certainly never disliked someone for something as superficial as race, sexual orientation, etc.

I don't think anybody ever said that all Christians were like that, and I'm pretty sure nobody has mistaken you for that kind of person. That doesn't change the fact that the vast majority of Christians belong to churches where homophobia is institutionalized and even made into a point of dogma.

 

[logician]

Uh, don't tell anyone, but women are also strongly discriminated against in the Christian church.

 

[ChristineES]

Uh, don't tell anyone, but women are also strongly discriminated against in the Christian church.

Yeah, some denominations are.

 

[fallingblood]

Everybody understands your point. You've made your point over and over again. There's no missing your point.

And yet you can insinuate that I believe all homosexuals are whining when they try to get equal rights? The two simply don't add up.

That's simply a lie. Christians are persecuted in America? White people? Straight people? Do you really expect anybody to take this nonsense seriously?

Yeah, that's because no one hates whites, straight, Christians, etc in America. I may over stepped by saying straights are persecuted against simply because they are straight, but I don't retract the others.

Whites are not a majority everywhere. My father-in-law is a perfect example of this. He grew up in a predominantly black community, making him the minority. For being white, he routinely received beatings, threats, taunts, etc. The white individuals in his community were persecuted to the point that the majority of them felt as if they were forced to move from their homes. That is just one example. Yes, it may not be very widespread, but it does happen.

Christians are often persecuted by other Christians. There are many denominations that are minorities. Mormons have a long history of being persecuted. Many churches do feel persecution because they are Christian churches. Now, they may be persecuted because they are preaching hate, intolerance, or the like, but they are still persecuted. Again yes, it may not be very widespread, but it does happen.

 

[fallingblood]

Fallingblood - gays ARE discriminated against because of their sexuality. Not necessarily because of their LIFESTYLE, but simply because of their sexual orientation. I don't see how this can be justified in any way.

This discrimination is not only at the hands of some fundamentalist Christians, but aso other religious groups - and probably some UN religious groups as well. It's a societal prejudice which is prevalent in many groups - and it's a travesty of justice.

That's my two cents' worth, anyway.

I agree completely with you. I don't think there is any justification for the discrimination homosexuals feel.

 

[IKNOWNUFFINK]

I keep hearing about how horrible Christians are for persecuting homosexuals. That Christians hate homosexuals, and that Christians view homosexuals as abominations. However, is that really the case?

I believe that it is only a minority of Christians who view homosexuals as abominations. I would admit that many do believe that homosexuality is a sin, but that is far from being an abomination.

Im a Christian. My best friend and the best man at my wedding is gay, as is my bother. My brother is the most homophobic person I have ever met in my life.

Outside of the bedroom we are all homosapiens folks and we are all judged by the same God in the same way. EQUALLY

IMHO The issue Homosexuals have is not with Christians its with the word of God.

Which is no different than any other atheist or agnostic. It's just great unifying copy for a christian bashing fest and all the world loves a good old chritsian bashing fest.

That said, it's a very ingenious marketing idea to pluck the colours of the rainbow out of the sky call it GAY, slap it on a flag and use it to roll discussions about homosexual sex acts into my living room via the TV nightly news.

 

[Autodidact]

My point that I was making is that some homosexuals blow the problem out of proportion. Such as, they equate their struggle with that in which blacks had a few decades ago. They attack Christians and make it seem as if all Christians are out there to get them. They act as if the whole world is against them, that Christians are all getting together just to see how horrible they can make their lives.

Why don't you wait for such a post, and then respond to it?

My point is that homosexuals are gaining a lot of rights. That the Christians persecuting them and trying to take their rights away are a minority, and are declining in power.

yay!

I know what persecution is. I have never equated what I've gone though with what others have. Sure, I don't know exactly what homosexuals have gone through, but I know fully well that not all Christians are out there attacking them and trying to steal away all of their rights.

Of course not, especially the Christian homosexuals, of which there are many.

 

[fallingblood]

Why don't you wait for such a post, and then respond to it?

This is actually somewhat of a response to a previous thread that was recently posted. It was in response to the thread titled "Why do Fundamentalists refuse to interpret the Bible any other way then what fits their bias?" In it, a member here basically stated that fundamentalist Christians are nothing more than hate mongering individuals who chose to persecute homosexuals because they have an agenda behind it. According to this member, part of their agenda is to turn the U.S. into a theocracy, and put down homosexuals.

I think that is blowing things grossly out of proportion. And that is what fueled this thread initially.

 

[Autodidact]

This is actually somewhat of a response to a previous thread that was recently posted. It was in response to the thread titled "Why do Fundamentalists refuse to interpret the Bible any other way then what fits their bias?" In it, a member here basically stated that fundamentalist Christians are nothing more than hate mongering individuals who chose to persecute homosexuals because they have an agenda behind it. According to this member, part of their agenda is to turn the U.S. into a theocracy, and put down homosexuals.

I think that is blowing things grossly out of proportion. And that is what fueled this thread initially.

Assuming you are reporting that thread accurately, that's quite different from, some homosexuals blow the problem out of proportion. Such as, they equate their struggle with that in which blacks had a few decades ago. They attack Christians and make it seem as if all Christians are out there to get them. They act as if the whole world is against them, that Christians are all getting together just to see how horrible they can make their lives, isn't it?

 

[Smoke]

Uh, don't tell anyone, but women are also strongly discriminated against in the Christian church.

My main issue with the church was its attitude toward what I usually call peace and justice issues. While the Greek Orthodox Church is not monolithically Republican like some churches, it still leaves a lot to be desired in its attitude toward women and gay people, and I got really tired of being told in so many words that a Christian must oppose abortion, support the Republicans, support war, etc.

Of course there are Protestant churches that aren't so blatantly sexist, heterosexist, and politically conservative, but I don't like the religious aspects of those churches -- their theologically, liturgy, iconography (if any), etc.

 

[Jeremiah]

Are not you doing exactly what you are criticizing homosexuals for doing. Maybe if you are sick of hearing it, you should stop your whining and just ignore us. Just accept the fact that this is part of life, because sweetheart we are not going anywhere, and we are not shutting up.

 

[fallingblood]

What I stated was that being considered a sinner is no big deal. It can be annoying or frustrating to be called, over and over again, a sinner, but it is part of life. According to Christians, all have sinned, and thus are sinners.

I have never said that the persecution of homosexuals is no big deal. You took my words out of context, and misrepresented what I stated. I'm not saying you did this on purpose, but that is what happened.

 

[Jeremiah]

What I stated was that being considered a sinner is no big deal. It can be annoying or frustrating to be called, over and over again, a sinner, but it is part of life. According to Christians, all have sinned, and thus are sinners.

I have never said that the persecution of homosexuals is no big deal. You took my words out of context, and misrepresented what I stated. I'm not saying you did this on purpose, but that is what happened.

Pardon my mistake, I will edit my post.

 

[Jeremiah]

Although, I still like to see you address the rest of my post. Because you still seem very much a hypocrite.

 

[fallingblood]

Are not you doing exactly what you are criticizing homosexuals for doing. Maybe if you are sick of hearing it, you should stop your whining and just ignore us. Just accept the fact that this is part of life, because sweetheart we are not going anywhere, and we are not shutting up.

I have no problem with homosexuals in general. I would never advocate for the majority of homosexuals to just shut up and be gone. And I have no problem with homosexuals seeking their equal rights, or for standing up for what they believe in. The majority of homosexuals, in my opinion, do not whine about these issues or make things seem more than they really are.

I'm speaking about a specific group, who in my opinion, has blown things grossly out of proportion. I'm talking about a group who show the same hatred and prejudice against Christians as they claim Christians are showing them. I'm talking about a group who believes the world is out to get them, and that somehow, their struggle is more than it really is (I am not downplaying the struggle the homosexuals have had to face, and still do. I'm simply stating that they are not the most persecuted people who have lived, which I think most people would agree with. That is not to justify what is happening to homosexuals by stating others have had it worse).

I personally think that homosexuals should be glad that they didn't have to face what blacks did a few decades ago, what women had to face a few decades ago, simply because now they don't have such a long way to climb to gain the same equality. What I mean is that the U.S. has a long history of persecuting groups, and those groups rising up and gaining their equality. Each group is able to stand on the shoulders of the previous groups. New problems are faced with each group, because they are discriminated against in some different ways. But they do gain from the previous groups as well.

And one of the problems that I personally think is harming the homosexual community are the individuals who are making the problem into something it is not. They may be a minority within the minority, but I believe they are harming the cause much more than they are helping. For instance, to demonize all of Christianity, or even a substantial branch is doing nothing more than making people angry, and making those people less willing to help. This is not to say that Christianity, at least sects of it, shouldn't be criticized for their intolerant beliefs, because they should. However, it should be done in a way that opens up discussion, instead of blocking any hope that an understanding may occur.

 

[justbehappy]

I keep hearing about how horrible Christians are for persecuting homosexuals. That Christians hate homosexuals, and that Christians view homosexuals as abominations. However, is that really the case?

I believe that it is only a minority of Christians who view homosexuals as abominations. I would admit that many do believe that homosexuality is a sin, but that is far from being an abomination.

It's that they focus on homosexuality so much more than things like premarital sex for instance, which is MUCH more prevalent. I think I've read only 4% of people are openly gay, but 9 out of 10 people have had sex before marriage. And there's so many other things as well. But, it just seems there's more focus than their should be. I would say I'm lucky to be in a long-term relationship with a guy because my parents would never talk to me again if I wanted to marry a girl. But they know I'm sexually active outside of marriage and they could absolutely care less. They lived together before they were married as well.

 

[MacKinnon]

I have no problem with homosexuals in general. I would never advocate for the majority of homosexuals to just shut up and be gone. And I have no problem with homosexuals seeking their equal rights, or for standing up for what they believe in. The majority of homosexuals, in my opinion, do not whine about these issues or make things seem more than they really are.

You really don't seem to understand that when someone is persecuted, they should be able to complain about it as much as they like. There is no possible way to 'make things seem more than they really are' in the case of persecution.

I'm speaking about a specific group, who in my opinion, has blown things grossly out of proportion. I'm talking about a group who show the same hatred and prejudice against Christians as they claim Christians are showing them. I'm talking about a group who believes the world is out to get them, and that somehow, their struggle is more than it really is (I am not downplaying the struggle the homosexuals have had to face, and still do.

But you are. For the simple reason that you talk as if you think you can measure the level of abuse homosexuals experience now and have in the past, and then somehow compare that with abuse experienced by others. I asked before just exactly how anybody could conceivably measure this, and you didn't respond.

I'm simply stating that they are not the most persecuted people who have lived, which I think most people would agree with. That is not to justify what is happening to homosexuals by stating others have had it worse).

Again, how could you possibly know this without having measured it? You can't possibly measure it because you cannot know the details of every individual case of persecution of the past, let alone what is happening now or how those individuals feel, or what they experience on a day to day basis.